Test, Tren, Mast cycle for recomp?
Hey guys, looking to get some input, as I'm still learning. Im starting my 2nd cycle ever. First cycle didn't get any real results, besides excess body hair... but it was a basic starter cycle to see if i could handle sides and needles.
Here's my 1st cycle:
Wk 1-12 Test E 500mg/wk (split into 2 injections)
Wk 1-6. Anadrol 50mg
I used nolva and arimidex as needed for puffy nips, and then PCT was clomid/nolva.
For my 2nd cycle I'm thinking a recomp goal.
Current Stats:
Age 37
Weight 207lb
5'11"
15-18% body fat
Lifting routinely for 3 years
Eating clean diet around 2700 calories
Here's what im seeking input on for this upcoming 2nd cycle:
Wk 1-10 Test prop 150mg eod
Wk 1-10 Tren Ace 100mg eod
Wk 1-10 Mast prop 100mg eod
(Also considering winny, and maybe only an 8wk cycle)
(I already have anadrol left over, but honestly i lost those gains as soon as i came off it, heavy water retention too)
3 weeks of PCT starting 3 days after last inj:
Day 1 Clomid 250mg + Nolvadex 60mg
Following 10 days Clomid 100mg + Nolvadex 40mg
Following 10 days Clomid 50mg + Nolvadex 20mg
Thanks to the group in advance for your advice!
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So what did you not do right? Go to the drawing board and rethink EVERYTHING you think you know. Trash it and start over. The other guys are ALL RIGHT!
My first test e cycle @ 500 mg/wk got me 40+ lbs. And running anadrol shit I would have popped! You getting body hair only sounds like you are fucking lazy and expect the pharmaceuticals to do the work for you. Again, lets back up and think why we didn't get results. You didnt do bloods for a baseline, mid cycle, or pct either? Why sir?
Lastly, why on earth would you run 4 compounds if you are so new to gear? 4?!?! This is NOT a race!!! The tren, mast, test, trifecta will NOT MAKE YOU look like a muscle mag douche bag. You dont even know how to combat e2/prolactin in my opinion if you retained that much water using drol. It CAN be a wet compound, but it CAN also be dry if you are experienced and use it the way your body tells you to. I am betting that you ate like garbage and probably did more harm than good to yourself. Dont guess on any of this and get to the drawing board. Also your bf% is imo too high to even be on gear. Granted some guys who are seasoned here can get away with it due to years of practice and experience, but you sir are not conditioned properly with those stats. Please take all advice and apply accordingly. Hope you absolutely succeed and we get a before and after pic
First of all tren for second cycle is a no no ,second you must rethink your diet 2.700 Cal's is nothing for your height and weight ,so up the food not the compounds !!
Im thinking I'll try another test e cycle.... this time from a different supplier, and different brand
RustyhookerI doubt its the brand. I bet you didnt eat proper, get bloods proper and hoped for a miracle. Ai wrong because bloods etc.
Dropdowns up top......groups...first cycles explained. That group is your key if you read
On it... thanks
Very good move. Send me an FR/PM if you have more questions after reading. I will be happy to assist.
Rustyhooker^^^^^^^fist bump
RustyhookerExcellent!!! Good to hear that
Nope. I stopped reading after you said that you didn't get any real gains on your first test only cycle. You need to do your homework, learn how to eat, train and gain then try the test only cycle again. No need to use anything other than test until you learn how to maximize those gains.
Tren for a 2nd cycle??? Wtf
Alphamale500For your first cycle you ran 500mg of test e per week for 12 weeks and 50mg of Anadrol for weeks 1-6, and you didn't get any results besides excess hair growth? Wow! With those compounds in that cycle, you really should've gotten some great results. Especially since it was your very first cycle. So there had to be some things you were doing wrong. Do you have any idea of what those things were? You really need to figure this out before attempting another cycle, or you're just gonna be wasting more gear and causing unnecessary stress/harm to your body!
What were the specifics of your first cycle, like caloric intake and training routine etc.? And did you have bloodwork done while on cycle to maintain proper levels and to be sure your gear was legit? If you don't get to the bottom of why you didn't make any gains, then it's really pointless to run another cycle. And I don't understand this statement you made:
"I used nolva and arimidex as needed for puffy nips,"
What do you mean as needed? When you're running a consistent dose of 500mg/wk of test as you were, you're going to need an A.I. on a consistent basis. You should've been able to dial in your required dose of adex with bloodwork, and then maintained your dose with bloodwork. Did you even get bloodwork? I'm just trying to help you figure out what you were doing wrong during your first cycle.
