posted Tue, 11/24/2015 - 18:37
4481
Switching compounds Mid-cycle NEED ADVICE
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Hey guys, so I've been running a test p (600mg/wk) tren a (450mg/wk), and anadrol (50mg/day) for about 8 weeks. For the next 8 weeks I plan on running test c (750MG/wk) tren a (400mg/wk) mast p (400mg/wk) and NPP. Three questions, 1) what is the best way to transition from test p, to test c. 2) Will NPP work well with this cycle? 3) what MG per week should I run of npp? Thanks for your help, much appreciated!
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RustyhookerDid you figure out your pct yet? Pharma? Post info you learned.
if I see anymore back and forth foolishness on here I'm going to blow a gasket.
Despite getting off on the wrong foot...it is a positive thing hanging on and reading extensively through the forums ie. stickies in yellow. This truly is the most knowledgeable, unbiased AAS site there is. These guys are hardcore and very strict in their approach to using gear. The guys that have posted here(and there are more that haven't) aren't a bunch of meatheads pumping bro science congratulating reckless use. Your rise from adversity is definitely admirable. Sounds like you've been pretty battered and bruised. Which is all the more reason to check yourself so as to not prematurely put yourself through the ringer when it can be avoided.
When this sites members see a guy puting together these multiple compound cycles they expect to see a guy that competes, steps on stage. And it gets angering when that is not the case. I know ya know what Im saying. Other than that...mass stack cycles aren't warranted...ever. There is absolutely no need to commit yourself to such rigorous gear protocols to better yourself physically.
You must have a strong mind to have battled through what you went through. Lets keep puting it to use in the right manner. Through intense lifting and eating the right foods in the right amounts to grow, with a dash of gear to aid in recovery from said battles under the weights, and to more efficiently utilize the nutrients in the foods you eat!
Try and understand the frustration of the guys with an open mind. Some of these guys are the real deal. Its hard to take kindly to the youth bastardizing a world they know intimately...by slamming more and more shit and not living up to what they know to be possible with far less gear. Lifting and pushing through mental and physical barriers takes utter aggressive will! Can we be shocked when a member gets their head ripped off for being reckless. No! There is no one to blame in this game but yourself when things dont add up.
You seem to have common sense, what gets ones attention and makes them understand they are fucking up, a polite "please dont do that" with a comforting voice...or a swift slap upside the head. Anyhow let this be a learning curve brother...there is nothing stopping you from becoming the best version of yourself! The main focus to that must be the lifting and food consumption! Those are the fkn Rottweiler's! The gear should be the unintimading non lethal Chihuahua there just barking,"yea that's right fkrs mess with my boys see what happens" hahaha ya dig brother...this place is a gold mine if you dig with a positive attitude! Knuckles and have a happy thanksgiving! Edit:while I was struggling to type this novel...Darth pretty much summed it up hahaha and ifits post prompted this post...in any event...
First of all, thanks for taking the time to write all of this. You really put things into a perspective that is helping me to understand what I'm dealing with better. I understand there is a wealth of knowledge up in here and I plan on listening to what I've been told and completely altering my AAS usage. The reality is that I was so beaten physically by situations from my past that the feeling of power I have obtained through training and juice has become addictive and I find myself constantly pushing the limits with what I'm putting in my body. I do have con sense, and I don't want to be physically fucked up for the rest of my life due to some bad decisions I made in my mid 20's. Thanks again for taking your time to help me understand.
Awesome choice! I have been there brother...I abused gear in my early days and now I'm a slave to trt. I had no one or a internet site for that matter to slap my dumb ass! I believe if you take this opportunity seriously to have a reboot, cycle off, embark on a thorough pct, get blood work done, there is a chance you can stimulate natural production again!
I can tell you as well from experience, I have made the most quality gains from test only and maybe another compound such as eq at the smallest amounts than I ever did slamming ridiculous amounts! And the gains are real! Dont worry, the gear wont define your greatest moments physically to come, your intense maturation of diet and training will! Smash on them weights and dinner plates! And here is a +1 for manning up and choosing to take the path of discipline and determination rather than reckless abandon...knuckles!
Unfortunately, if you ask for advice we are going to go all in including our opinions on your current appearance and conditioning so you need to be prepared for that regardless of whether or not you asked for it. Too many guys looking to use gear to make up for bad diet, training or genetics and these guys are going to call it as they see it.
