+ 3 Clenbuterol....you be the judge
Clen is a beta 2 agonist and has been used medically and in sports enhansement for decades. Some of the issues lie inbetween medical and sports. Meaning theres a clinical short use and of course the wide world of more is better.
Side effects are common and somehow people judge the effectiveness seeking those side effects. As if somehow causeing havok is a marker of good clen and it doing its job most effectively. Raised body temp, tremors, sweating, tacycardia, etc etc even at low doses can and will occur. Stress on heart valves causing permsnent damage is literally the tip of the iceberg. And it doesnt take much. This person took 20mcg
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4840705/
Looking at size verus power of a drug should be an automatic warning sign. Such as taking in 500mg a week of testosterone as being a strong first cycle. Yet its not understood that mcg or micrograms yields so much more bang. In a side by side 500mg of test is 500,000mcg of clen! And the report of a bad issue in link above was just 20mcg! If a gram is the size of a match head....imagine a few salt crumbles as a dose.
500mg is 500,000 micrograms!
Heart valves, tachycardia, heart attack, death, permanent heart damage etc.... its more than a scare story. Its the question really of is it worth the risk? Its your body. You be the judge.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4840705/
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1878540913001011#:~:t...
https://www.mja.com.au/journal/2014/200/4/clenbuterol-toxicity-nsw-poiso...
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Dylan54000salbutamol and effective, made for humans in official laboratories and less dangerous if a soft and followed protocol.
Dylan54000Another major problem with Clenbuterol UG is knowing exactly how much substance is in your 20 or 25 mcg pill? because it can hold 2 x, 3x, 5x ... more or maybe nothing other than flour. it is obviously very difficult to dose the right mcg for the sources. This makes clenbuterol even more dangerous
PussyLickerReally bad stuff just do some more cardio or put the fork away and you dont damage your heart and still lose weight, can’t understand why so much people abuse stims and fatburners
RustyhookerThe search for the magic pills...
I had a girlfriend who heard about clen and she was begging me to buy her some.. of course I didn't, way too powerful and dangerous.. especially for women and newbies who don't have patience.. they tend to take more and more.
As a experienced user I don't see how you can miscalculate the dosage..
they think if 1 works why not speed up the process and pop 3 or 4.
RustyhookerEspecially when its posted weekly that they add more til sides are evident. Folks arent even aware of mcg is so minute for a reason, then its too late
I agree about overdosing, it's not like your playing with the raws. I've known a friend that screwed up aleve(naproxen) doses before and put their liver in shutdown. Spent 10 days in the hospital! A bit of self responsibly is always needed with any drug, even over the counter drugs.
RustyhookerSince 1500mg a day is proper medical dosing....how much was he eating?
https://www.mayoclinic.org/drugs-supplements/naproxen-oral-route/proper-...
Six months at max dose
https://www.drugs.com/dosage/naproxen.html
And 1500mg of naproxin vs 1.5million mcg of clenbuterol is that power vs dose this forum is addressing. Same as phentanol vs codein
1 pill every 12 hours, basically as directed on the bottle, is what he said. He might have been drinking too, who knows.
RustyhookerOuch....so light dosing and still got bit. Hope he healed up fast
Took his ast alt into the thousands. His joints stopped working, jaundice and extreme head and body aches. He made a full recovery in time. Tylenol and naproxen are strong otc meds in the wrong hands.
RustyhookerTrue story!
I'm all for safe use of anabolic drugs and sharing safe practices. Though that article you linked is just straight anti PED BS.
A kid tells his doctor he has been taking 25mcg of clen daily for 3 weeks. They take his word for it with suspicion, though they were unable to check his blood. Note the article itself mentions they suspect the dose was higher than 20mcg. It also states in Countries where clen is licenced the medical dose is between 20-40mcg daily.
The whole article read anti PED and scare mongering
"Toxicity following clenbuterol is a rarely reported syndrome, and this case suggests that toxicity can occur at relatively low doses of clenbuterol. As use of anabolic agents becomes more frequent, this is likely to be a more frequently observed presentation to emergency departments."
"Differential diagnosis of clenbuterol toxicity includes thyrotoxicosis, phaeochromocytoma and ingestion of stimulants such as cocaine, amphetamines and other β agonists."
"It is interesting to note that the patient had previously taken the same dose of clenbuterol without experiencing any toxicity, raising the suspicion that the patient ingested a higher dose of clenbuterol than he claimed. Unfortunately, serum clenbuterol levels are not routinely available for testing."
Even the article itself suspects he was taking a higher dose then reporting or even possibly taking other stims.
