+ 1 2nd cycle. Too much/not enough/just right?
Hey everyone, I've been a ghost reader on this site for awhile and figured I'd start being a real member to get advice and learn more than just reading everyone else's posts. Ive gotten my test only cycle out of the way and had no sides whatsoever at 400mg/wk (200/2x wk). I want to try a low test cycle with proviron ill be dosing the test 200mg every 4 days I think, I'll have to do the math again. I might bump it to 10wks idk yet. I've also had some tbol for awhile now I'm considering using it as a kickstarter. This is all theoretical although I do have all these compounds on hand I don't plan on starting for another few months once I feel my diet and gameplan are on par.
1-4 tbol 40mg
1-8 test cyp 300mg
5-11 proviron 25 mg
1-15 Aromasin 6.25 ed
12-15 nolva 40/40/20/10
12-15 clomid 100/50/50/25
I'll get pre and mid blood work done so I can dial in my AI. I figured since it's low dose test with proviron and I don't seem to be prone to sides that 6.25 is a good dose to start with. I also feel like I won't need hcg though I'm ordering some to have on hand just in case.
Any input is appreciated. I thought I filled out my stats but if I'm missing something on there just let me know
Thanks
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Only 1 new compound should be added per cycle Incase of negative sides... then you’ll know what the cause is. I only recommend test for your next cycle though. If it works, stick with it.
Maybe I'll get blood work a few wks in and see if the ai is necessary. I know test only is tried and true and most recommended especially with someone inexperienced as I am but my main concern is minimal shutdown and sides while still getting quality gains. I know I have a lot to learn and maybe my goal doesn't match up with my plan and if so I'll listen to any suggestions but I'm not trying to blow up too much I'm trying to gain strength with lean muscle. I'm in MMA and will start competing next year so I'd like to get some gains, lose what little I'll lose after cycle and maintain my actual gains from there while still working naturally on building more over the next year. I really want to try this tbol and I know I need a test base with any cycle hence why I'm doing what I feel like is a minimum dosage. Again, I'm sure there's room for improvement in my thinking and planning that's why I'm here. And I'm just mapping things out now it'll be at least a couple months before I start anything, and I won't until I feel good about it. Thanks for all the advice so far I really appreciate it
Did Jon Jones inspire you to run tbol? I see why that drug got popular. A while back they couldn’t test for its metabolites, so it was popular with fighters, Olympic athletes, etc. Nowadays WADA has the technology to sniff it out, so it’s really fallen from grace as a viable PED. It’s still prevalent in underground bodybuilding circles even though it’s a bit outdated in terms of professional and Olympic sports.
The proviron being a mild AI you may want to leave the aromasin out of the equation unless you start experiencing sides, otherwise you might tank your E. The experienced guys running test and provi cycles would be able to offer some guidance there, but from what I've read about provi you need to be cautious there.
I agree with that. This is where the bloods come in handy. I avoid ais unless I really need one. Rusty will have a different opinion I think. Maybe he will chime in.
Agreed, I saw rusty's thread the other day, his KISS cycle had test base witth provi so hopefully he'll chime in, I'm just basing off research, better to get advice from someone with experience.
I'll consider test only. Im starting pct 3wks after my last pin isn't that how long you wait with cyp?
basskiller89Basic test cycle is all you need brother
500mg test per week with an AI
I would consider a 12 week cycle with a proper pct
X2
I agree. People underestimate Test.
basskiller89One of these days I'll add a second compound lol ..
