First Cycle Question!
I've been researching for years and very interested in starting a cycle. I will be 21 in a couple of months, I know most say to wait till your about 25, but a Test only cycle that is done properly should be fine. Right now I am doing a letro cycle to combat gyno that I have developed, seems to be working wonders, I am about two weeks in and when I am satisfied with the results, or have reduced the gyno as much as possible I will taper off and continues on Nolva for two weeks to prevent rebound of Estro. If I was going to do a Test E cycle of 500 mg a week, is there a time I have to wait after I finish letro and nolva(sorta like time off from PCT)? or Would it be ok to jump into Test cycle after letro and nolva? Also during Test cycle I will be running an A.I. to keep gyno away, because I am obviously gyno prone, so In theory I will be on A.I. for about four months. Any helpful input is greatly appreciated! Just getting all my facts straight so I can move foward.
Stats if needed:
20 years old
6 foot
205, about 11 or 12 % BF
Diet and training is very much on key, and will be extremely strict throughout cycle.
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Dont wanna sound like an asshole btw. I really dont care how high you run test. Just giving you my input. Hate hearing test e, test e , test e all the time. Its really not that great of a compound. Id rather stay 7 pct all year long and gain muscle without ever gaining fat or bloat. You can say its all diet. But once you go 750+ test I dont care about you're diet you will get bloated. Unless you eat 0 carbs offcourse:).
I really dont understand the whole test 500 a week first cycle thing. If I could do everything over I would do a different cycle. Thing is about test 500 it doesnt make you look like a bodybuilder. You'll look like a furniture mover. The whole test is the best anabolic thing is so much bullshit being fed on boards. All you get from test only is bloat and fat and a little muscle which disappears once you're done with you're cycle. I use test more for medical reason during cycles. Keeping my libido up and always on low doses. Unless you're on growth hormones there is absolutely no reason to run high test.
tread-mThis comes from someone who probably is and will continue to make the mistake of thinking its about the compounds. The bloat and the negative and the loss of weight post cycle is simple inexperience. You learn over time diet is the key to the goal and the diet and the training and the proper understanding of estradial and bloods in general along with the proper understanding of reboot and post cycle habits such as lift heavy and get out of the gym while continuing to eat big and lean etc ect. The test first has become a staple as a reult of vets understanding if you dont properly learn your compounds, one at a time, you will never understand how to carve and manipulate you body properly. The proper use of aromasin and drinking large volumes of water lowering salt, so much science to this and so much for a newb to learn to succeed and that learning starts slow, knowing they will make many mistakes along the way. You still have to learn your componds one at a time and learn the synergy between the compounds and food and training and when and when not to...its a science brother and if you learn it right the science works, if you don't you're constantly just throwing compounds at the wall to see what sticks and its just a lifetime of guesswork. Its the turtle and the hare, the slow methodical turtle will win, not in such a hurry to find the "get rich quick" mentallity. I know people that never touch anything but test and have a diet that is as strict as a boot camp and have slow methodical gains over time. I'm different in that I am slow but I know the compounds well enough to want to use them for combined manipulation in a conservative way but test is the beginning and end of all success in the long run. It is what the axis wants and its not a compound you can simply discard as being second best. Its first and everything else is tied for second IMO. Test only first is a staple for a reason, that reason has to do with the hundreds of thousands of people who proved its worth over time, its not a guess, its a fact. Any argument about that will simply fall on deaf ears around here or any other board worth its salt.
No offence but with 9 years of experience and 6'3 260 LBS and 7 pct bodyfat. I think that I know what im talking about. Take whatever I said the way you like. I compete at high level and I know a thing or two about AAS and hormones. First cycle of I did was test 500 only. I regret doing it after 9 years of experience. A lot of people that I know that compete say the same thing about test. But hey id you people wanna believe what them bodybuilding boards say be my guest lol.
tread-mTotally appreciate your perspective and what works for you brother. Its not boards where i derive my opinions in fact boards were not even around for my first 10 years with compounds and after 26 yrs of use I too have a pretty good idea of test and its pertinance regarding the axis and balance along with hgh. I get you , I run designer stacks too but to degrade test to something like creatine in your estimation is silly. My first cycle in 1986 was test only, don't regret it and next couple were test and primo then jumped to deca..learned compounds slowly still not understanding diet yet in those days but you know as well as I do test is the core, you have a sauce blend in your run here and without it you would have nothing. Btw...no thyroid for suppression with your 15 iu's?