RustyhookerDid you read the comparison of mcg vs mg? The fact that mcg is about a few single pieces of salt and the reality that a small error can cause major malfunctions? Or surfing sources that theres 20mcg and 40mcg doses? Errors are easy and the damage is permanent. Which is why its titled.... you be the judge . Its your body and you can ruin it as you wish.
possibly taking other stims
Its 100% impossible! Roid heads never poly pharmacy....
inserted sarcasm .
Drink 1 cup of strong coffee (a stim) with 20mcg of clen and get back to me. Talk bout shakes? So wired that i could hear bugs fucking. Lol... tossed the clen after that
if I took the time out to read your links I also read your type up.
Don't think anyone is arguing with you here, I read your post thoroughly and don't even use or condone clen myself. I read the dosage comparison and which again enforces you should purchase purchase pharma grade and stay away from UGL. And that goes for pretty much any drug that can make a different at extremely low mcg levels.
The article (if you read it) doesn't talk about coffee but cocaine, amphetamines and other β agonists. (Did you read that part or you just trying to cherry pick?) - You didn't read pass the abstract part of the article did you?
My point was referencing an article to say 20mcg leads to toxicity where the docs suspected he was taking a higher dosage and not to mention no evidence he even had clen in his system.is probably not the best reference to use. , he purchased from Russia and could easily be taking anything in a bottle. WTF in the UK imports Clen from Russia when you can easily purchase pharma grade around here in gyms and online.
"Surfacing sources" - not sure what that means but I got the 20-40mcg medicinal dose source from the same article you linked - it's the dosage according to the article prescribed in Countries .
RustyhookerLmao....jeeeezes fkn christ. If you read all my replues to you....youd see i AGREED. I simply was making sure OTHER readers see mcg vs mg and undedstand the difference.
I also thumbed you up a FEW times yet you negged. Lol! This is why ive deleted nearly 150 total learning forums. Hahaha
Surfacing sources
It clearly says. S U R F I N G. As in searching for...surfing the internets by bush. Lol
My bad, American lingo gets me sometime haha - I don't think it was me that negged you mate
It's my understanding that they are trying to crack down on it like with DNP in the U.K, I have read a number of tragic stories like the following:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5344459/Rugby-player-dead-takin...
RustyhookerThats the scarey side to what we do to chase our dreams. As i get older, ive been reevaluating things that are basics to gym rat. Like looking closer at primo vs tren. And trying to get the fat off before it causes interior harm.
That's a really sad way to go being a regular gym rat and then one day not waking up.
My point wasn't disagreeing with Rusty's point but merely that the kid was likely taking more than 20mcg in the article he quoted.
I don't personally use clen or fat burners nor condone them, because every time I hear of steroid related deaths there is almost always fat burners also involved. That's just my personal opinion.
The Home office has made it more difficult to import DNP and is also trying to impose longer sentences on anyone selling DNP. Also in the process of classifying as a poison.
RustyhookerHigh five! What we dont know....
I've never used it either Bud, unfortunately I'm a skinny git anyway so never will Lol Its just there is such a fine line with stimulants dosage wise between it being okay and potentially lethal they are just too risky in my eyes. Look at the number of fatalities with people buying caffeine powder to use for training and losing weight - all they have to do is use the wrong measuring scoop and they have a fatal heart attack. That rat poison known as DNP in my opinion is just plain insanity - young overweight girls buying it online then virtually cooking from the inside out like being in a microwave. Its like someone selling someone a loaded gun with one bullet in the chamber in my eyes, try your luck.
Couldn’t have said it better mate, seen deaths with people taking prework out stims before runs and marathons yet theres still people double/triple dosing prework out powders. Better researching the ingredients and purchasing safely individually and making your own prework out.
TBF on cycle without fat loss agents I lose a lot of fat and I’m happy with double digit BF now as my joint aren’t really as good as they used to be.
Comparing a bio-identical hormone like test to a beta 2 agonist like Clen is so absurd I don’t even know where to start. It’s like comparing a red wood tree to a Ferrari. And your use of the mg to mcg is so bizarre even Don Hooten would object. Clen is proven to be bad yes, heart tissue necrosis …. But this post reads like a D.A.R.E. pamphlet written by Nancy Reagan herself lol
RustyhookerThen obviously you never sat in a chem class using the balance to measure and create chemicals. The point of weight is added to clearly demonstrste the power of the drug. Someone can hit 600mg of test yet a minute slip on clen can literall kill you. Phentanol is another drug measured in mcg. Thats the point! Folks sure like adding more drugs and use side effects as the tell tale. But you cannot understant potency in mcg? Thats crazy talk.
