+ 18 Purity, Potency, and Assay
There is a lot of confusion that surrounds the lab reports concerning Purity, Potency and once in a while you'll get a source that throws the word assay out there. Trying to clear up some confusion here I did a little bit of searching around and came up with some information and noted where I got it from. Lets take a look at a few definitions first:
What is the difference between potency and purity in drug products?
A quick definition would be:
-Potency is a measure of drug activity expressed in terms of the amount required to produce an effect of given intensity.
-Purity is a measure of the amount of API present in a sample compared to those of related substances, impurities, residual solvents, etc.
http://kb.mtc-usa.com/article/AA-01279/0/What-is-the-difference-between-...
What is the difference between "assay" and "purity" regarding pharmaceutical analysis?
Accoring to the "WikiAnswers" website, an "assay" method provides an experimentally determined value for the content or potency of an analyte in a sample. In contrast, a "purity" methods provides an accurate quantitative statement of all impurities in a pharmaceutical sample.
http://kb.mtc-usa.com/article/AA-01095/0/
and finally I found a decent news article that helps to outline the difference. Most notable is the last paragraph.
How many times have you read scary stories in the press about addictive drugs of unprecedented purity? How often in movies has the villain been the one to cook up an incredibly pure drug? “Pure” in these cases is used as a shorthand for powerful and dangerous, but that isn’t what it means.
Purity is a measure of how much of some substance is “what it says on the tin”. Potency in contrast refers to the dose necessary for a substance to exert its effect on the body. Ivory Snow Soap, famously, is 99.4% pure. But its potency when ingested is far less than that of 1% pure heroin.
This ends up mattering more than one might think in drug policy debates. Policymakers and parents get scared when they hear that an addictive drug is pure. But a pure drug can be safer than an impure drug if the potency of the latter exceeds the potency of the former. Even within the confines of the same potent drug, purity can increase safety if the impurities are nasty things such as levamisole or strychnine.
One concrete area where this misunderstanding is influential and sometimes exploited for effect concerns methamphetamine. A prescription requirement for the pseudoephedrine-containing cold medicines that are used to make meth would virtually wipe out domestic meth labs. Opponents of this policy sometimes try to scare people by saying that the result would be an influx of “much purer” methamphetamine made without pseudoephedrine (PSE) in Mexican superlabs (PSE imports are banned in Mexico). Yes, that form of methamphetamine is purer, but it’s much less potent and hence less dangerous than methamphetamine made from PSE, even before you count up the burn injuries, explosions and fires that small-scale domestic meth labs cause.
http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/ten-miles-square/2013/09/purity_vs_pote...
Purity is expressed in a percentage and is a measurement of the analyte divided by everything else in the sample. It indicates quality; whereas Potency (or more often called concentration) is an expression of quantity. Lets look at an example like we're explaining it to a 3rd grader
A bottle of water is 100% pure water. If you mix it with dirt you will get mud and the mixture is no longer 100% water, yet 100% pure water still exists but is mixed in with dirt and we cannot separate them as easily as we added them together. At this point we bring in the mass spec and it can easily distinguish between water and dirt and will look at just the water and indicate that it is, truly, 100% pure water and is called the analyte. Then it will look at our mud as a whole and tell us what the overall purity of the mud.
Notice that nowhere in that example there was the need for a measurement? No ounces or pounds or kilos or grams.....just percentages
Potency/Concentration is the quantity of the product. This is where the grams and kilos and ounces and pounds come in. It functions completely independent of the purity and tells you how much of a product occurs in the test. In order to know how much good stuff is present they both have to be taken into consideration.
Both potency and purity determine the efficacy(how well it works) of the AAS.
Now there can be two ways that you can get screwed here when buying AAS, Low purity or low concentration. One is out of the brewers hands and one they control exclusively. If they put in a gram of powder (quantity) but it is only 50% pure (quality) then only half a gram of the good stuff is going to be in that vial and that is typically out of their control. On the flip side of that coin if they only put in half a gram (quantity) and it is 100% pure (quality) the same is true and it is only half a gram is going to be in that vial but that is exclusively in their control.
So knowing that ^^^^^^^^^^ we can look at some other potential scenarios and numbers.