I have to assume the Anadrol he got was bunk, I don't see how someone can not get results with that drug, it is so fucking powerful. Shit even if you didn't workout you'll probably put on a bunch of water weight even.
Alphamale500Even if the drol was fake, what about the 12 weeks of 500mg/wk of test enanthate? For a first time gear user, as long as they're already accustomed to training hard and eating good, that amount of test alone should be able to produce drastic gains in muscle. Even if some gains were water weight, the OP would've looked jacked up bro!! Something was certainly wrong, maybe his knowledge of training and using gear, idk.
Agreed! I trained naturally and did my homework for the first 5 yrs and added 40lbs to my frame and my first cycle was pharma primo direct from a Greek pharmacy and I used 300mg primo/wk as I wanted to try the mildest possible cycle. I still managed to put on another 14lbs in that 12 week cycle. I was naturally a skinny fat kid before I started weight training at the age of 16 I was 142lbs at 6ft2 and with no definition at all, think my sister had more muscle than me LMAO
This guy should have put on some serious mass with a first cycle like that if he trained and ate and slept correctly. Either the gear was fake or he didn’t do the above correctly.
Anadrol on a first cycle and tren on a second cycle is insane!
BigCactusFirst of all: you are not gonna blow up on 500mg of test. But you should get more results than extra body hair. Your body fat percentage tells me you are eating like shit. Get your diet straight.
Adding 2 new compounds in your second cycle is a really stupid idea.
Doing tren in your 2nd cycle is even more stupid.
Doing tren and mast with high body fat is extra stupid.
Using anything more than a trt dose of test and maybe maybe some winny or anavar to recomp is just a waste of gear.
Do you have caber on hand? Do you even know what caber is?
My conclusion: you do not know what you are doing. If you really want to juice do 500-600mg of test and get your diet straight. And get bloodwork done if you are still not getting results.
Alphamale500I just want to add a couple of comments to your reply. Firstly, the OP's first cycle of 500mg test e/wk for 12 weeks, and 50mg of Anadrol for wks 1-6 should've been capable of producing drastic results! And that's especially true for someone who's never used any gear previously. So he certainly could've "blew up" on that amount of gear if run properly.
I do agree with the part of your conclusion that he doesn't know what he's doing. However, in this statement of yours:
"If you really want to juice do 500-600mg of test and get your diet straight. And get bloodwork done if you are still not getting results."
You suggested that the OP get bloodwork only if he's still not getting reults with your suggestions. That is absolutely incorrect! BLOODWORK IS ALWAYS ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY!!!!! You should get bloodwork done before, during and after a cycle. Not, only if you're still not getting reults. I'm just trying to stress how important it is to have bloodwork performed on a regular basis.
BigCactusThere are numerous of other reasons to get bloodwork done even when you are making the best gains of your live. It was merely a cycle suggestion and some advise on what he should do when everything is in check and he's not getting results (maybe I should have been more clear). But I agree and I hope that OP after reading all of our responses realises he should get the neccesary bloodwork done.
Alphamale500"There are numerous of other reasons to get bloodwork done even when you are making the best gains of your live."
What you said here above, is correct and precisely one of the points I was trying to make! Bloodwork is absolutely necessary when running gear! And I mean before, during and after your cycles.
"And get bloodwork done if you are still not getting results."
"It was merely a cycle suggestion and some advise"
Yes, and it's a very bad suggestion and bad advice to tell someone to get bloodwork only if they're not getting the results they want! And what I don't understand is why you're still defending this advice? Bloodwork isn't something to have done only if you aren't seeing the results you wanna see, and that's not the type of message to send to others. That's actually the type of advice that'll get you into a bad situation when you don't have a clue as to what's going on inside your body. BLOODWORK IS ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY WHILE USING GEAR!!! PERIOD! That includes before, during and after a cycle.
BigCactusOk cool.
Question on bloodwork....
