posted Fri, 08/25/2017 - 16:50
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Test and tren
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So if tren over powers test for the receptors from what I have gathered. You would run 250mg of test then X amount of tren. I would always run high amount of test and x amount of tren. What is everyone opinion on this? After thinking about it if I took more tren than test I would end up cutting weight and would make it hard to bulk. I'm in recomp now running a good bit of gh and test only.
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FGWLones I ran tren higher than test and wont do it again, I dont like it, you feel like shit imo
Ya it's kind of down to your own preference.. I've experimented with high test and tren vs low test and higher tren and also low test + npp and higher tren along with high test npp and tren.. low test for me is 250-300 mg p/w. high test for me is anything over 600mg p/w.. I found that a lot of the problems that can arise from estrogen and prolactin build up were negated when low test was ran with 19nor's. when I used the low test npp and tren all together I did get slight nipple puffiness but 20 mg of nolva per day took it away didn't feel the need for an ai and that was about as far as I got with estro/prolactin sides.. so long story short low test when running 19nors is the most optimal for me.. But it might not suit you who knows? that's why questions like this can never be answered 100% correctly it's all user dependent but that's just to give you an idea of my experience through the years
Thank you bro finally an answer/opinion. What did you notice differently though when running low test high 19nor versus high test and low 19nors?
weirdly enough I felt less "hormonal" didn't have that kind of depression feeling that can come from too much estrogen also I especially noticed my bp was more consistent and in check where as it would rise a lot more when higher test was ran even with an ai libido also.. I never had a limp dick as such but that drive and hard on wasn't as apparent with running 19 Nors with high test like for example I'm currently on 250 mg test e split in half and pinned twice a week along with 100 mg of tren a eod my libido is as high as it's ever been! It's kind of hard to explain I just don't feel that much more sexually driven on higher test with them compounds it's also such a bastard keeping your estro/prolactin in check I just compared the risk to reward ratio and to me running my test Lower is just the best for me! Expirement with it and see how you get on as I said I can't give you a direct "yes it works or no it doesn't" answer you'll just have to see for your self that's how I learned through trial and error
Well is this preference on a cutting, bulking or recomp cycle? Plus this opinion will be all over the place based on how people handle each compound with gains and side effects.
I edited you are right +1 I should have explained a little more into detail.
Like rusty said there is a ton of information on this recently even. I don't run tren and not hating on you just solid advice if you are considering running tren you should only be saying this is how because its a harsh compound. Really read about it and honestly I don't know your priors but many other compounds that you can reach your goals with that are meant for humans and not cows going to slaughter. Im against using tren unless you get paid for the way you look. The average lifter can use other compounds that will be a much better fit.
Good luck and good gains brother
I said half what I need to below with all respect. I know tren is the devil. I know what tren does. Ive taking it more than several occasions. I couldn't imagine taking more tren than test because of the weight I would lose bulking. But then again would that be bad weight and gain muscle at the same time. I understand that you are against tren and that's your choice. I respect that.
The compound doesn't make the bulk or the cut it will be reliant on your diet. I've lost weight and got ripped on deca/ test was an aggressive ass hole. And gained weight with tren / test and was a super cuddle bug. There is a common idea that tren is the boss and should be allowed to do all the work. Bad sides seem to be related to to high test and conversion to estro. I think rusty and the other guys are right though . Sounds like you fishing for an answer to make you feel better about the decision you have made.
RustyhookerEasier to cut on mild chems and strict diet for sure.
Right. I was 215 and just fat . Ate an apple , orange, and banana for breakfast salad for lunch and a reasonable dinner and made 170 in a few months. And just Daa and fenugreek. Test boosters
To get ripped up yes compound does matter. ;). My kind of ripped your kind are different.
I'd say so . But I havent run any gear in 8 years.
I know what diet is everything. I'm not fishing for anything buddy. I can say that tren will make you cut weight faster with the right diet. I'm confused you think I'm fishing for an answer. What answer would that be? I clearly asked what is the difference between dosages of one being higher than the other. If anyone would ever want to compare physiques including you buddy lol. We can! ;) To show I know exactly what I'm talking about...stop being a nut hugger. If you can't answer my question then don't say anything!
Oh and post a pick so we can compare physiques.
Don't get me wrong there are guys on this page with better physiques 10 times better than mine. I put hard work into what I do and a lot of time and effort. So please don't mistakes my hard work for cockiness.
https://www.eroids.com/pics/mods
RustyhookerYou been here before. So why you so grouchy this time.
And no research or formal replies as before. Could be why banned prior?
You and I have always got along for the most part. At the same time I'm not grouchy I only reply back to rude comments in the only way I know how. If I ask a simple question answer it or move on. Why reply with negativity. Lol makes no sense. This forum is here to learn and also research but if you don't understand something you ask. If you beat someone down and talk down to them. Don't expect them to sit there and take it. Like I said I don't claim to know everything but I know enough and a good bit. My opinion on something may differ from others on this forum because of my trial and error. Moral of the story I don't like assholes! I got put in time out because I was responding to a asshole the best way I know how and that's being a. Offer asshole. Ha tren didn't help it. That's behind me I can careless about those certain people. I do like this forum though I've learned everything I know from it for the past 5 years. Besides from my coach.
RustyhookerYou've run tren before and been here a long time. I answered below on tren to help with confusion. Ive never had 2 tren runs exactly alike. Last run i had no sweats at all but recomped excellent. Time before that thinking was funky, jealousy. Before that was a human sauna. No other sides. All times, i sleep like a log, no bad dreams and no night sweats because i cut carbs by 6.
