bmon1's picture
bmon1
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+ 24 AI users (Arimidex) Not Enough Estrogen in Men is bad too........

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I had posted on Itching and followed up by saying i figured it out it was from low estrogen and had kept on researching only to find more symptoms and even lifetime problems with low estrogen in men.

If your having weird symptoms and your on arimidex or an AI It could you could be taking too much as in my case. I took it for bloating and experienced side effects in only 3 days. Yes i was taking too much which i know now and want to make sure others do not make the same mistake i did. AI's can be very powerful very quickly for men as we get most our estrogen from the conversion of test, so if your taking an AI to block that conversion our Estradiol plumets and can also become way too low. Keep in mind levels of anything too far out of range can be problematic.

MY MAIN POINT IS I WANT IT LOW JUST NOT TOO LOW.

Through a few other articles and forums i have found that symptoms are,

    Night sweats
    For me Personally....Insomnia, Very little libido, ITCHING and Major Pimples especially on my face and i never break out.
    and you need estrogen, some, to also build muscle.

Main list from........ http://www.tandurust.com/endocrine-system/low-estrogen-side-effects.html

"Low estrogen side effects in men"

    Increased risk for fractures, most commonly hip fractures.
    Body temperature changes.
    Decreased sexual libido
    Skin irritations
    Vocal changes
    Weight gain
    Gonad size changes
    Body odor changes

    Another source showed that low estrogen can even cause adrenal glands to weaken and lowers serotonin in the brain!!

    "http://voices.yahoo.com/the-dangers-low-estrogen-men-10578027.html"

    Joint Cracking or Soreness
    Lack of libido - but powerful erections in the case of sufficient DHT levels.
    Heart pump changes, fluttering sensation due to lower blood pressure.
    Skin changes; hyperpigmentation or pale-looking skin.
    Hair follicle inflammation - excessive hair growth.
    Fatigue and depression.
    Anxiety / Obsessions
    Blunted emotion.
    Lack of trust for others; jealousy.

    (Since estrogen helps increase serotonin in the brain, low levels cause may cause you to become impulsive, irritable, depressed or even manic
    Low estrogen levels also can lead to the weakening of your adrenal glands, and this can even cause certain forms of depression.)

For those doing HRT for life extension...

Quotes are taken from the source....

http://www.lef.org/magazine/mag2010/may2010_Why-Estrogen-Balance-is-Crit...

"The dramatic increase in mortality in men with unbalanced estrogen (i.e., estradiol levels either too high or too low) is nothing short of astounding. It uncovers a gaping hole in conventional cardiology practice that is easily correctable."

Here is a list of some of the symptoms of high E2 (you don't have to
experience all of the symptoms to know that you have high E2):
* Depression
* Trouble reaching an orgasm
* No erections while sleeping (i.e. "night wood" or "morning wood")
* Anxiety
* Panic Attacks
* Prostate problems
* Gynecomastia
* Water Retention
* Dizziness/Vertigo
* Increased Blood Pressure
* Decreased Libido
* ED
* When penis is limp, it doesn't hang low (it seems to try to crawl back up)
* Asthma like issues (due to increased water retention around the lungs)
* Trouble sleeping at night - waking up multiple times per night
* Lack of Libido
* Crying while watching TV shows/movies
* Easier to get angry (think PMS)
* Insulin Resistance (getting tired after eating a meal - if left untreated, it can lead to Type II Diabetes)
* Larger stomach
* Redness on the face and/or chest
* Feeling hotter than everybody else
* Thinner skin/bleeding easier

Danlaroy's picture

My e is really high but I feel fine and have none of those side effects other than feeling hot a lot of the time. I think some people do better than others with high estrogen.

GGWanda415's picture

The symptoms for high and low E feel very similar I don't think there is no way to feel it you got to get regular blood work done.

333's picture

Bumperoony

Calrizzian's picture

Bump

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uglyfox's picture

Of course you don't want to get too low unless you want to get injured and have a dead dick

kibby's picture

Bump for good reading

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Ronburgundy's picture

I may be in the minority, but I prefer my estrogen to be on the low end. However, by hovering on the low end of things, it is easy for me to go too low. The things that stand out for me are extreme tiredness, very dry hair...almost brittle like, and my facial skin looks pale and dry. On a side note, I once took nolvadex for like 4 weeks straight and experienced erection problems...like the hottest chick in the world couldn't make my shit grow. I googled it and couldn't find anyone else who reported these symptoms, so if you are running nolva for an extended time and your having trouble getting it up, drop the nolva. My symptom resolved after a few days. That was the worst feeling ever.

TheRoyalPalm's picture

Ive had the same thing happen, and it only took two days of dosing nolva and I was limp as a shrimp. Im going to try clomid only this time around, and probably proviron or anastrazole

SlowBro's picture

good post. everyone worries about high estrogen because of the dreaded gyno. but having crashed estrogen is a very unpleasant state to be in as well. estrogen being too low can be counter productive to hypertrophy as well as fat lass too.

only time you need to crash estrogen is 2 weeks before a show. other wise somewhere in the normal range is always ideal.

only way to really determine where you estrogen is at is have bloods done Smile

staglione44's picture

Yeah I took it to get rid of the gyno bloat. Took too much and never really lost the bloat. Also, the body odor change was evident. Insane body odor in my left armpit, not the right. I didn't know what the hell it was and then I googled "aromasin overdose" and that symptom came up. I stopped it and 3 days later the odor went away.

numbere's picture

Or you could just spend the $70 on a sensitive e2 assay and not play and guessing games based on physical symptoms.

rodmangus's picture

Thanks for the info brother. I'm reading everything in sight while preparing for my first cycle. This is a huge help and I'll refer to this later.
Appreciate for putting this out there.