First, I'll agree...i don't know a lot about gear, that's why im here. Im open to suggestions and 100% willing to take advice. I've read a ton online, but as far as having an experienced/knowledgable person to ask specific questions to, i have this forum, that's it.
In my area of US, labcorp wouldn't just give me a bloodwork analysis without a doctor ordering specific items. How do yall get your bloodwork? Do you see your primary care doc... an "aging adult center" ? Id rather not tell my family doc.... but should i?
Im a numbers guy, I'd prefer seeing bloodwork before, during, after. I did get bloodwork before my first cycle, just to know my norm baseline.
Two people in the world you never lie to. Your Doctor and your Lawyer.
AnonGoogle private blood work..
I use Ulta labs. Some states do not allow private labs at all. If you're on that list idk what to tell ya..hope you're close to the border or find a good family doc that wont put your steroid use/labs in your medical records
AnonSolid
What are the thoughts on a test E, deca, dbol run?
AnonJust do test alone man, you truly aren't going to be missing out on gains..it's a marathon, more gear won't turn into muscle overnight. You seem to be suffering from the classic "need it now" syndrome. Your only 37..you've got 20+ more years..chill and keep your health up, you can hit all sorts of goals in that time frame.. without winding up in trouble
The 2700 calorie is what im currently doing..... off gear. On my first cycle i was eating 3300. That's actually difficult to eat that much in clean calories.
Workout is 5x week, roughly an hour each day. 4 sets on each workout, highest weight possible to get 8-12 reps. Then going up to maintain the 8-12 rep range.
To clarify, i did see dramatic gains with anadrol, especially massive pump after workouts. After coming off anadrol, gains left within a couple weeks. At the end of my full cycle i was 7lbs heavier, but also gained some body fat.
Im still about the same today (first cycle ended 7 months ago)
My goal on that cycle was gaining size, diet was on point... on average each meal was 40% calories from protein, 40% carbs.... only exception was preworkout i ate more carbs. Drank plenty of water. Rest is a slight issue, since i do work full time.
Blood work...i had a full workup before. And a few months after cycle to make sure i normalized. I wasn't sure about getting that done on cycle, didn't want to tell the doc what im doing.
I feel like the test was real based on my increase in body hair, puffy nips, an occasional body ache.... also got it from a reputable source from this site.
RustyhookerPowerlifting or bodybuilding? Theres a huge difference for me on strength or gaining mass. 4 sets bodybuilding wont do much.
You also just posted calories. Calories of what? 2700 g of carbs? Break it down.
Goals....cut or bulk...you cant do both
Bodybuilding is my goal. Bulking is my goal now, although I'm aware my body fat could come down a bit, i want more size preferably.
To clarify, i do 4 sets of each workout. An example:
4x10 incline bench
4x10 flat bench
4x10 decline cable press
4x10 pec dec
4x10 tricep vbar press
4x10 dumbbell tricep kickback
You are Overtraining bud - Cut the working sets down to 3, get rid of the pec dec and cable press and substitute with dumbell flyes.
How about something more like this:
Day 1 upper body
Day 2 lower body
Day 3 rest (mild cardio)
Day 4 push
Day 5 pull
Day 6 legs
Dat 7 rest (mild cardio)
-Upper workout
Bench press. 3x 4-6
Row. 3x 6-8
Overhead press. 3x 8-10
Lat pull. 3x 10-12
Face pull. 3x 10-15
Squat. 3x 10-12
Deadlift. 3x 6-8
Leg extension 3x10
Calf raise. 3x10
-Push workout
Incline dumbbell press 3x 8-10
Flat dumbbell press. 3x 8-10
Lateral raise, cable. 4x 10-12
Overhead rope ext. 3x 12-15
Bar tricep pressdown. 3x 8-10
-Pull workout
Pull ups. 3x 8-10
Seated Row. 3x 8-10
Rev pec dec. 3x 8-10
Face pulls. 3x 8-10
Incline dbell curl 3x 8-10
Hammer curl. 3x 8-10
Squats
Lunges
Calf raise
My lower body is naturally more developed than my upper body, so my focus with this is hitting upper body movements 2x per week. If i need to skip a day for time savings, I'll eliminate a leg day.
Ive just started logging each workout with reps and weight in a spreadsheet on my phone in order to ensure progressive overload. Rest times will be avg 1 min, unless it's heavier stuff like squats, then 2 min rest.
