+ 6 Steroids and The heart
I read up on some stuff from TNation yesterday and I thought I would share.
They took 65 steroid users that have been on juice more than 7 years or have been cycling.They did test on there hearts to see if it actually grew because it is a muscle we just don't see it. So half of the steroid user were on cycle. They saw that there muscle tissue indeed did grow and which causes it harder for the heart to pump blood. The guys that were off cycle they did test on. The heart had a reverse effect which is why I think cycling on and off is very important for the body to heal. There heart was significantly fine.
I thought I would share this little bit of information. It is very important that you cycle off. Do not abuse steroids. Any thing over 200mg a week is considered a cycle.
- Bookmark
- 6
- 0
I had a look at one of the studies. It's got me confused. It's saying that the distribution on the graph below is highly right skewed, but visually to me, it doesnt look excessively right skewed? There is a slight bump between 10-20 years of continuous AAS usage, but it really doesnt look much and the 4 entries across 10-20 years.... they look like outliers to me??? The plotted line... it doesn't seem to really represent what is happening?.... does it??
the researchers were also given grants by these lads: https://www.drugabuse.gov/steroids and a company that makes Statins
http://circ.ahajournals.org/content/135/21/1991#sec-22
Does continuous mean they never cycle off? Like they Cruise low does TRT and the do Blast cycles? For 10-20 years.
No not straight through usage. It incorporated normal as users but with experience from 2 -20+ years iirc
That makes the findings worrisome
But the criticisms also make it seem alarmist
I had a look at the 2nd study. LOL.... the report was abused by those in the know: http://urologytimes.modernmedicine.com/urology-times/content/tags/abraha...
I had a look at it myself... interestingly, the researcher Vigen conducted this study as part of her becoming a doctor. She earned a felllowship for this work. (mayne this is normal, I dont know, buyt she cannot be called seasoned but was recognised by the American Heart Association as a good young researcher)
She found the AAS group in her study were generally healthier but had a higher overall mortality rate than the placebo group. They called it significant. She recommended that her study wasn't definitive and that more randomised trials were needed as it appears the testosterone therapy itself is an issue (and not other diseases or medications)
She speculates that there could be 3 causes for the increased risk factors - DHT, Sleep issues and platelet issues via 'platelet thromboxane A2 receptor' and protein increases but not a lot seems to be known about that in humans from what i read elsewhere.
I like T-nation a lot and they do put out some great articles but they also put out extremely opinionated and or outright misleading articles as well
they're good overall, and I like them. But you gotta love the advertorials for their products. makes me think a lot less of them when they come by. I guess business is business though.
No doubt some of their content is really good, but as you say, they are very hit and miss
I was surprised at this one when i looked a little closer
You can see the legit TRT versus anti-T/anti-steroids gap widening with this type of article, over time
I read that article too. Here's the link for people if you would like to read it as well.
https://www.t-nation.com/pharma/tip-steroids-vs-your-heart?utm_source=fa...
Thanks for sharing some very useful information brother! I can't for the life of me understand why anyone wouldn't cycle off as needed! Even professionals who blast and cruise know the importance of TRT dosages in their protocols!
I'm also a firm believer in keeping cycles short, no longer than 12 weeks in length! The body has a greater chance of homeostasis the shorter the duration of shutdown!
While we are speaking of heart health, more damage is related to diet than by anabolic use!
Thanks again +2
I truly believe the heart may grow a little but most of your issues come from eating shit and having bad cholesterol. Leading to strokes and heart attacks. I have been on test straight for 8 years for trt. Once a year I'll do a cycle with some higher doses. I take all human grade products and I'll tell you I have phenomenal blood results and it seems every year my results get better a d better. For me my health is top priority. I watch my bp and always do routine bloodwork. I don't want to die from a stroke or heart attack. Hell no.
The biggest heart problems come from high and long tren cycles, thats what I often hear from guys, especially from young guys they think more is more... they eat junk, drink to less and use high dosages cause they think they gain 20lbs/month of lean muscle mass when they do this...
It's just from years of use really and the strain it puts on your body. Especially running high dosages.
ReaLly interesting thanks for sharing
Did they actually witness a reversal in the enlargement? That us, they saw and enlargement and subsequent reversal or how did that observation transpire??