So since I called you out on this nonsensical post you downvote one of my reviews. How petty. Since you demonstrated that you know completely fuck all about Pharmacology or pharmacokinetics… let me
Spell this out for you 500mg of testosterone does not equal 500,000mcg of Clen. And it’s absolutely asinine to make such a post. But carry on policing eroids, lol.
Is today a national misinterpretation day? Read his post again. He is talking about the difference of potency of the two drugs. Not doing a similarity comparison.
Drug A is dosed in units 1000x smaller than drug B. Which one is more potent, A or B?
RustyhookerWakeup and smell edumakationz
RustyhookerYoure a special kinda something....
Since BFG stepped in on this exchange, I’m smart enough to know to just end it. Enjoy
RustyhookerBecause bfg explained it clearly. And proof posted above shows the math.
Its simply power vs the molecular weight. A few single crumbles of salt has the power to permanently ruin your body. If you err on that 500mg test to 1000mg....ya get zits.
If folks cant understand the strength of a chemical by its weight then theyre playing roulette
Been there and done that with clen. Side effects weren't worth it. Found more effective alternatives with much more tolerable side effects.
Lifted-presence92Hey makwa what alternatives have helped you in the past?
I have a buddy wanting to try clen and he’s overweight but I advised him not to for very reasons. One thing I suggested was orlistat.
Would like to get your insight on good alternatives for fat loss of course I told him diet is your main thing along with proper training that being weights and cardio. So he’s not one to just take compounds and sit on his ass or bs in the gym.
Clen is kind of dinosaur in the bodybuilding world, at least around me. I don't think anyone I know uses it. Most have turned to albuterol instead. Side effects are so much less and just as effective. The other is running an ECA stack and I have found either of these to be effective running S4 alongside.
Any of this is foolish to run with higher bodyfat, which unfortunately seems to be when most people want to run them. Save it for when fat loss gets hard and you have plateaud from dieting. Then bring in the fat loss drugs to keep losing the fat while not having to decrease cals further which can lead to loss of precious muscle. That is the only time it is appropriate to use. It is a joke when people 20% bf ask about using clen, albut, ECA whatever it may be. They will lose fat so rapidly at that body composition with just a tweaked diet that supplemental aides are a complete waste. They will then give credit to the clen or whatever but is actually the diet that did all the work.
The other thing which can be scary about clen is just a small miscalculation in dose can cause big problems. when you are working with a compound in mcg you have to realize just how small amount this really is. Can this really be accurately dosed if not in a pharma environment.
Lifted-presence92Thanks for you insight makwa I will pass on this information to my buddy this was beneficial and I appreciate your time commenting on this topic!
I should also mention that HGH is beneficial for fat loss. The newest thing to come around, at least for me is Cardarine. Lot of options out there. Just need to know when to use them for maximum results and minimize sides.
Are you seeing good results from the Cardarine? I’m having to do some house arrest so I decided to stay with my folks so I could do some work on their house/vehicles but moms rotation of brownies one day cinnamon roles the next is killing me hence why I was gonna start the clen. Would like to find a different option. Thanks in advance.
Hard to tell for me. Only used it once during a prep and was taking so much stuff that it is hard to tell the results from an individual compound. Albuterol is my number one choice. Put aside the cinnamon rolls and brownies and you should be ok.
Lifted-presence92Yeah I personally use cardarine myself it’s pretty legit 900mg per ml basically no pip unlike amino asylum offers.
Rustyhooker@Makwa ^^^^^perfect spot for options from a respected member
RustyhookerExactly!
Well that solves that. I have a couple blisters. Considering using it for its fat burning properties but after reading that I'm good. Might as well throw that shit away. Like,, I have panic attacks here and there. I can only imagine what I'd be Luke once this shit kicked in and I had no choice but to ride it out? F THAT!! Thanks for the post. I'm so glad I never went though with taking that shit.
Daaamn I’m with you failuretobreathe33 I had a nice supply in the safe and was just about to start on them. Think I’ll just pass on that.
RustyhookerIts all a tool in our tool boxes. But be aware of whats considered. Small error on test...acne. Small error in mcg could put you in harms way.
RustyhookerIve run it back in the old days. It works but you can pay big for it too. And if you get anxious then yes its a ride for a while.
Lifted-presence92I can’t believe people downvoted this lol all you did was provide information about clen and a scientific article backing it…
+
RustyhookerDont worry bout karmas bro. Only here to help
Ive been karma rich...zero...down...back up. Lol
Lifted-presence92I just like to give it when it’s actually due.
Lifted-presence92Thanks for posting this rusty!