I will second that. You have been given (freely) advice from some of the most knowledgeable members we have. Nobody has led you astray here. You have been lost on your own account. You are only 25 years old yet you are making mistakes that may not ever heal. I understand that like most 25 year olds (the rest of your life) is not possible to grasp but it is real bro. Stop what you are doing and PCT, then pray you haven't done irreversible damage.
I hear you, not trying to argue at all but just want to know why do you think I have done irreversible damage? I have been on test and tren for less than 8 weeks, and 50 mg of anadrol/day for less than 3 weeks. This is a pretty common cycle that I know a ton of people have done.I was under the impression this can be run for 8 weeks (obviously the drol for only 4). With proper pct, what makes you think this relatively short albeit powerful cycle would cause irreversible damage in me but not hundreds of others?
As I explained, my diet is not the problem, neither is the way I train. I was able to put on 40 lbs of mostly muscle without the help of AAS. due to extensive damage to my body I was unable to continue making gains without the extra help. I definitely don't feel that 5'8 , 180 lbs, 10% body fat are stats that are worthy of insult. Especially considering the fact that when I began my fitness journey I was completely injured from head to toe at 130 lbs.
rileyMadison, read this: https://www.eroids.com/forum/general/general-talk/ruined-by-praise-or-sa...
You want answers to questions and people keep telling you that the path you're on is not a good one. That is your answer and if you'd be willing to listen, you might actually gain quite a bit from this (literally and figuratively).
Dude.. I already said I was going to drop the tren at the end of week 8 and begin the process of post cycle. I asked the question, listened to the answers, responded to the incredibly disrespectful insults, then changed my course. So how exactly are you categorizing my actions as "unwilling to listen"?
It's kind of bs that my karma points have taken a hit due to me asking a question. I didn't break any rules or disrespect anyone. Not cool
Still don't think you were disrespectful? I disagree.
Dude are you serious? All i said was that I didn't ask for anyones personal opinion about how I look. And that was after I was told that I look like shit. I didn't ask to have my body critiqued and insulted, clearly.. clearly... I was the one who was disrespected for NO reason and I felt my response was actually quite appropriate and not disrespectful in anyway considering the comment I was responding too.
Then what you find disrespectful differs greatly from my opinion.
Just to clarify.. it's disrespectful when I tell someone I didn't ask for their opinion on my appearance, but its not disrespectful to tell someone they look like shit? 2 torn acls, 1 right shoulder that chronically dislocates, 1 left shoulder which was surgically repaired, c4 c5 c6 fractures in my back, 8 holes punctured in small intestine, 13 breaks in right hand, 1 compound fracture in my right elbow and trust me there's more. I have worked my ass off to get to where I am which I am damn proud of, for someone to swoop in without having any knowledge of my past or what I've had to overcome and insult me because I was at 14% body fat 8 months ago is probably the worst form of disrespect I have encountered in a long time. But go ahead, please explain your fascinating views on respect and how I have some how been the person in this thread that deserves loss of karma points...
Fella, if that doesn't answer your question I can't help you nor do I have the inclination to.
Right.. and what did I say before that? And how much flame was I getting for no reason? You don't insult the way someone looks for asking a question and then be suprised when you get called a prick. You still haven't answered the question, how is it okay for certain people to flame me the way they did when all I did was ask a question.
I explained that to you 4 hours ago in a post lower down if you look.
How is possible to be so stubborn? You don't insult people because you possess knowledge they don't have when they ask for help. Someone who does that.. is a prick. I stated a fact, some of you stated insults. If you look through this thread there were a few people who criticized me but did it in a constructive way, I'm willing to listen to that all day. And i did. But if your going to insult me, I'm going to call you a prick. That doesn't make me disrespectful, it's called standing up for yourself against unneeded and unhelpful comment.
You're misdirecting your anger. I've not called you anything yet you seem to want to pick a fight with me as well. I've told you I find your approach disrespectful, you don't agree, that's fine, get over it.
Booo Hooo....happy thanksgiving.....
Thanks for your contribution to this post. Next time im going to make sure to take any questions I have to a sports physician. I ask a question pertaining to something I was unsure about and other then the few helpful responses I have been beraided, disrespected, insulted, and somehow ended up losing karma points. Aside from the few who took the time to gently tell me what I was doing wrong and offer a solution, you guys are complete pricks and make people feel real uncomfortable asking questions.
