posted Thu, 07/23/2015 - 05:21
3265
how does placement and dosage look?
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I'm curious what you guys think of this cycle. I'm at 180 right now. 8-9% bf. 32 years old and been lifting for 10 years on and off. The last 2 years straight. This is prob my 8th cycle also. My goal is to the same as most. To gain the most possible muscle while staying lean. Diet is on point. I keep track of my macros and eat clean. Try to keep my protein to at least 1 gram per pound of body weight. This is all human grade accept the arimidex but even that's a very well known brand. So here it is.
Sustanon - 750mg/week 1-16
Deca - 500mg/week 1-12
Dbol - 60mg/day 1-8
Arimidex - .5mg eod 1-16
Caber - .5mg every 3.5 days 4-12
Pct - hcg and clomid
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Set you a fr bro
Accepted
I really like the changes man, but idk if dbol+high test is really what you need if you're trying to stay lean. I like what someone suggested of high tren lower test
No I love the idea. The problem is I already have it and don't have the money to get a bunch more tren at this point. I'm not completely afraid of gaining bf. I don't think it would be much with a good diet anyway and I want to stack on some serious muscle.
RustyhookerHow tall...full stats?
5'7
180-185
8%bf
32yo
RustyhookerIf your goal is bulking should EAT BIGGER and figure out a simple deca/dbol cycle. For your weight you'll need simple mass.
Chat with makwa and get foods on point. Can't be scared to hit 12% Bodyfat to add solid mass. I'm a puny 5-4 and 195. Eat eat eat
I can deal with 12% haha. Maybe I'll save the tren then and get more when I need it. Run a test/tren cycle with higher tren right before summer to cut it up. But for now run the tes/dbol/deca. I'll hit up makwa to see what changes need to be made. Hopefully he's down to help. I don't think I need a whole lot. Thanks for the info man. And 5'4 almost 200 is beast. Haha. Good shit.
RustyhookerBoom! Agree...summer match your esters and cut. Add your mass back on so when you cut, your base is already thick as a tank.
Foods...always the hardest to do. Good luck sir! Kick ass out there
Thanks man. I really appreciate the help and everyone else's. This is why I love this place. Finally talk to people that know more than me for a change. I made the changes in the post.
RustyhookerMight look at your pct. Clomid/Nolvadex stack.
I made a couple changes. What do you guys think now? The only thing I really see that's weird is running the dbol but I love running orals and I already have it. Plus I want to bulk a little. I'm sure the tren will keep the bloat down.
the only thing that i know of that will keep bloat down other than an aggressive AI is masteron. it helps put water in the right places (i.e. in the muscle not under the skin) but a heavy heavy dose would be needed to counter the bloat from that much test.
With 750/week?
keeping your test low (~250mg/week) and tren high will keep bloat down and sides down ime. ..lets just say id personally need about 600mg+ of mast to keep off bloat from 300-350mg of test. thats why i just end up keeping my test below 300mg if im trying to stay bloat free and hard. if its winter and i just care about adding size and thickness, i up the test and add in proviron at 100mg/day and that helps with bloat too a bit and frees up more test
Yeah. I just don't have that much tren. I love the idea though. I tried it once and got hella cut. But the test turned out to be fake. Prolactin came in hard and was not easy to fight off the sides. But I know that won't happen again. Just been afraid to do it. Lol
I haven't heard of tren keeping the bloat down, but then again I have never ran it so maybe it does. Bloat would be more of an issue with judicial use of yuor AI.
What do you recommend? Pushing the arimidex down the line? How far do you think?
right now I am doing fine with .25mg of Adex EOD with 750mg sust. So that might be a place to start and adjust if needed.
one more tip, if you are absolutely gun-hoe on running two 19-nors (nandrolone and trenbolone) which i DO advise against and NOT condoning it nor recommending it. at least use tren acetate and npp. that way if sides arise and are too much you can drop one of them or both and have them clear much quicker.
I know man. That was my original plan but my damn source was out and only had deca. like I said though. More looking for solutions and no so much criticism. Although I do appreciate constructive criticism.
cmon man, theres 100s of good sources on this site where one can find anything ...literally any PED they want. and the more you talk about your goal the more tweeks i can advise. if your goal is to stay lean and add muscle have you thought about ditching everything and just running higher tren low test? my go to stack for what your goal is. dbol, nandrolone ect will not aid in your goal of staying lean. those compounds are more geared towards bulking. of course diet dictates whether you are bulking or cutting not compounds but those compounds need calories and lots of them to get the most out of them. save your liver the stress, and save your money. id just run high tren low test for what your trying to achieve and save the other stuff for winter when you really want to commit to a true bulk
dosage looks brutal, placement = trt, this cycle will end your natural test for good more than likely.