If the purity of a sample is 80%(quality) and the concentration is 100mg/ml(quantity) then the amount of good stuff is 80mg/ml
If the purity of the sample is 50%(quality) and the concentration is 100mg/ml(quantity) then the amount of good stuff is 50mg/ml
If the purity of the sample is 20%(quality) and the concentration is 100mg/ml(quantity) then the amount of good stuff is 20mg/ml
If the purity of the sample is 80%(quality) and the concentration is 50mg/ml(quantity) then the amount of good stuff is 40mg/ml
If the purity of the sample is 50%(quality) and the concentration is 20mg/ml(quantity) then the amount of good stuff is 10mg/ml
Having the above knowledge and knowing the purity of the raw material a brewer can adjust the quantity of the raw material to compensate for the quality. So, if for instance they know that their raw material is 75% pure and they want to make 100mg/ml of ACTIVE INGREDIENT then they will need to put extra raw material in their concoction to the tune of 1.3 grams per vial instead of 1 gram but remember there is still 1.3g of material in there so .3 of it is ineffective. Putting too much powder may cause it to fall out of suspension since oil can only hold so much weight regardless of the type of weight.
People often ask me what the raw material is cut with and the answer there is typically nothing that it is cut with, occasionally we will find where they have mixed in other powders of the same color that are cheaper. This is often the case with high value raws. Too often what is seen is sloppy manufacturing and too much byproduct that makes up the crystalline structure of the compound. Crystalline structure is like a brick wall of sorts, it takes the bricks surrounding it to give it strength even if they are of different colors. A melting test can be used to some degree to determine what a substance is but if those bricks are put together with things that do not belong and they are not all identical then the crystalline structure folds easier thus the substance melts at a lower temperature. Its similar to building a steel roof on aluminum walls.
perhaps I digressed but it is another example of how purity affects the makeup of a compound and ultimately shapes its attributes.
If anyone has anything else they'd like to add I will put it in here. Thank you for reading through this and let me know if I need to clarify anything.
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Hi angus, am trying to friend you so I can send you a pm to see if you can help me out with some test on some gear. I do live in the uk but happy to discuss further.
Keep up the good work
Thanks for taking the time to explain the process and results. +1
Great post Angus, +2
Nice!
Wow, I skim read that and I understood a good portion of it. Need to seriously read this weekend. Great info man!
So as an end-user if a test result shows that the quantity of the desired product is present then I would be injecting the correct (stated) dosage? And it would be "good" product regarding it's effect on my body?
Then purity would only be important to know how much "non steroid, unknown material" I was injecting?
For example a 200 mg/ ml product that actually has 200 mg/ ml of steroid in it, then it will work as expected. If the raw supplier cut it to 85% purity my only concern would be what he cut it with as long as the brewer increased the amount of raw by 15+%?
Also is it safe to assume that most impurities come from less well controlled manufacturing processes while making the raws are relatively innocuous to inject?
And finally is it practical to get a lab analysis that identifies what the impurities are?
Thanks a million for your contribution to this community. You will help take the whole supply chain to a safer, more reliable level!
angusThat question is about quantity. A brewer may use a cup of powder and that would make the dosage correct. (random measurement). So yes the dosage that is injected would be correct.
Yes that is also correct. If the brewer used a cup of powder to make the brew and it was only 85% pure then there is a question of what was the other 15% cause we know it wasn't hormone.
most of them, yes.
It is not practical. For every peak we would need to isolate it and make another run to identify its chemical structure and from there we would need to feed it into a database of known structures. Very time consuming.
You are welcome sir.
Is there any way to have numbers set aside for certain peaks (metals) that would quickly raise a red flag if detected. I don't mind having some inactive hormone or certain fillers present but the thought of heavy metals scares me a bit. We all know where the raws are coming from and everything I read about heavy metal contamination traces back to that country...
AnonNvm sent PM instead
FR sent
angusReplied.
AnonI love you fucker. Yeah I said it. Biyaaaatch:)
angusI'm not scared.....not until you get that look in your eyes....then i'm a bit nervous. LOL.
I get what u was throwing out but that board was heated at the time so I stayed out of it. Kinda scary if u think bout that
RustyhookerI stated similar and erased it too. You're correct....
AnonGlad I'm not the only one
angusI can't tell you how many times I've done the same. :-)
RustyhookerIm sure you shake the head often...
AnonThanks Angus! Great thread for the community. I'm certainly better off now for having read it! +1
Give them a vote if you find it helpful.
