+ 11 Aromasin dosed EOD/E2D/E3D
Being the big fan of aromasin that I am and getting sick of crashing my e2 by trying to run letro as my ai of choice on blasts I’ve been doing a little more research into it and I stumbled across some interesting information.
To start aromasin is kind on lipids, lowers SHGB, increases IGF-1 and doesn’t cause rebound like it’s friend Adex. All good stuff!
Now we’ve all read that aromasin’s half life is 9 hours which makes us believe that we would have to dose twice a day for stable blood levels. However aromasin is a suicidal aromatase inhibitor and when it enters the blood it binds to aromatase enzymes and destroys them (hence why it’s called suicidal). This means there’s a big reduction in your oestrogen levels for up to 72 hours after a single 25mg dose. Oestrogen levels only start to raise again when the body starts making new aromatase enzymes which were previously destroyed by aromasin according to this study which looks at the pharmacokinetics of Aromasin in men:
https://academic.oup.com/jcem/article/88/12/5951/2661508
A quote taken from it:
Maximal suppression of estradiol (62 ± 14%) was observed 12 h after a single 25-mg dose of exemestane. Estradiol remained suppressed by 58 ± 21% at 24 h and returned to baseline 3–6 d after treatment
In English I translated this as you can take aromasin EOD, E2D or even E3D and still maintain comfortable levels of oestrogen.
It also states that aromasin increases total testosterone in natural males by 60% after 10 days. But even cooler than that it increased free testosterone by 100%. Something to consider when going onto PCT with some HCG in the mix.
Thanks for reading.
- Bookmark
- 11
- 0
Awesome info.....for someone that has always preferred Aro for my AI, it never ceases to amaze me what one little half a pill can do.
I’ve had some banging nights on half a pill before!
Thanks bro
Nice!
Im a high aromatiser so i take it more regularly (have to) when on higher test cycles
If i am using a trt level of dose on cycle, one pill with a shot can be enough
Interesting notes on its impact on test too
Plus 2
I’m the same mate, 500 test per week and I’m dosing 6.25 every morning.
Good work mate. Couldn’t agree more and aligns 100% with my real world experience + 2
Thanks bro, aromasin is definitely the king of ai’s for many of us
PcushionI agree with Dacky this indeed goes hand in hand with my real world experience. I have had wonderful success with aromasin 25mg 2x a week.
Is there a specific property of Aromasin that stops it from crashing e2? Like does it lose effectiveness when aromatase gets low? If not, how exactly does it not crash e2 when compared to any other ai?
Great post bro +2
I know certain folks say it can’t crash your estro and some say it can.
Fact is, it can and I’ve seen the bloodwork that’s proved this. I like the info it’s a good starting point for someone interested in trying aro over adex for the stated benefits.
No matter ed eod e3d only way to tell if the user is dosing correctly is bloodwork.
Thanks for the post
I couldn’t remember if aro ever crashed my e2, I was leaning no. Then I went through all my bloods (both posted and not posted) and it did.
Wham-o
https://www.eroids.com/sites/default/files/gearpic/85855/ParaAro%20Sis%2...
Bro I referenced those bloods below lol cheers
Lol oh shit how’d I miss that?
I mean it’s your bloodwork so you own copyright on it lol
Unless everyone thinks anything under 10 is crashed which is not how it works.
I give up. I guess every scientific article I ever read is bullshit.
Thank's for making my decision easier man, appreciate it!
Don’t get upset snowflake. Through discussions like these we have the opportunity to learn.
Through scientific data we have the opportunity to learn cupcake.
Scientific data, anecdotal experiences, hell even hear say gives us the opportunity to further our knowledge base. No need to let ego get in the way.
We all let ego get in the way. The biggest problem we face is that to truly get a better understanding of what is happening we need an initial blood test, blood test during, then a blood test before an ai, then one 7 days after. If we look at drphillys test we see be has only about 1500 total test, but what was his estro before starting the aro? The body plays a balance game and for all we know he was very low to begin with. Look at gizmoducks bloods, he was taken I believe 12.5 Ed and his estro was balanced. Too many variables to consider and also considering the scientific tests were controlled and they were normal males not on trt or any other drugs during the tests.
What we need is more testing, more data, and more proof. Noone here is a doctor so we all try and find a better way to do what we do and we either succeed or fail.
I tell you what I do know. I known that I feel pretty shit when my estro is below 15 and below 10 is below the bottom of the range and in my view “crashed”. I can do this really easily taking 25mg of aro ED split running pretty high levels of test. So I don’t know mate I’ve read the same studies you have but I know what happens with me in the real world.
Its alright, I took real scientific facts and posted them. Then I parroted those facts but it is what it is.
I try to help and that's all I could have done. Now I'm just going to sit on the sidelines and watch from now on.
And I never said I’m a doctor. All I did was share my real world experience backed by bloods. We’ve always been cool. Don’t be a cunt.