Really? So what would you suggest as the highest I can run to get the most possible without killing natural test?
heaps of tweeks can be made, thousand of sust isnt needed, you can lower that dose for a start, you say as much muscle as possible while staying lean, thats diet, i would chose one 19 nor, drop dbol, already alot cleaner nd healthier, less oil, less compounds.
you have experience with mast? i like doing test/deca with test prop/ mast prop taper, lean out at end, harden up and condition the bloat deca gives a long with tweeking ai dose, easier transition into pct from shorts at end too
Bro you are too little to be running gear and this is way too much. You need to work on your diet because after 7 cycles you certainly should be over 180lbs so that needs to tell you something is wrong. Fix your diet before you put anything else into your body. Also you're mixing 19nors with the tren and deca. This is generally not advised and is frowned upon. You don't want to mess yourself up do you? Freaking eat bro.
depending on how tall this guy is, its completely plausible for him to be in great shape and have a well built physique at only 180lbs. im currently at 180 and i look wayyy better than the fatter 230-240lb taller guys at my gym. ive learned there is a point when your body simply cannot carry around huge amounts of muscle without excess androgens in the blood. if this guy is cycling and coming off he will always revert back to his natty max potential, no matter how much food he consumes. most guys get fat from trying to keep all the weight they gain from a cycle. unless hes dipping into hgh, and that other taboo peptide that isnt to be discussed then theres no reason why he "has" to be over 180.
to the OP, yes two 19-nors in a cycle is a bit hardcore, have you ever done it before? i know a few experienced guys who do it often but they know their stuff and youd never catch them posting asking questions if their cycle looks ok. i would advise against it personally. also .5mg of caber a day is too much and unessesary. .5 2x/week is sufficient. and that stuff isnt cheap so dont waste it. also i wouldnt introduce it until you need to. ive always had it on hand but till now havent needed to dip into it when running tren nor nandrolone. it has been shown to lower igf-1 levels so no need to be lowering that and wasting an expensive product unless sides absolutely warrant its use.
Rustyhookermust ask for stats!!! You're posting info on a guy that posted 200 lbs at 5-8...but now he's 180??? So need some info don't we?
checked his porfile before i commented bro. had his stats filled out. and he mentioned he cut down to 180 from 200 and is now sub 10%bf. proceeded from there
Sorry. I meant .5 every 3.5 days. Not sure why I put that. And the only reason I'm asking is because it's higher than normal. I still haven't got an answer of the highest dosages recommended which is what I'm looking for if someone thinks it's too high.
fr sent. i think 500mg of both is excessive especially if youve never ran the two of them together. i wouldnt run them together to start but ive seen most people who try it will set a max dose for their 19-nor and instead of running one 19-nor at that dose. split it in half between the two compounds. right now you have 1g of test and 1g of 19-nors which personally i think is excessive.
also .5 of arimidex/day is a bit agressive for an AI. are you estrogen prone? im a big advocate of aromasin over arimidex its just a much better drug imo. so if funds permit id get that instead. 12.5mg/day is good for me on higher aromatizing compound doses. and its very beneficial to run aromasin through pct as well. also, i know there are many schools of thought on using hcg in pct vs on cycle. i can only speak from personal experience. 250iu 2x/week throughout the cycle, then 500iu eod blast last 2 weeks or so leading up to pct. then dropping it. 1x shot of 100mcg triptorelin and then toremifene and clomid treatment for 4 weeks brought my test levels up to 700ng/dl within 4 weeks post cycle after running 19-nors for 20 weeks. so thats what id advise but i have no experience in running it during pct.
The cycle were a long time ago. My first cycle was 8 years ago. I've done one in the last three years which cut my up from 200 to 180. Also. I'm short as hell. Lol. I spent a lot of time reading on the two 19nor and came to the conclusion that if you run caber and keep your test higher you will be ok.
You still need to eat bro. I'm 5'10-5'11 and I was 250 before I did anything. No need for 2-2.5grams of hardcore anabolics weekly...
And No offense but being 250 isn't a good thing with high body fat like the photo you shared on your profile.
I posted a pic of my frame now. Just to give you an idea.
I understand it's a lot but I want to blow up. So what do you think is the max dosage I should run? Keep in mind I've ran a cycle like this before just without the deca. I've ran test at a gram of week. But I'm open to advice. That's why I asked.
It is not so much how much gear you run but the diet that goes along with that. Seems excessive to me if you were nailing a good diet for a bulk.
Well I would like to stay in a small calorie deficit and still gain muscle if that's even really possible. I'm eating 2,500 a day with 200 grams of protein per day. I don't want to add any fat obviously. I don't care about weighing 250. I'd rather be 200 lean. But what do you think I should drop it to? It's not a problem to lower it and save some. My goal is just literally the most possible without doing too much permanent damage.
Likely not going to happen
https://www.eroids.com/forum/general/general-talk/spinning-your-wheels
Bulk smart and you should be able to keep fat to a minimum but you have to accept gaining some fat. I am having great success with this method. 30lbs so far and still around 8% BF.
https://www.eroids.com/forum/general/general-talk/the-key-to-quality-mas...
I'm just bulking on 750mg sust and 50mg Adrol, but 25 lbs of that bulk came while off cycle.
Wow. That's impressive. I'll definitely read up on those links. Thank you.
if youd like to stay lean and dont want to "bulk" and add even a small amount of bf at the cost of adding much more muscle then drop the nandrolone. for what your goal is its not nessesary. tren and test will get you there with a lot less headaches along the way. tren is the only thing that i know of that will still build lean tissue in a calorie deficit. nandrolone needs calories and loves carbs. if you arent planning on being in a calorie surplus nandrolone will be a waste.
Great info man. I've ran them separately but never together. I'll drop the deca. I love tren and would much rather get that shredded tren look than a bloated bulky look. Thanks