I only get about 450-500 test from the tri blend mate. It contains 70 test p, 65 tren a and 65 mast p. The growth hormone + tren is what I grow most of by FAR. Eq for the awesome strenght and steady gains. Primo for that nice polished look. Anadrol is an awesome bulking compound. I respect your experience but I really do NOT think test is core at all. I just use it to keep my libido up.
tread-mWell there in lies the answe brother, libido resulting from what? Axis balance...the two core compounds in the Male body and everything else you do is a derivative of that and has direct impact on that. See what I mean? Seriously though, I repect your experience as well and we just set this down and walk away. We're brothers in this I love good debate and you know I won this so lets move on...lmao. no I appreciate your perspective brother seriously and I'm happy for your success seriously as well.
Lol I doubt im growing from the 250-450 what I normally take with my bodyweight:D. Anyways goodluck with your future goals.
You got this brother intrigued here man! i hang with pro,bbs both male and female so have a fair idea of what these guys are running and what thier favourite compounds are,so if you dont mind can you give me an example of a typical weeks use for you and the compounds and dosages just has a comparison to what guys use,thanks in advance.
Right now in off season
Tri Blend 1cc every 36 hours
Tren Ace 1cc every 36 hours
Primobolan Ace 600 EW
Sustanon 700 EW
EQ 900 EW
Anadrol 100 ED
15 iu gh (not pharma grade) ED on average
Highly advanced,plenty off tren in there for heavy androgenics i see,a big lean muscle building stack right there with primo and eq,i can see all that working well together,a little bit too advanced for most peeps on here but i see the use for serious comp bodybuilders,something similar to what i would have run 15yrs ago to compete.
TropicanaJuiceTest for a first cycle isnt bullshit its more of a science, and a way for you to gauge how your body will react to the increase in test. Test has been around for yrs and is tested, it can be added to increase levels of testosterone as increase positive effects, you dont see doctors perscribing winny to patients, test is proven. When you take aas your body shuts down natty test levels, thats why test needs to be added with every cycle and a proper post cycle. Also your analogy of a furniture mover body is ridiculous because if your diet is spot on you can lean bulk on test or even cut on test, I know people of have ran test only cycles to cut with a spot on diet and did great, and as far as your bloating is conserned you should of had proper ancillaries on hand to combat that. also your gains shouldnt disappear off cycle completely with proper diet and training you should be able to keep most of your gains, not to mention a proper PCT.
Just so you know I dont do PCT's. Im on all year long like all people that compete at high level. Test in every cycle? You obviously have a lot to learn. And you're doctors analogy is stupid. Just because a doctor decribes it doesnt make it the king of aas.
tread-mWell we found some common ground here finally.lol...I say that joking we have plenty common ground for sure even if we disagree on a few things brother. The Doc prescribing something in and of itself may be a red flag to me. Docs have not the first clue about proper axis balance and or hormones outside of maybe thyroid as a rule. A few trt docs and some endo's get it but the doc just avoids it like the plague and btw, they don't touch on it med school for more than a quick chapter so there is no experience and no knowledge. The few docs that do get it do so because they themselves use and have taken time to personally learn about it for personal use.
Hahaha +1 for bringing the knowledge man. Even though we might not agree on everything I can see you know quite a bit. Thing is everybody responds differently to different compunds. Just have to try it out and see for yourself. Im prone to get bloated in the face pretty quick and body as well which leaves me looking like a fat piece of shit. Even if my diet is 100 pct clean. I dont react to well to deca either. I like NPP more. While some really react very good to test or deca, you really cant even compare it to the likes of tren, eq and primo imo.
tread-mHey I can be a fat piece of shit real Quick trust me! Lol. I rely on my little friend aromasin and just have to chug water like its going off the market and drop the salt. I'm on a tren run now and going to begin some short cycles after a short cruise when its over that will include combinations of all you mention and a few more. It interests me to run 4 on and 4 off just cruising prop as always with little bursts of shorts such as ace/mast p/ prop and then 4 prop cruise and roll prop/npp so on and on. Just a good way for me to clear and blast up and down quick. Have a few friends running them with success and I've done a couple similar but not a consistant stretch. Any experience with these methods?
No experience with that. I normally go on 6-16 weeks on cycles then either start a another cycle with different compounds or higher dosages or just cruise on tren a/low test+gh. It depends on the compounds. I can imagine with ace/mast p/ prop it being quite good but I would still run them at least 6 weeks. Let me know what the result are. I am interested how it will work out for you brother.
tread-mI will, I may even do 6 spurts as I get into it. If nice and effective at 4 then I like the idea of getting back in that much quicker but 6 may be the magic. Just hoping the switch ups has some long term synergistic effect as to confusion and helps keep the plateua's out of it either way.