Low test cutting. Held muscle with good diet of course.
Even or higher test i recomped. Thanksgiving was high test.
Right on!
It's the "opinion " you asked for. It was my "opinion" I gave. And if agreeing with others that have a lot of knowledge is being a nut hugger then so be it. And if you such a pro at all this then why you asking? I never claimed to know shit . just tried to answer your question.
I asked a simple question that I've never done before and how it was? I don't tend to know everything but I will ask a question.
What is it that you haven't done? Run low test with high tren.
Yes I have never done that. I've always been taught rule of thumb to run higher test than tren. When competing I run it at a even mg.
What do you call low test or high Tren? Personally on 90mg test eod (315mg pw) and 75mg ed of Tren (525mg pw). Having zero sides and loving it,
So you say you have lower sides. What about strength... How is your strength with low test?
How is my strength? Normally when I'm on a low-carb diet my strength goes to shit. However because I have Tren in me I'm stronger than ever. Also running masteron on but I'm not believing any of the strength is coming from that.
I didn't know what your diet was like. This bulking cycle I have coming up I'll probably just stick with test e, tren e, Mast e, adrol 2 weeks on 2 weeks off and pulse. As far as when I'm low carbing it. I lift light and just do as many reps as I can until failure. Well my light maybe heavy to others but 15-25 reps and lots of drop sets plus 45 min of cardio in the morning. If you still keep your strength I think I'm going to try that with this bulking cycle though.
I'm cutting with Tren and Mast. I would not use either of these compounds to bulk. So many better options available for adding size.
RustyhookerTest/deca tops the list. Plus a dht...boom
Agreed!
Thought it came down to diet. Lol jk jk. I have to stay some what lean that way I'm not struggling to cut all the fat for my next comp.
No you are right in that aspect. Because the fact is you don't grow from steroids, you grow from calories. However some types of compounds will help you utilize your calories and give more nitrogen retention along with protein synthesis. And some products however do not help you in this aspect. For example, why don't you stack halo and Anavar and try to bulk lol
Test is just there to keep the normal man function going let the tren do all the work
Exactly! I do run it on cycle slightly higher than my TRT dose just for an extra boost. But I'm not relying on the testosterone for my gains. I'm relying on the other compounds I stack with it for my gains.
Really no rule of thumb with tren as every one is different like was mentioned sides seem to get worse with high test
I gotcha thank you for helping me understand that. I was always taught a certain way or took the concept a different way. It works though may not be level headed all the time. I usually stay in my man cave when I'm like that. Personally I usually only use Tren when I compete usually. I'm thinking about throwing some E in for a bulk.
Agree with that 100% I get a lot of sides from compounds when ever my test is high. But when I keep my Test low I have minimal to no sides regardless of the compounds I'm using.
Well if you have already run tren have you delt with any estro or progesterone sides on cycle.
The theory is that since both fight for receptors then let the tren do the heavy work and you will have less test sides but up the tren and get more tren sides its a very debated topic.
Alot of guys love tren after reading the sides I stick with npp. The stuff can do almost the same thing and will shut you down just as hard but will be less of a hurting in the long run.
Whats your opinion on npp ever try it?
Yes NPP isn't bad I like it and have took it a couple of times. I actually have a good bit of it now. Still nothing compared to Tren. As far as estro and progesterone yes I take my AI's for both. Some people wait till they see sides I don't. I rather take care of the problem before it happens. At the same time though Tren will still mess your head up regardless if everything is in check. Postive side it will keep you nice and hard! No homo.
RustyhookerStats? Priors? This has been covered to death in forums. Research first. So far you're coming across as a spoonfed dude and not taking in any info presented.
Go research!
I've been competing for a few years now. My stats are listed. I'm not being spoon fed anything. I have read both vice versa on this topic. I'm asking for opinions since there are some people that say run more test than tren and tren more than test.
So I did my research and if anything Rusty I probably know just as much as you buddy. I'm just curious for Other people's opnions...
RustyhookerI guess im lost how you say you're competing yet rely on shakes for your goals. Ive not met any competitive bodybuilders relying on liquid when all shown proof is solid foods value.
are you asking what my diet is? Other than that I'm not really sure what you are saying. I know one thing you are one of the ones that goes around on this forum pretending to be someone you aren't. Instead of insulting people maybe you should ask the correct questions or don't say nothing at all! From the time I wake up bulking I eat 40-60g of protein every 2 1/2 hours plus 80g of carbs until I go to bed then I wake up at night and eat too.... Pretty easy to do with jasmine rice... I don't worry about my fats really until I cut down because that's what my energy is ran off of. Recomp I gradually lift my carbs every week. Keep my protein around 50g... ;)
RustyhookerWas referring to your last post on relying on liquids.
Research buddy. Tren is one of those drugs thats NOT a one sized fits all. Ive ran it higher and lower. Diet is more important imo but you know that.
There is NO standard with tren. Never has been. Each person must find their own. And tgen guess what? The next time is completely different than the last. But you know that too being such the expert. Right bro?
You phish more than you answer or show knowledge. Been here too long to not see smoke n mirrors.
Do your own bro. Its your body. Go for it
Every time running tren is different. I also think that has to do where we are in life are we stressed. Is someone stressing us out? Breakup? Job? Finicial issues? It just depends. I can run tren and be happy as hell and be high god almighty. The next I could think about well being a hitman lol. I was curious as to what people experience when running a higher tren lower test dose. I've never done that because I always followed rule of thumb from what I was taught.