PermalinkWow great post sticky all the way and btw Angus I wrote my assay the other day been along time since I seen him
x2 should def be a sticky
awesome post hope this becomes a sticky
My brain hurts a bit but I think I get it. Thanks Angus. +2
angusThink of aspirin, you'll be fine :-)
your brain hurts every time you think lol
Basically....:)
;)
Thanks this is great for the community. People should def read this. that way there questions ar eanswered before they even look at a mass spec +2
Professor angus will there be a quiz on this material?
+1 for a good read.
angusThe quiz is when you make that decision on putting something in your body. It is definitely not multiple choice, lol.
Rustyhookerhttp://www.eroids.com/forum/steroids-qa/anabolic-steroids/the-true-drip....
100% PURE TEST PROP is 80Mg because ester.
So, crappy test of 50% purity May still be at 100Mg BUT "the good stuff" is really 40Mg/100 useable. 40Mg eod as example is why folks are forced to monster cycles. Twice the oil for the same effect our "old day" stacks had at under 500/week.
angusYou are absolutely correct. I do miss the old days but then again don't all us old farts?
RustyhookerTrue true! Just have to keep up with test reports and adjust accordingly.
And no wonder I was running higher than usual test with my primo, remember our convos?
RustyhookerYessir. Draws us back into bloods and reactions. Listening to body and still make our goals.
And then again, no wonder I can run monster levels of tren lol. And I probably shouldn't and don't recommend it...I just don't get the wicked sides
RustyhookerNot barking AT you because you have great skills. Just pointing towards your statement as a learning curve for newbs..newbs. Glad you pointed it out!
Folks get used to low strength/purity gear you'll naturally add a bump. Then you'll get a hold of some high quality and dance with the devil.
Like Angus points out that a super pure product can be safer because its working at lower doses. Look at homeys that od. Got hold of super pure and flop.
Oh my...NO NO NO please don't take that as a green light noobies. Not what I meant at all. I have many years of tinkering with my body and know myself, I get bloods constantly and heal myself homeopathically with diet, vitamins, minerals and herbs...gear too...BUT I have been doing this homeopathic stuff since my teenage years. Steroids came later later cuz I needed to heal myself from sports injuries in all honesty
Remember our conversation in PM about why dosages NEED to be massive when running UGL........... I said to you folks have to because most of it is fkn junk and only fit for the fkn bin!
I stand by my words........... PERIOD.
Also... im the type of person thats trusts no one!........ test your own gear if you want to see results with your own eyes instead of running with the pack!
To conclude ..... even the shittiest gear has SOME hormone in it!........ clever BBs learn how much to pin to see an anabolic response............. thank fuck UGL is cheap as chips if we end up having to use 5/6 bottles a week instead of 5/6 ampoules of PHARMA REAL DEAL GEAR.
So if you ever see me print anywhere that i am running 4/5Gs of test............ you now know the answer
angusThat is the scary part, sometimes it is not what it says it is. So it may, in fact contain hormone, but is it the right one? Here is an example:
http://www.eroids.com/pics/3-amigos-mass-spec-results-84-tren-ace
This lab was selling this as a 3 hormone blend and it only had one in it. Something like that can really mess a guy up. I do; however like your method of testing.....you know.....spaniel ear? I have dreams about that shit, lol.
Oh and happy birthday.
LOL..... Yeah that spaniels ear is far better to look at than a cold robotic mass spec tower........... unbelievable how you remembered that bro :)... very impressed by your memory function......... we should start a testing lab with a row of gynaecology stirrups and a few female volunteers hahaha
Yep! Look at some of the shit in wedinos, it stopped me right in my tracks! I was thinking man do you ever have to trust your source and labs more than ever. And of course much much thanks to ppl like you Angus
So I guess that's why this proviron I am on should be bumped to 100mg/day then ;-)
Lol..big boner poppin time
Agree 10000% about testing gear. Amazed how many of us are adamant about running blood tests after the fact, but don't bother getting gear tested before starting a cycle.
It only costs a few dollars more than a female panel.
Just think how much our SRCs would have to step up their game if even some of us started testing regularly, or even randomly.
I'm not as eager to try to solve the problem by using only pharma grade because there are so many counterfeits of pharma products out there. So I will be testing everything I get.
RustyhookerI got spoiled on pharma. You're right as rain boss. I'm definitly glad too that i went back to old school style.
Nice post Angus, always dumbing things down for me!
Thanks Angus , Nice write up!!
Thanks Angus. Finally something I can understand... I think.