Good +1
sgtstedankoDude, this is fucking retarded! Even for a 20 & 3/4 year old. (counting on my fingers) ; ( #Fucking Wait, dude!!!# Just my opinion, but you aren't being responsible with your body. You are too young to cycle. Honestly, you're not yet a man. Mentally or physically. Why waste you natty right now, when it is peaking? Also, if your Diet and training were/is very much on key, and will be extremely strict throughout cycle You would be under 10% bf already. You should get it on dial before you cycle. Because, If you're like me, you're off more than you're on : ( Continue researching, working out. Show some patience. There is no magic pill or vial that contains the wisdom & hard work. Wisdom, that some of your elders are trying to instill in you (for free) Lessons some learned the hard way. If you wait, all while you continue properly eaiting, training & putting in the hard work needed, you'll be much happier as a man later in life. Also, you will be in a position of hitting the ground running, so to speak; when you do cycle. Grow some patience.
http://www.eroids.com/forum/training-nutrition-diet/workout-exercise/bet...
TropicanaJuiceThanks for the advice, and my body fat was just an estimate, Ive been bulking otherwise it would be much lower
tread-mOk all great advice here but something caught my eye at the end....the last sentence you wrote "will he extremely strict on cycle" . Has to be extremely strict especially off cycle brother. Getting gains is much easier than keeping so off cycle is where the real work is , thats where you succeed or fail. Too young brother and you have good size so "IF" you train proper and especially "IF" you eat proper to the goal and always work the goal you achive easily for a few more years without gear. You have the strongest most potent cycle you will ever use jumping around through your body so don't waste that by shutting down those good supplies of natty test. Eat like you're on cycle in quality and train like you're on cycle and you just get better and better and come 3 or 4 yrs you get to walk in the right way. I didn't wait, I hope you do. If you don't at least follow the strict guidelines you see through these threads, run your aomasin 12.5 eod on cycle , letro or caber on hand and never touch 19's . A lot of time here don't be so impatient brother. We're glad to help here with good builders diets and workouts and lifestyle even if you're waiting on the gear. Theres an Irish guy hangin around here too young and has the magic few have, patience and willingness to listen. Listen here bro, wait and while you wait slap 25 pounds of muscle on that frame in the next couple years and continue to recomp the weight you already have.
TropicanaJuiceI will take your advice man, and again I really apprecaite it, but in the future when the time is right and decide to run a cycle, considering I am gyno prone, wouldnt the use of letro at a small dose throughout the entire cycle be better then aromasin?
sgtstedankoJust read this, after posting. Good to know, you're smarter than some : ) Good luck, & Feel free to pm me...
tread-mCan't necessarily argue with that depending on situation age the time you run. Letro is shown to reduce and actually reverse gyno in some and some tests actually indicate "older gyno" is benefitted from it but if entirely under control I would feel safe with aromasin or adex blocking at the enzyme level in the same way. Thats not bad thinkijng though for sure. Key I think is to find a place through bloods that you succeed in terms of estradial yet stay away from the threat of onset. I will say this, once you begin to cycle at whatever point I would have your bf at a lower level than most might succeed at knowing you are prone. This alone will benefit the situation in a big big way. I would spend several years once beginning staying away from 19's until you can determine just how prone you are to return of gyno. Diet for you in terms of clean may be more important than for some others due to gyno. Many gyno situations were formed as an individual was in puberty and developed some fat in and around the chest and nipple, that may have converted to female breast tissue at some point during fluctuation in est levels and essentially set dormant until having a reason to explode. So hopefully the letro helped that situation. I tend to think with everything I've read there is possibility of corrections and maybe the fact you reconized it young that was increased, I hope so. Stay lean brother, gyno is not just a cycle thing. You see a lot of guys with terrible gyno as they get older that never used gear from an early onset in puberty and as test decreased later in life and estro increased the get the dreaded "man boobs". Just stay lean and build lean muscle staying away later from things such as dbol and anything with mega spikes in hormone and again, beware of the 19's until down the road when you have plenty of experience and can reassess your gyno situation.
TropicanaJuiceTHANK YOU! I love the advice thats the reason why I joined this site, after all we are all in this together for the same goal right? why not share advice and help one another out instead of making jokes about tits and shit. I appreciate it bro, much respect.
Another one lower down bro,check it out it may help you in your goal
TropicanaJuicewait what lol I dont follow
HAhahah just the post name its hit the bottom of this page lol.
TropicanaJuiceoh haha I gotcha thanks brother!