Disadvantages of too much test, too many compounds, etc. for Early cycles
So assuming an individual is in great shape, diet, rest, workout, etc. on point. That they are old enough to consider use of AAS, etc. What are the pitfalls of taking too much (quantity) of their first or early cycles? I understand that an individual will not know how the compounds react to their individual body, all people are different. I also understand that they may not have the same residual knowledge of proper use/PCT etc. Beyond this, what are some of the other risks or disadvantages? Greater chance of TRT for life? Burning out androgen receptors, making future cycles less effective? I'm looking for knowledge from those that know more than I do. I have a basic understanding, but not a mastery of working knowledge of AAS and am always in a quest to learn more.
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Speaking from only Personal Experience ,IMHO..My best results(which you learn from personal experience)I've had much better results w/ a longer moderate dose cycle vs a 8-10 wk(short IMO) cycle of a higher mg/dose...And the best advice I WISH someone would have given me when I first had my go around LONG ago...is start low/slow...Same w/ anything pharmaceutical...you can always add more later,but once you have its too late to take it away...Everything in moderation isn't being a #ussy,its just smart living.This is YOUR body,It's the only one you get...nothing is worth screwing that up
Also getting your hands on a few vials,knowing its not enough to finish your "planned" cycle,of determined length,and just blasting away,..If your last minute order falls through or you turn up empty handed mid cycle,you'd have been better off not starting at all...now your levels are all jacked up and sides are headed your way fast(gyno,hairloss,acne,BP,>lipids,etc)The entire point of being well over 25 yrs old before getting into gear is you DON'T wanna shut your natural test production down for the rest of your life do you?!And if you answered yes to that question just hang it up now,this kinda lifestyle isn't for you...Just lift big weights,eat 1.5-2g/lb protein daily,rest, and KEEP AT IT...it takes years to get big & HEALTHY...no way around it...Which you should have been doing for years to reach your natural plateau before even thinking about adding gear into your mix...
I personally think most guys would do fantastic on just 200 test cyp per week for their first cycle.
Too late to go back now, I went with standard suggestions of 500/wk Test E for 10 weeks, then weeks 12-16 40/40/20/20 nolva.
this is acceptable for 1sr cycle to
agreed. diet makes it or breaks it regardless if its a first timer on 200mg or a vet running 2g anyways. doses dont matter nearly as much as diet does.
heres the secret buddy. the reason behind not using high amounts for first run has NOTHING to do with us parroting a "pace yourself" mentality. at least in my stance. the reason is because using AAS UPREGULATES androgen receptors!!!! yes, you read that right. this desensitizing receptor BS is just that, BS. the longer one uses AAS the more their receptors can uptake and utilize. now, transfer that over to someone who has never used AAS before. your bodys receptors simply cannot handle huge global amounts of AAS. your virgin receptors can only uptake so much. thats why you get loads of sides in the beginning if you take too much. all that hormone that cant be uptaken by your clogged receptors are free to roam about your body wreaking havoc. its not that more experienced users HAVE to take higher doses to achieve results. its that their bodys can actually utilize all the hormones being injected efficiently.
personally i think 500mg/week of test is too much for a first run. i dont run that high of test unless i was using gh aswell but i prefer higher androgens and anabolics and keep test low. my body prefers that. but i wouldnt learn that without paying my dues and experimenting with test standalone. but id say 350-400mg/week of test is plenty for a first timer.
Been off the forums for a bit and almost wrote this exact response. Excellent post sir not many know this +1
Great answer. +1 thank you so much for this. I knew the basics but I am always thirsty for knowledge and I couldn't find this answer anywhere. Props.
no problem brotha. there is a study proving receptor upregulation through continued AAS use just dont have it saved to reference atm. if taking huge amounts in the beginning yielded more results i would advocate it but its simply not true. happy gaining!
More isn't always better. Your body can only build so fast, that using everything under the sun. GH/IGF/Gear and more. You can add an immense amount of gear and get the same (or close to )what you would get off of half of it. You get diminishing returns at certain points, each person is different. Some people can run low doses of teen and get strong, grainy, and hard. Another person may need a little more to achieve this.
The pitfall---- YOU'RE WAISTING MONEY, YOU'RE RISKING HEALTH MORE THEN NECESSARY, IF YOU GET SIDE EFFECTS YOU DONT KNOW HOW TO TREAT THEM
No I don't see you being at greater risk of life long TRT. Not at all. Shut down is shut down. Doesn't matter what substance you choose to shut yourself down with, you're still shut down.
Great answer. Prob hit all the main points. Body chemistry is different for everyone and you need to slowly tweak what works and doesn't work. Make sure to log everything during cycle so you can make adjustments accordingly.
Perfect. You hit all the bases for me.
It's just not necessary, a virgim steroid user can gain 20lbs of actual muscle on a first cycle with just 300-500mgs of test. Adding deca,EQ,teen etc is not gonna make you gain 40lbs of muscle, maybe 25 instead of 20 but at the cost of more side effects, harsh hpta shutdown, alot more money.