Maybe
If your still makeing gains and you feel good I think that’s wise. My most productive cycle is a gram of Test with provi. I’m not recommending that for a beginner. I worked up to that amount over many years. I cruise on 120 mgs off cycle. It’s different for these competitive guys. I also think props the best kicker.
basskiller89I do notice that the bigger I get, the gains seem to slow down. Maybe it is time to bump my cycles to 750mg test or add an oral. I have another 8 weeks of this cycle, but want to possibly extend to 20 weeks pending blood work. I'll brainstorm with you guys during my PCT for the next cycle
Maybe a warning sign from your body that it can’t handle a whole lot more muscle, at least not all at once. Evolutionarily speaking, I think we have these failsafes that keep us from gaining too much muscle too quickly for a reason. Gaining muscle slowly doesn’t just result in more keepable, better mass, but also allows our bodies and organs to acclimate over time to the extra stress.
basskiller89That's a good point. I don't want to damage my body and be unable to grow in the later years. I think ideally I would love to grow another 20-30lbs of muscle. I'd love to do it in 6 months and then maintain, but as we all know, that's not realistic lol. I may stay where I'm at for another year and then attempt to push for more. I think 5 years is a more realistic goal from where I'm at now. It's a long term grind and I want to do it as safely as possible
https://global.rakuten.com/en/store/meat-gen/item/8089501/
That’s what a pound of lean steak looks like. Now imagine 20 to 30 of those in a big pile. Looking at it that way, is that really realistic when you’re already huge for your frame? Is it even desirable? That’s an absurd amount of muscle, and more than most men gain after puberty in their entire lifetimes.
Every other month we get a ribbeye from Sam's and cut it in steaks (fat ones). They are 16 to 20 pounds. My wife and I were looking at it on the counter and wondering if I gained that much muscle where would I put it? So we imagined the steaks are 2 pounds a piece so two on my shoulders. Two on my chest. One on each arm. One per butt cheek and one for quads. And that still wouldn't be all of it.
The two largest muscles in the human body would probably get first dibs: the glutes and then the lats.
Ahh I forgot the lats. And I'm designed with No Glutes. The Hank Hill syndrome. And the more I work it the smaller it gets. It seems.
Ha! Same. Legs are moderate 28” glutes are small.
basskiller89That's exactly why I sit around 200lbs
Truthfully I don't even know if I could handle that much more muscle. Great link btw, that really puts things into perspective
You forgot the “no homo” for “I don’t know if I could handle that much more muscle” ha
basskiller89lol no homo brother
It would have been funnier with meat
5’6”, 200 lbs is humongous, so props for that. The rest of this post won’t necessarily be directed towards you, but all twenty-somethings who have dreams of being a mass monster.
I’m not trying to crush anyone’s dreams here, but I think people forget just how much muscle 20 lbs is. 20 lbs of decent mass with some fat and water retention alongside it is of course doable, but adding 20 lbs of pure, lean muscle to a body already carrying a massive amount? That’s when we start talking about McCarver type abuse. I’m not trying to exploit someone who tragically died by name dropping him, but he is the most recent cautionary tale of where hardcore bodybuilding can end up.
Or get a load of this guy, who may be walking a similar path, Jordan Peters, whom you can hear speak at 40 seconds in
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UijIHCbB9aI
The man is 29 years old. Twenty. Nine.
basskiller89Yes, I've seen a few of his youtube videos. He's another Redcon1 athlete
Thank you brother, it's taken me a while to achieve this size. I'm a bit smaller than the Boston Mass or Ashkanani. I'm only 5'5". I need to update my stats. I swear I shrunk somehow lol
For me 750 is about the lowest dose I get any results from. Low sides. But that’s me it could be different for someone else. I’m not estro prone at all. My buddy runs about the same and he has gyno. Everybody is different.
Yea my buddy runs 1000T and I’m like wtf. It must just be diff per person and number of cycles I haven’t seen any research on it but I imagine T receptor sites get burnt over time.
8 weeks is crap. Why are you starting your pct a month after ending the cyp?
Well if your not prone to sides I would leave the so out of it. You need some estrogen for muscle growth. At 300 a week you shouldn’t need it. The tool I would think would be fine if you really want it. But I would try test and proviron and use test at 500 a week for 10 weeks and then pct. but test dosage is your call