I used a blanket statement saying WE all want to be doctors. if I was referring to you I would have literally called you out. I'm not shy you know that
Fair enough. Still love you, sweetie. Hearts! Lmao no homo
Haha the love is mutual. No homo.
High 40s if I remember correctly. I can dig them up tho to be sure. I get bloods about once a month, dude. Every 8 weeks if no dosages have changed and I feel good. I don’t take things for no reason. Historically on a cruise with test in the 1400s, if I have no AI my e2 is mid 50s. A minuscule 3.125mg a few times a week keeps me in the mid-20s.
I get where you’re coming from, but I’m the wrong guy to use as an example saying we don’t know what it was before or after. I always know what things are before i do anything, then I go get bloods 4 weeks later to make sure I handled it right if I feel good, or get them sooner if something feels off for a few days. All my shit is well documented. And the lady’s at labcorp literally know me by name. Shit I know one of their kids birthdays.
That said, I’m the vast minority.
We didn't know what it was because you posted only the after and not the before.
Also fair. Stop being logical.
Lol I’m just saying it has crashed mine and I have bloods to prove it. I don’t know how low it was cus it was <5. But I know I feel like shit when it’s <5 with no energy or libido, and as it gets over 10 I start feeling better, and I feel best in the high 20s.
I don’t call <10 crashed. I call <5 crashed
We’re all different man. I just know that’s how it works with me. ~8-42 is normal range, but all that means is some person may feel fine at 8, doesn’t mean everyone does, and it doesn’t mean they’d feel optimal either. We all react different.
Just don’t tell me you never saw bloods with crashed e2 when I’ve posted 3. 1 while using aro.
Damn, how did you get your e2 up after it went so low? Apparently it takes much longer to get back up after you crash it with aromasin compared to adex or letro. You must of felt like death.
Bout 5-7 days. Thanks to TNE
My stomach was cool I was just tired. It was like I had narcolepsy. Especially on the train. Also Drank a lot of coffee before training lol
AST normal range is 0-40. Doesn’t mean the doc isn’t gonna tell you he’d like to see it come down if it’s at 38-39. Almost everyone would.
Thanks for the contribution bro, blood work is long around here. Nothing worse than low oestrogen!
Can you post a link to those with crashed estrogen? Because normal levels of E2 in a man's body lowest point is 10pg/ml. 10 is normal no matter who you are according to science.
Estrone Estradiol
Prepubescent male
Undetectable–16 pg/ml Undetectable–13 pg/ml
Pubescent male
Undetectable–60 pg/ml Undetectable–40 pg/ml
Adult male
10–60 pg/ml 10–40 pg/ml
https://www.eroids.com/sites/default/files/gearpic/85855/ParaAro%20Sis%2...
I saw a few more on another board as well, I think it’s a person to person science experiment so there’s no “it can’t be dones” because weird shit happens everyday...
Also, I read your write up on aro very informative. Nothing is guaranteed to work the same on all just not possible. Then throw in a few more compounds, age, bf%, etc... just too many variables to have one study be the end all clear cut approach
You are absolutely correct. Each person being different taken into count. Aromasin is a fuck all ai that needs bloods but it is magic when dosed correctly based on that.
I have to agree, I used aro exclusively during pct for rebound coming off adex for most cycles, this cycle I’m trying aro throughout and I’m enjoying it, playing with dosing now but have bloods coming soon so will stay on same dose for another week to see if I have it where I want, then no more guessing but I do feel good
What’s your dosing protocol for using aro to combat rebound from adex?
Cycle dependent bro. On a 600mg test cycle I’d run adex .5-1mg on pin days then the 16 days between last pin and start of pct I run adex first week .25mg twice that week, no ai the following week, then 12.5 aro 2 weeks eod then 6.25 eod last two
Recovery has always been good .... well aside from one pct which was due to underdosed items.
RustyhookerBiggest issue with aro is knowing your on cycle e2 conversions. I like aro and its my go to but folks not testing bloods will have issues.
Low or crashing e2 of course halts gains. We need e2 for many healthy functions. Since it is suicidal it can be simply too strong for some folks. Crash and then need to bump npp, dbol etc to get e2 back up.
But again, thats why we preach bloods. Find the ai as/if needed and your personal approach.
Im also the stick in the mud so to speak in that if you need letro as an ai....go find better cycles or stop all together. Coronary hardening and disease is not a good future
Well said
Very informative post! Great information and helpful for most of us +
Thanks mate
Ah jeez, I feel responsible for starting this mess by bringing up Aromasin when the guy was just asking about Anastrozole and letrozole lol.
But man, this is why I love this place. No where else could you find a group of guys so passionate about researching this topic to find the safest and most effective way to run the compounds we do. IrishMack and GrowMore, keep up the good work both of you. You are both assets to the community and inspire newer guys like me to become more knowledgeable about the world of AAS.