They compared it to to the guys on cycle and to the guys off cycle for 7+ years... They also compared it to natural athletes also. No they did not see the progress reverse. They said the guys on cycle. The heart walls were thicker do to muscle growth. If you think about it when you come off cycle you don't usually keep your size compared to when you are own. Think about the heart losing muscle as well. So most likely it goes back to normal size. If that makes sense.
From all the research ive done on the subject Ive read that it will go back a bit, but never to pre steroid size.
It absolutely does
Cheers fella
My mom always told me I have such a big heart....
Lol I always new you were they loving type
Hahah
I had very high bp before I started running aas again. When I was young 16-24 peak condition could have played college ball but was a bad stupid kid. I tan gear and was 215-220 lean abs all that. I stopped running gear when I stopped boxing. 4yrs ago I took a new job i gained alot of weight and my bp went sky high. I cut the weight and started to run gear again now my bp is perfect in range. Im not sure about an enlarged heart but from the tests my doctor has run on me through my last 4yrs he tells me im now in much better health than I was before I started using again. I do believe that aas has effects on the body especially the heart and I agree 100% that cycling on and off is a must. I had a conversation about this with another member in pm just a wk or 2 ago because I was researching igflr3 and it with hgh has a tendency to enlarge organs this is what stopped me from using it.
The heart as we all know is an important body part there not giving them away to guys like us even if you are on the transplant list.
Cardiovascular disease in any shape is very serious. I just wanted to share my story of how losing weight and lifting with aas has improved my health. It could also though of course go the other way. Its really important to see a doctor that you can discuss and be open with about everything or he might not be able to make a determination about how the compounds are really effecting your body. Donating blood is also important to keep your blood thinner because clotting is something that a doctor can't always see in blood tests or ekg or sonograms.
Wow
Respect
Do you credit the aas for helping or the training g or both?
I credit my diet change is 90% the other 10% is the lifestyle of lifting and staying in shape
the gear gives me just the look i want.
All of it together though has definitely helped me out.
Spot on man
+
Its good to hear when someone makes good choices and puts the work in yo improve their health. My journey is similar to yours in some ways. When I was younger late teens early 20s I was in the service. Great shape. Lifted, ran all that good stuff. Never any aas though. Then late 20s early 30s let myself go. Finally made myself go to the gym and dropped the bf I accumulated and just fell in live with the lifestyle. Anyway when I went back to the gym I took better care of myself but when I started cycling aas I took it to another level. Where I watch my fats, cholesterol, calories etc.. the way I look at it if I am going to spend the $ on gear and jab myself several times a week you dam vetter believe I'm going to get everything I can out of it.
Anyway I'm getting sidetracked. Just wanted to tell you to keep up the good work. I know you bust your ass man, you camln tell from what you write here. And hearing someome else doing it helps keep me and probably others motivated.
I feel the same way and thats why I really love being a member here. You guys all keep me going and I really like giving back to others helping in the forums.
Sounds corny but its the truth
My heart was enlarged long before I ever touched steroids. Cardiologist ruled it as athlete's heart and said it's nothing to worry about.
I had a heart murmur found when I was a teenager at a sports physical. They wouldn't clear me I had to go to a specialist and have a scope ran up one of the main arteries in my groin to scope my heart. They told me then I had an athletes heart that there was nothing wrong but my heart was a little larger than normal but very strong. I have always had a very low pulse in the low to mid 40's in the am and low 50's throughout the day. What's your hr like?
Usually around 60
Ya a large majority of athletes have it. This is the one side effect of steriods we cant control and probably the most worrisome.
I don't know if steroids directly cause it though. I would think it's simply that people train a lot harder on steroids, not the steroids themselves. The heart is not a skeletal muscle; steroids alone shouldn't make it grow sans direct stimulation, i.e. very hard training over prolonged periods of time that can cause left ventricle hypertrophy.
A enlarged heart is always something to worry about. I think that maybe he didn't really see no severe enough adnormalities to be concerned.
That's not true. Athlete's heart is benign, and should reverse when training stimuli is removed. If I were obese, eating fast food every meal, binge drinking, and I didn't exercise, then I would be extremely worried. That's far from the case. If anything I'm healthy to the point where it's obnoxious.
Gotcha I understand what you are saying...