Beat me to it...
You claim you always recover well... Let's see the bloodwork to back all that up.
You're running 16 weeks of Tren and you're only at 183lbs and 14% BF? Your diet is severely lacking if that is the case, and I'm speaking from experience. Go get your liver values checked, 8 weeks of drol might have them all wonky.
The best solution for you in my honest opinion is to drop the Tren immediately, run out the test p for another two weeks. Then two weeks after start an intensive 6 week long PCT.
If you need HGH to hold onto your gains, then again, diet is your problem, not lack of drugs. I've been there, done that, learned the hard way.
It's not going to be any fun when your erections are less predictable than a woman's period.
RustyhookerAll short esters currently. Dude should pct 2 days after last pin and rethink things
No notes posted on ai, prolactin, blood test or pct plan
Nice catch, completely missed the fact that short esters need shorter time between pins and PCT. Thanks for correcting my derp moment!
RustyhookerNo worries bro. Typically folks switch from longs TO shorts. This op is trying to go backwards, not realizing the hormonal dip.
Hope he researches foods so he can beast up in future times.
Thank you for some productive insight. Those stats are from last January when I joined the site, I am now closer to 180 at 10 percent body fat. I only ran drol for 4 weeks btw, not 8. I'm going to drop the tren but for my body personally, a cycle is not even worthwhile unless I run for at least 12 weeks.
Why is a cycle not worthwhile unless it's run for 12 weeks, what's your reasoning? And why didn't you start from the get go with long esters if that is your belief?
How can you be sure you've recovered? Do you have bloodwork to back those claims up?
Again, I don't believe more drugs are the answer. You've clearly been through hell and back (so have many of the members on here) but now that you've got a base to work with you need to refocus on your diet to be holding onto gains and keeping the coming. What is your diet like currently?
I once more strongly advise you not to keep running Tren... Stick the ending with only test and then get a heavy PCT going. Unless you post up bloods to prove recovery I'm going to assume you're going off "feels" and you honestly can't "feel recovered."
my reasoning was that I normally don't start to see major increases in strength until 5th or 6th week so I felt like stopping 2 weeks after I'm starting to see the big gains would be totally cheating myself out of great results. I got my bloods done last April 2 weeks after my pct and the doc told me everything was looking good other than a little bit below average test levels which from what I understand is normal at that point. However, I only ran the tren for 4 weeks that time vs 8 already this time so I understand the damage is going to be much worse this time. When I'm on cycle I pretty much stick to 250p/250c/80f. When I'm off I cut my carbs almost by 50% because my body tends to put fat on quickly with the same amount of carbs I can handle while on cycle. I appreciate your help and your kindness, I'm going to listen to your advice and discontinue all compounds except test for 2 more weeks until I hit my pct and I will leave hgh out.
I'm being nice (which is a rarity) but the other commenters on this thread are not in the wrong. I've done goofed already, so why should you have to do the same to get to the same conclusions I have? Sometimes it takes a kick in the balls to reset your thinking process.
I saw your PCT below and it isn't adequate. You need to run it for a minimum of 4 weeks. Ideally 6 as 19nor shutdown isn't easy to recover from.
Fat gain is part of the game. Keep your intake higher post cycle to keep your gains.
Is that you on the avatar picture?........
EDIT...... ill tell you what! im sick of holding back and this time im telling you straight you look like shit from five years worth of gear!.... fkn stupid stacks and ass zero knowledge, 5 years and you come asking bullshit questions and looking for a c0-sign on a stupid array .......... Get to fuck you dummy!!