freedom1981's picture

i had some of these sideseffect , i always use Adex eod , but this time even with npp and adrol felt more joints pain with heavy weight , so i made 0,25 every 3 days its 0,5 the whaale week and i felt better , next time i will get aro, thank you for the information

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Whitetrash's picture

Good info, I've had some of those sides. I used adex on cycle for e2 control but I didn't incorporate aro into my pct. The estrogen rebound was bad. I didn't know what it was at the time. It was my first cycle. Anxiety so bad I struggled to leave the house, combined with hot flashes that made me feel like I was about to burst into flames! Thankfully I was taking nolva or I'd probably have developed gyno. I'll be using aro at 12.5/12.5/6.25/6.25 in pct in the future.

steroider123's picture

bump

steroider123's picture

I am on 4th week of my 1st cycle of test e + deca.
From last thirsday i started feeling sides like testical pain, after two days start high blood pressure and today i m feeling pain in my right nipple. I discontinue every thing since last thirsday when i started testical pain. My blood pressure was 172/90 today's morning. I consulted a Dr he gave me some medicine i feeling lil bit fine. Seniors are requested to please guide me what to do. Bcoz i m in tension. I didnot tell anything to Dr that i m using steroids. Guys plz help me
I have nolva in hands. Clomid in hand. And arimidex also in hand.

Makwa's picture

Running a 19-nor without any prolaction control?

steroider123's picture

I am on 4th week of my 1st cycle of test e + deca.
From last thirsday i started feeling sides like testical pain, after two days start high blood pressure and today i m feeling pain in my right nipple. I discontinue every thing since last thirsday when i started testical pain. My blood pressure was 172/90 today's morning. I consulted a Dr he gave me some medicine i feeling lil bit fine. Seniors are requested to please guide me what to do. Bcoz i m in tension. I didnot tell anything to Dr that i m using steroids. Guys plz help me
I have nolva in hands. Clomid in hand. And arimidex also in hand.

iifymlifestyle's picture

How do you know if you need to increase or current AI dosage/frequency?

I'm on .5 eod but i feel i could increase to 1 eod due to slight bloating, but that's the nature of Test E anyway, you'll always get some bloating and slight water retention..

Trial and Error on AI dosage or is there a better way to determine if i need/should increase or decrease?

crazymofo's picture

Stats
Age: 22
Height: 185cm
Weight: 85kg
BF: 10-15%

Bro. This website does not condone use of AAS until the age of 25. So all I can say is best way to tell is to stop and get ready to pct then train natty for a few more years. You know what pct is right??????

Ostarine's picture

I know

iifymlifestyle's picture

I've been training for over 7 years mate, i'm over "qualified"..
Those stats are very out of date as well, and incorrect.

Thanks for your concern though, i appreciate it!

crazymofo's picture

Well you joined less then a year ago so I am assuming you aren't older then 23. And that is what I am getting at. At your current age you are still in peak natural condition to and muscle. So you are taking a risk at a very early age to damage your hpta which could cause you to become a trt patient and/or infertile. That is why this website has that 'age limit' of 25 years old.

birdbear27's picture

Larger stomach? What exactly does that mean. Like a bloated belly look?

geneticfreak's picture

i took my first dose af adex yesterday and i had to sleep on the couch cuz i sweated right through my mattress and i changed my shirt 3 times is this normal

AASaddict's picture

Aromasin is far superior to adex for a number of reasons which I briefly point out if your going to decide upon an Ai:

  1. its kinder on the lipids, something worth remembering with oral stacks.

  2. Its a suicidal Ai so kills the enzyme that converts/create eastrogen thus keeping your eastrgen levels down but not wiped out, adex just blocks the eastrgen by attachment, it does it well but then when stopped can give rebound and so needs often needs tapering.

3.aromasin (exemestane) lowers SHBG (which frees up more test) and increase IGF1 levels quite considerably, massive edge especially for PCT..

bmon1's picture
  1. states that its a suicidal ai, aromasin, that it kills the enzyme that converts estrogen, yet the statement after is keeping your levels low but not wiped out???? if its killing the enzyme the it will eventually wipe it out.

adex blocks the attachment thus not killing the aromatase enzyme, this would be the one i would think to choose.

not choosing one or the other just confused at the statement.

j223's picture
  1. true
  2. there can be a rebound with aromasin (not likely) due to newly synthesized AE. The chances of Rebound with adex is very slim so this isn't enough reason to pick aromasin over adex
  3. lowers shbg? free up more test = E2 is also bound by shbg. lowering shbg going into pct isn't necessarily a good thing
dragonsage's picture

Good info, just asking I am new and am on a 200ml protocol from an anti aging clinic. They have me on .5mg 2x a week, but all I can find for sale is the 1mg. Is that enough difference to cause an issue? Or would I be ok taking 1mg 1x a week?

Thanks,
DS.

mk50's picture

cut the pill in half and take half twice a week, I cut mine in quartes and take .25mg mwf with a doseage of 180mg of test per week, my levels come back ok when doc has bloods done

joebig517's picture

Got an AI (ADEX) on standby for my current cycle, I have never used and AI on cycle before as I didnt think it necessary as i know it dramatically lowers E can hinder gains and can be hard to get the rite balance of dosage and after this read it shall remain an addition to my current cycle if I needed only, good post bro ;)

thahulk2014's picture

Not in ny

propro's picture

this is my first time running a cycle and thats what i have been doing...taking .25 e3d and started getting some tight joints so i pushed it back to e4d and it has significantly helped, if it comes back then i will take .125 e3d or e4d well see

DiabloStrong's picture

if 1mg of adex wasn't killing your estro levels i'd wonder if your adex is bunk or underdosed.