loose ends/questions with deca
okay so im working on expanding my knowledge, and ive got some questions i cant seem to find a definite answer to. ive read in several places about how versatile deca is and that it can be used in both cutting AND/OR bulking cycles, but i just read a post where someone whose opinion i value highly said that EQ would be for cutting whereas deca would be for bulking (in so many words). im sure that the dosage ran is huge in determining what results you want from it, and i know that when i do run it i'd like to go for SOMEWHAT lean gains - basically i wanna keep muscle definition and seperation rather than just pack on mass. my question is this though - would 300 mgs test e 2x a week stacked with 300 mgs of deca fit this goal? if not what kind of results could i expect from the stack ran at these doses while using aromasin to keep estro (water weight!) in check? one more thing, with B6 being known to lower prolactin levels, what sort of dosing is the most effective for doing so? 200mgs 3x a day seems to be the consensus, but was just kinda hopin for some clarity.
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What is your cycle history? As for your goals I would run NPP rather then deca the sides are way less and water retention is minimal. But you must pin eod or every third day at the least to keep plasma levels even.
couple things, when you say sides, how is it possible that the long estered version has so many more than the short ester? i understand the water retention factor, but with a short ester isnt the main benefit when concerning sides that if you begin experiencing ones you cant handle then you can stop and it will clear your system WAY quicker than the deconate ester? i know thats the deal with tren, does the same hold true for deca? if not, how so? cycle history is test e 500mg week for 12 weeks, 35 mgs daily of dbol kicker for 5 weeks, and 2 week prop taper. this time i want to do it right though and slowly start to introduce new compounds rather than 3 at once. im not set on this for my next cycle or anything, but definitly leaning towards it with 4 week prop kicker/2 week taper
You get less sides from shorter esters because it passes through your body quicker. The longer esters have a chance to play around inside your body longer. If you want some quality lean gains try tbol instead of a prop kicker 6 weeks of tbol at 50mg/d with the right diet can yield 10-15 lbs of quality muscle gains. So try this
Week 1-12 500mg/ test e
Week 1-6 50 mg/d Tbol
Then 2 week taper and pct.
SwolePatrole7B6 is not to be taken over a 100 mg per day, google that, and im running eq as a bulker cuz i dont want to run a 19-nor
i can absolutely understand not being to thrilled at the idea of running a 19-nor because im right there with ya but i feel its safe to assume that at a modest dose of 300mgs a week, you wouldnt experience as hard of a shut down and gain far more weight than EQ. plus its EXPENSIVE to run with only minimal lean gains, hardness, and vascularity as results. not hatin tho, i have every intention of running w/in next couple years. ive never heard of anyone running EQ with any hopes or intentions of bulking unless their main reasoning is for the appetite stimulation. never ran it personally tho so i cant really speak on anything but secondhand experience aka what ive read from others who have run it
oh and one last thing, are progesterone, estrogen, and prolactin related at all and if so, how? where im going with this is by keeping estro and progesterone in check can you prevent prolactin buildup or is it a seperate thing?
Yes they are all related. Estrogen can convert to prolactin and prolactin can convert to estrogen too I believe.
Bottom line you can NOT get away with running deca without prami or caber. If you cannot afford it then don't run deca
I run deca every year and never need caber or any AI for that matter. It's a good idea to keep these compounds on hand if side affects do come on but you can't generalize and say you must run prami or caber, AI 's can give people worse sides then they get from AAS so AI should only be taken if need be. Everybody is different.. This is the second time I had to correct you this week you are young and need to do a lot more research before giving advice.
I understand you think I'm not "knowledgeable" or "as experienced" as you because I am younger than you, but I am pretty sure I have done enough research. Hormones are an interesting subject, so I read a lot about them especially because I'm an aas user.
AI should be taken if need be??? Let me guess you take it when your nipples start getting itchy? Well that's not smart.
Testosterone converts to estrogen IN EVERYONE. There is no such thing as some people not prone to estrogen. Everyone should take an AI to help keep estrogen from getting too high - even if they are not gyno prone...
I am aware some ai's can give sides to people. That's part of the game. If you cant handle sides such as acne or bloating or low libido (whatever sides you are talking about) then you shouldn't be using testosterone or at least a lower dose since it will convert to estrogen GUARANTEED. Not taking an ai because you aren't gyno prone is a horrible excuse. High estrogen can lead to prostate issues, increased bloating which means higher BP which is unhealthy. Many other problems than gyno as a result from estrogen which is why it should always be taken on cycle.
Also if ai's give you trouble such as aromasin try adex. In most cases the other will have less side effects. Many people report having tons of sides with one ai and none or little with the other. Like you said everyone is different, but aromasin and arimidex are very different drugs. The chances of someone having the same bad sides from both are slim unless they are taking too large or small of doses of each. In which case the AI is not what's causing the sides, it's their management of estrogen and having too high or too low or roller coaster levels of estrogen.
As for caber, that's good, you are one of the few and lucky. However, have you had bloods done to show your prolactin and estrogen levels are in the normal range?
Your words "Bottom line you can NOT get away with running deca without prami or caber" Your words to me"You are on of the few and lucky". STOP GENERALIZING! You are just repeating what you have read or heard, whether it is true or not, you lack experience and that is were your advice is flawed. As for me:Bloods are done constantly, as for everyone should use an AI, it's all about the dosage of what you are taking and what type of AAS. Everyone knows to much estrogen is bad but some is good and if that INDIVIDUAL"S estrogen levels are acceptable then NO they don't need an AI. AS for you doing so much research on hormones then you should of all people know that doing steroids at your age is a really bad idea. So for someone who is so knowledgeable as you say you are running cycles makes you more foolish than knowledgeable. Not to mention your picture on your home page for someone that is cycling is not impressive at all. Any time you want to debate me bring it, I have been training longer than you have been on this Earth and the last thing we need around is another kid who thinks he knows it all.
I'll stop "repeating what I read" but yes you are correct 100%. As for my pic that was over a year ago before I ran my cycle. I'm happy you are criticizing my old pics - that just motivates me to show my improvement, and for that I thank you.
I'm not quite sure why your against my intentions - which was to have ai and caber set in place, I thought that's what we were here to do on eroids. Inform people how to use proper ancillaries and to use to prevent gyno, high BP from too much estrogen or other related issues. Not fix them after it's too late. I believe prevention is better than treatment. But hey you are the experienced one.
It's important to have AI on hand AND use as need be. We are playing with hormones and the more you try to manipulate them the more damage you are doing. Just don't generalize because to the right person your advice (no matter how good your intentions are) can do more harm than good.
Different. U can't keep prolactin levels in check by keeping estro at bay. You need different ancillaries for each.