First of all, when I first started training seriously at 18, my body was severely emaciated due to extensive injuries from a car accident. Including punctured holes in my bowel which required intestine to be removed and a broken back. I was 130 lbs with zero body fat and was completely unable to put on any weight because of the extensive damage. Through training, eating in a calorie surplus and then eventually adding in test, by the time I was 23 I was able to get up to 165 pounds with almost full mobility in my body back, with the exception of my left shoulder which was broken at the collarbone, and scapula at 6 different places. That shoulder joint still doesn't and never will rotate fully. That picture was taking during my last cycle in January when I ran 8 weeks of test, adding in tren and masteron for the final 4 weeks. The fact that I was able to get my body to 185 lbs is nothing short of a miracle. Test/tren/mast and test/tren/drol are the only cycles I have ever run other than test only, which I know for a fact aren't "stupid stacks". I never asked anybody to cosign anything, none. I asked 3 simple fucking questions which none of you have answered, instead you in particular have decided to sit on your high horse and throw insults at me. You have no idea what I've been through to get to where I am today, furthermore I didn't fucking ask you for your opinion on my knowledge or your opinion on how I look, which I know is good based on where I came from. I asked if npp will work well with tren/test, and I asked if there's a good way to transition from test p to c since p is all I have ever used. Comments like yours are useless and don't help anybody, sounds like you have some personal and roid rage issues you need to deal with before hopping on the Internet to dish your personal opinions.
You're missing Vikings point entirely.
That's you in your avatar pic right? Considering your condition, you've no need to run heavy comp prep type cycles. Irrespective of your accident, doesn't mean everyones going to say "ok then". You're taking too many risks considering where you're at physique wise.
Sometimes it takes "Tough Love" to wake a MoFo up and make him realise the error of his ways.
Looking at your new plan it looks like that is exactly what you needed....... no need for thanks :).
Comments like mine are not useless........ your plan of running duel 19s with lacking knowledge was a recipe for disaster........... you should thanking me for saving you from totally frying your HPTA and potentially shutting yourself down so hard that its nigh impossible to recover.. poxy cycle PCT is not adequate for what you had planned.
No need to answer back flippantly or i may just tie you into a knot.
Rustyhooker@Viking
" I asked 3 simple fucking questions which none of you have answered, instead you in particular have decided to sit on your high horse and throw insults at me. You have no idea what I've been through to get to where I am today, furthermore I didn't fucking ask you for your opinion on my knowledge or your opinion "
You're messing up your body. It will be permanent.
I dont understand how I'm doing anything drastically different then anybody else running gear who isn't permanently hurting their body. I've run 8 weeks of tren, now I'm stopping it to pct in 2 weeks. Hear of people all the time who run 12,16,20 week cycles including myself that haven't permanently wrecked their bodies.
RustyhookerThe goofballs running tren past 6 weeks are permanently on trt. The shutdown sucks! You say you fully recovered, wheres the blood tests as proof?
You're gonna pct in 2 weeks? You're on short esters.
Whats your pct plan?
Next time post forum prior to starting. You could have avoided all this. You gotta rethink this tren crap if your plans are getting big. Food is king. Stash the tren til stage prep. Use real bulking gear with huge food plan.
Yes I'm dropping the tren, and running test p for 2-3 more weeks lowering the dosage each week. Then 2 days after last injection I will start my pct of nolva 20/20/20/20, clomid 100/50/50, and hcg 500 iu per wee1k (I started last week). And I have had arimidex in hand but have had no need to use it.
Those nolva/clomid doses are better for a test e cycle only pct. You've been running tren and drol with test p...reconsider those dosages and drop the hcg altogether you'll end up doing more harm than good.
RustyhookerBetter research the ai pct forums. Hcg on pct will keep you shut down. Doses etc need work.
You always say what needs to be said brother...hope everything is going as smooth as can be since the op.
Yes all is good brother, healing nicely and i have been training with a tight strapped belt and slightly lighter to keep the core from tensing too hard... stitches out this sat morning and then back to business as usual very shortly i should think
Right on! Lighter lifting is still lifting! Ha! Try and keep a warrior from lifting...no sir! Glad to see you're on the up and up and healing at a nice pace. Knuckles brother Viking!
BRO FIST..... Boooooooooooom!!!
16 wks is to long for tren brother. 8 weeks is as long as it should be ran. I know some probably won't agree but your shutting yourself down pretty hard. You should defintenlty listen to Rusty. A respected member in this community. The other guys are giving good advice to. PCT as soon as possible. What does your PCT look like brother?
Should I drop the Tren from the last 8 weeks then and supplement that with a bigger dose of mast and maybe anavar or winstrol?
I would drop the tren and consider pct here very soon...
This is my 4th cycle. I've always run for a minimum of 16 weeks, once I ran for 20 weeks. With proper pct my body always bounces back very well, and I'm figuring with adding hgh to my pct I should retain gains and bounce back even better.