You slowly up doses as you get bigger and bigger and at a much slower rate then the majority of people on internet forums progress with their cycles. Most internet steroid users are running 2 grams of gear by their 2nd year running gear. You can bene fit from the same doses cycle after cycle. I been running the same bulk for years 750mgsof test and 500mgs of nandrolone amd I'm starting to think my test dose is to high and I'm gonna start experimenting with low doses of test 250mgs or so. But I've ran those same doses countless times and it never fails me, I feel no need to add a few hundred milligrams every new cycle, just more protein and smarter training
Even the suggested begginer cycle 500mgs ew is not necessary, with a good diet and training routine one can make big gains on 250-300mgs of test.
i mentioned the dosage of 250 to 300 a week of cyp of enanthate on another forum and basically said the same thing and dudes tore me up saying you wouldnt even hit baseline numbers... this is why i love eroids got smart dudes here!
There's a lot at stake. Just start with Blood pressure. Which compounds impact bp the most? Make sure you have a home bp machine. You'll learn over time which compounds impact you the worst.
Next as you dig deeper into what is causing your elevated BP you'll learn about red blood cells and the measure "Hematocrit". What types of AAS are notorious for elevating RBCs. Which compounds when stacked together really impact you negatively. This search will lead you to regular blood donation.
This next one is huge and so overlooked it's ridiculous. Liver health is something that most newer or younger users always overlook. Orals will raise your toxicity like nothing else. It can really do serious damage to your body if you overlook this aspect. People throw around stacks containing multiple orals in a single cycle either staggered or for the hardcore they'll run them concurrently. Never do this unless your liver support stack is second to none and you are actively competing in bodybuilding or other comparable sport. No expense spared with liver health.
One of the other most important things you need to be aware of is your lipid profiles. Learn about long term exposure to AAS and really crack hard on the diet. Make sure that the foods you eat do not compound the negative effects of AAS to your lipids. Also certain AIs impact your lipids negatively to a certain degree. Individually these things might not be life impacting but when you combine everything you must consider the heavy burden we are subjecting our bodies to.
This is just a little bit of info you should look into, I haven't even talked about DHT, prostate health or MPB. Also look up what a proper PCT is and steroid half live math and the common misconceptions of when to start a PCT. Prop tapers and how they'll be more precise for your PCTs. Seriously there's still more I could lay out there...
Spectacular. I would upvote this if I could. You gave me lots of good stuff to google and read. +10 points to you, bro.
Many, many serious problems can arise from prolonged usage of excess Tesosterone. Different forms of cancer from prostate to testicular is possible. Heart Attacks from elevated BP levels. Google it, there's lot of answers.
I did google, and I failed to find the answers I am looking for. Rather than length or duration of cycle, I'm asking why it would be unadvised for a beginner to use an advanced cycle besides the obvious of they are a beginner.
Advanced cycles usually involve multiple compounds. Advanced users are likely to have tried each of these compounds individually, so they know how their body will react to each one. If you throw together multiple compounds you've never used before. and begin to experience side effects, you may not be able to tell which compound is giving you the problem, and thusly how to solve it.
So we roll back to users not knowing how individual compounds will react with their own genetics and body chemistry, it would seem like. In short, advanced users are just that - advanced, and all the residual knowledge that comes with experience?
increased chance of growing a nice set of tits and going bald. Plus a bunch of others.
http://www.livestrong.com/article/251769-risks-of-high-testosterone-leve...
More is not better
Fun fact, I'll be 41 soon and have used gear since I was too young to use it, yet still have never gone over 500mg test in one week. If it's legit, you dont need a lot to grow.
100% agree with you on this. I usually keep my test at 375 on cycle and make great gains.
Thank you for your firsthand experiences. I appreciate you giving me insight that less can sometimes be more.
I understand aromatization and how not knowing how your body will react to increased estrogen without having cycled many times before. Losing of hair was one I had not thought of pertaining to increased intake quantities of AAS, however I know it to be a negative side effect of AAS usage. Thanks for the reply and the link. I feel what was listed was mostly just possible sides from AAS use, and obviously more compounds in the body will magnify the risks or side effects. I'm looking to garner information and you provided me with some, but I'm not quite sure that was the specific answer I was looking for. To rephrase, why would it be more appropriate for an individual that has used AAS more to be able to better tolerate or would it be less unadvised to intake higher quantities of said substances?
Let me us a different analogy so you can understand.
Its your 1st time drinking alcohol, your friend gives you a shot of vodka and a gallon of vodka, do you take the gallon and drink it? You do if your an idiot right? You judge your tolerances based off of small or regular amounts. Anything in this world can be abused. Start small and see how things go, for all you know you are prone to heart disease, bad blood circulation, gyno, prostate problems, etc and starting out balls to the wall will accelerate any underlying issues you have. Drink the fkn shot and save the gallon for when you are ready.
Gallon please!
RustyhookerThis asshole named Fast48 used to post.... "Why grab the Jack when beer gets the job done?"
Lol
Perfect.
Perfect analogy
That is basically the best answer you can give lmao my first time taking tren I did it at 200mg a week I start new compounds low it might cost me more but in the long run it keeps me knowing and safe