Currently diet is 2700 clean calories, while NOT on gear. I expect to increase on gear, maybe 3000. I eat basically the same thing each day, only change out types of meat. Minimal sugar, lots of water.
Simple diet breakdown:
Fat 63g
Carb 262g
Protein 230g
Current weight 207lb
Bf 15-18%
BigCactusLook up progressive overload and make sure you apply that to your routine.
I think you should bulk up before you rocomp since your first cycle didn't get results.
Wow So first cycle included 6 weeks of Anadrol, second cycle is 10 weeks of Tren & Masteron!!
If you didnt see results on your 1st cycle either you weren't ready or did something wrong. I had the best growth ever and still have that beef.
Do a lot of research on what you want and for what its worth imo stay away from tren.
All I see is too less food ! 2,7k that's a 16wks out intake...
That was my first thought. But considering we dont know his workouts or cardio, I went with too high.... Let's see how this transpires when he provides his workouts.
Ask yourself this:
Did I do blood work before and during cycle? If yes number 3 if not 2
2. Why did I not check and make sure it was real test? And if it was can I blame the drugs for not making me blow up or get results?
3. The test was real so I'm to blame why my first cycle sucked. Should I maybe revisit my diet and training before I start another cycle or should I once again blame the drugs and next cycle add more test and several other compounds?
Hopefully by now you see a pattern. It's not the drugs, it's you.
Change your training, change you diet, get more rest.
THEN do another cycle when your shit is in order.
Otherwise enjoy failure after failure.
I wouldn't call test and anadrol a basic beginners cycle and you really need to rethink this if you didn't get any real results with it. Personally I'm on my first cycle ever just pinning 400mg of test e a week and I'm making pretty decent gains nothing mind blowing but definitely significantly more than i would naturally. Also i weigh less than you and eat quite a lot more calories than you do to make gains, so just adding more compounds won't do anything if you don't eat enough it will just damage your body.
Test only! This is to much for your 2nd cycle buddy.
I agree, however, people do what people want. Unfortunately, looks like OP has sights set
You’re right bro!
Molinin302Do you think deca would be a bad idea for his second run?
Yes because it’s a 19 nor
AnonYes, because he hasn't dialed in his ai with a typical 500wk cycle. Also you can make sick gains for a few cycles of just 500. He's doing something else wrong, and steroids won't fix that. There's no fucking way you can run test+adrol and not make gains if you're eating right and actually putting plates up.
It's important to figure out things about how you react to certain things first, he should have done bloods and seen how fast he aromatizes. Then figured out how much ai he needs to keep it in check, then with that info he could adjust for another cycle with more test. Without that basic starter info you're setting yourself up for problems down the road.
Molinin302I missed that, there's been no bloodwork at all? That's no bueno.
Why didn’t you get any results from your first cycle?
What was your goal for the first cycle?
I would concentrate on the answers to the above questions rather than adding more steroids.
Your 2nd cycle is way too much, no need for Tren and mast is best used when your sub 10% bodyfat.
Your calories seem low as well,
Way too much compounds for your 2nd cycle man. No prolactin preventative like caber? I would suggest getting that bodyfat down some. Really THINK about this man. You're going from injecting twice a week to every other day. That is a task in itself. I hope that by now, you are completely comfortable with injecting and are privy to more than 5 spots.
Im not familiar with caber, I'll look it up, thanks! That's exactly why i asked on here. First cycle i only injected alternating glutes. No issues with that other than twisting around to see better. I was told arm, arm, thigh, thigh is best for eod
The least frequently you can pin a site the better. For 1ml injs. or lower I rotate R delt, L delt, R pec, L peck and for larger volumes I rotate R quad, L quad, R glute, L glute. Though last L glute pin had a gusher and it freaked me out. Never seen blood squirt from my body before lol. Didnt hurt at all, but had a nice bruise. Aspirated bubbles, so must have nicked something upon retrieval of pin
Just make sure you are rotating injection sites, like L glute, R glute, L Delt, R delt, etc. theres 3 separate spots in the shoulders you can hit, 2 in the glutes. Plenty of areas, also dont skip out on pinning glutes. Glutes are prime real estate for AAS injections