+ 3 Stacking, Shotgunning and Rotating your Gear.
Stacking refers to taking more than one drug at a time, shotgunning refers to taking many (up to 10 or more!) drugs at a time. One of the reasons why modern bodybuilders are so much better than guy's in the 60's is through shotgunning. Years ago, if you were on the gas ou would probably take 3 Dbol a day and a pin of test a week.
Today, experienced bodybuilders often take 6,8 or even more than 10 drugs at a time. Some people may think this is dangerous or extreme (this is a game of extremes), but there is no reason that it has to be any more dangerous than taking one drug at a time. The most important factor is the TOTAL DOSAGE of drugs taken. Taking 600mg a week of 6 different drugs is no more dangerous than taking 600mg of one type of drug, depending on the course of the particular drugs taken. In fact shotgunning is often a lot safer than taking only one drug. This is shown in the modern way of using Anapolin, in a very small dose stacked with a lot of other safer drugs. This is definately safer than the way Anapolin was used a few years ago, with bodybuilders taking 3 to 4 a day ( I am guilty of this. Wish I wasn't though) and nothing else!
Stacking and shotgunning seem to slow down receptor shutdown, which means better gains on the smaller total dosages. Another advantage. The most popular stack is to take about 2 different orals and around 3 types of injectables.
Once a bodybuilder has experienced the effect of using 6,8 or more different drugs at one time it is rare that they will go back to using just one or two. All experienced bodybuilders stack a decent amount of deca with their other gearto help avoid joint pain and tendinitis. A common amount is to make half the amount of the oil based injectables taken as Deca or another Nandrolone.
Now for rotating.This is another technique that experienced bodyuilders use to reduce receptor shutdown. Every few weeks during the cycle they change a drug for another. Even a small change, like Nandrolone Decanote for Nandrolone Phenylpropionate can do the trick. Sustanon can be changed for Test P or Test C.
For best results, shotgunning and rotating are used together, and this is popular with most experienced bodybuilders.
This is just a sample of how it can be done. This is NOT A MUST DO list but simply a guide.
1. Always use an injectable Nandrolon in your stack, preferably 50 -200mg a week.
2. Always use a fair amount of injectable androgens, 100-400mg a week of oil based test when training for mass.
3. Always use orals in your stack. They increase creatine phosphate synthesis and strength alot more than injectables.
4. Try to reduce the amount of toxic orals that you taketo a minimum. The safer ones are Primo tabs, Proviron or Orabolin.
5. Always make the cycle a decent length, for the best results 10-14 weeks.
6. Always increase the doses constantly and gerularly throughout the cycle.
7. Always stack in at least 1 Proviron tab a day.
8. If possible, rotate drugs every 4 weeks with similar acting drugs.
This is NOT FOR INEXPERIENCED USERS. Just putting some info out there for people to show them that there are a few different options as to how you can cycle your drugs for max effect. Good luck all and keep lifting big.
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Great post walla... But also one of the reasons admin should look into Nitti's suggestion for a Vets page... You know some 23yr old knuclehead with 2cycles under his belt is going to try to fast track himself to Mr. Universe now LOL!
...and I have just recently came to the conclusion that adding nandro to all of mu cycles is probably a good idea from this point on (not a kid anymore)
X2 on both points Hwood. I just think it may be hard to distinguish who is allowed to be called a vet. Low karma does not qualify who is a Vet. We'd have to do some work figuring out who qualifies brother. A great idea though.
Vets or not, this is a bodybuilding and powerlifting subforum, I think gear should be allowed to be discussed as it pertains to these sports otherwise what's the point? And if some 23 year old is gonna fuck himself up, honestly the last place it's going to be is stumbling into this currently virtually unknown subforum. Much easier to find out how to do that on the main by sites out there. And as it pertains to bodybuilding, competing while doing real on/off cycles is becoming more and more rare. Running two cycles a year is not optimal for bodybuilding. Now on the same token I don't think 18 year olds should be on cruise control for life. This is just a I'm up past my bedtime rambling post. Last night it was texts about how fucked up America really is.