I’ll be honest mate I didn’t see that post. I’ve been focusing more on aromasin/ai’s in general as that more than anything can dictate how you feel.
It does not mean you can take it eod or e3d. you take it every day, that was a 10 day study with doses taken every single day. if you take it every 3 days you are on a roller coaster.
Please read the entire article,
As the level of suppression of circulating estrogens was comparable between doses, we elected to use 25 mg for the subsequent PK study. In all individuals, the highest concentrations of exemestane were observed in the first blood sample drawn 1 h after oral administration, indicating rapid absorption of the drug. Plasma concentration vs. time profiles in all subjects were characterized by a biexponential decline in exemestane (Fig. 2), with terminal half-life of 8.9 h. The other PK parameters are listed in Table 3. The mean maximal plasma concentration of the metabolite 17-hydroexemestane was 1.16 ± 0.36 ng/ml, a concentration achieved 1 h after the exemestane dose. These levels rapidly declined, and concentrations below the lower limit of sensitivity (0.1 ng/ml) were observed at a median time of 12 h (range, 4–24 h).
it returned to baseline after 3 days... That means if you were at 60nl of e2 you are back at that level. If you are on cycle and take the drug every other day or every 3 days you are roller coastering your hormones.
Another excerpt from the same article you posted:
In the present study maximal suppression of estradiol of 62% was observed 12 h after exemestane administration and returned to baseline 3–6 d after administration. The reason for this difference is not clear, but may be related to the shorter half-life of exemestane in males, the lower exposure to exemestane, and the higher levels of the aromatase substrates androstenedione (∼1 ng/ml in young males vs. ∼0.5 ng/ml in postmenopausal women), particularly the much higher testosterone concentrations in young males than in postmenopausal women (∼700 ng/dl vs. ∼20 ng/dl, respectively) (25). This is supported by the observation that in the 10-d study in young males reported here, the suppression of estradiol is weaker (due to the very high levels of the precursor testosterone) than that of estrone (due to androstenedione levels not very different from those in postmenopausal women). A limited suppression of circulating estradiol (∼50%) has been reported in a similar study in young males treated with 1 mg daily anastrozole (7), a dose that reduces estradiol by 85% in postmenopausal women (23).
As you can see clearly, males react differently to aromasin, women it takes 8-11 days to go back to the level you started with, men it takes 3 days.
Once again, only bloodwork will tell what youre e2 was before cycle, what it is during, and what it is after. Aromasin needs to be monitored by bloodwork.
3-6 days levels returned to base line if you read what you quoted, so for some E3D would be sufficient depending on the person according to bloods. Slight fluctuations effect people differently and as always is person dependant how this effects you.
Hey Mack, I just had an idea, maybe you can help steer me in the right direction with it.
So I’ve been looking into the body’s production of Aromatase, and found this “Aromatase expression in adipose tissue and possibly the skin primarily accounts for the extraglandular (peripheral) formation of estrogen and increases as a function of body weight and advancing age” (1). So now given that fat tissue is the biggest extraglandular source of Aromatase, it would make sense to me that the production of it would be much higher in someone with a great deal of fat and much lower in someone with a much lower level of fat. So, then given that Aromasin is suicidal, would it take longer for someone with very low body fat to build up their aromatase levels when compared to someone of average or high body fat? Could this have a significant impact?
(1) https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/11511861/
That's a very good question. Since the studies do not reflect if the young males were overweight or not it may be safe to assume metabolism of any drug is affected by bodyfat. Its why they say cycling at a higher bodyfat is a bad idea since your e2 levels are higher than normal. In that same idea, we also see some members here with low bmi who have massive levels of test on a low dose and then you have another who takes double that and has lower. Its more than likely based off genetics or even the cardiovascular system considering hormones are in your bloodstream, and your kidneys. There may be another study based on obesity and/or high bodyfat. Now you got me invested damn you.
If it turns out that the adipose tissue expression of aromatase does play a significant role in maintaining adequate aromatase and thus e2 while taking Aromasin, then what I’m thinking is that those with low body fat would need to take an even lower dose of Aromasin to maintain similar levels to someone of normal bf. It would take some experiments, but I wonder if taking low dose aro (like 1mg twice per day) would work for those who have issues crashing on it.
Crashing is irrelevant. Men's E2 level limits are surprisingly low as it is. I searched high and low for any blood work, case studies, or articles of anyone crashing their E2. Maybe if someone who had no business at all taking an ai and had a minimum level of estrodial to begin with naturally took it then I personally think you cannot reduce to zero. Remember anyone that tells you they crashed their levels because they felt like shit or lazy no libido etc should have a blood test to back it up, I never see it. They only complain about the drugs side effects and blame it on crashing. Studies were done as you saw as high as 80mg a day with not a single patient dropping below healthy levels.