I agree this sub forum is more appropriate but this post was in general when I replied
I know it was. And I certainly am not the one who has a problem with it being in general either, people are going to run whatever cycle they want anyway, half the people who say they're running test only on their first cycle are going to lie about it, it's just the way it is. I'd rather insight into the truth than be blind to why and how people are making progress continually once they've achieved a level beyond what most would consider normal use.
I don't see it as going blind, I see it as eroids tries to put out the best info on how to cycle safely while making optimal gains. Sure everyone is going to do what they want and make mistakes. None of US had proper info and guidance but now that we have a collective force behind is to guide ppl the right way don't we have a social obligation to do so? The youngsters will (in all likelihood continue to think they know better (it's the nature of youngsters to do so) but that doesn't mean we should encourage and/or make it easily accessible for them to do serious damage or even help them to plateau their gains earlier than necessary because they are impatient
My .02
I agree completely with you.
Lol PM me bro it's been a while:-)
Yeah it's a good idea the Vet area but it would be very hard to work out I agree. Unfortunately you can't just rely on peoples honesty these days. I have been using for a long time but still wouldn't consider myself a Vet. We here in Oz now have access to compounds that were all but impossible to get. We had heard about them but had never used them. Things like tren, mast and the like were mythical items untill recently. So most of us have used them but not for as long as our overseas brothers. So on that I feel a Vet should be someone that has used these compounds numerous times and in varying ways. But again how do you police it.
Nandrolone gets such a bullshit rep here. I'm sorry, but there's no fucking way eq is superior to nandrolone in decanoate or phenylpropionate ester when it comes to feeling great moving weights and strength gains. Sure eq has its place, but can easily be replaced with better compounds unless you're a beginner. And even then.. Why not deca? And I am in full support of a subforum where we can talk about real cycles.
Haha cheers mate, yeah the nandrlones are a great compound. I don't leave home without them lol
Here is one I placed on the board a fair while ago. I thought it time to bump it back up as there are heaps of new members around now. I hope you enjoy the read Boys and Girls
Everytime I switch esters like sus to cyp or cyp to enth and etc. I always seem to get some kind of estrogen rebound effect/ lag time. Does this ever happen to anyone? Not sure if some of it is just mental.
I have to addmitt it mate but I haven't had that problem with estrogen rebound. The only thing I can think of is that Test E out of all the Tests is the one most likely to Aromataze. Switching to it or from it may be ( I say MAY BE NOT DEFINATELY) be the problem. Is there anyone else out there that can shed some light on this.
Interesting post. It's the first time I hear about shotgunning but permanent receptor shutdown is one of my mine concerns, so thanks!
Don't forget to post some examples of your shotgunning cycles; I'm intrigued about how to switch a drug for a similar acting one.
Oh, and why always one Proviron a day? Does it keep the Doctor away? I like proviron but try to stay away from it knowing it's only DHT and doesn't have much (if any) anabolic effect.
Already have done an example of one of my pre-comp cycles bro. It is in the Steroid cycles area pre-comp help. As for the proviron it is one of the lest harmful orals and taking orals seems to aid in nitrogen retension along with a few more benefits as well. SEnd me a PM bro and I can go into it a bit deeper for you if you want.
I tend to read a lot and not post very much. This is definately a lot of insight into the world of competetive bodybuilding for someone like myself. I have been training for about 5 years and have only just started out on the aas in the last year or so with a couple of basic test/dbol and test/deca cycles under my belt.
I can relate a bit to what you have said about rotating and its good to read this as i have noticed towards the end of a 12 week cycle the effects of the compound im using to wear off even after increasing calories to adjust for the weight gained i do believe that the effectiveness of the steroid is lessening and i find myself increasing the dose, i think next time i might try exactly what you have stated and change compound. For me as a beginner i will stick with something simple as you have stated from test e to test c/p etc.
I would love to hear your thoughts wallabokkie on blast/cruise cycles as compared to cycle on and off with pct.
dansta123top post brother!