posted Thu, 08/16/2012 - 11:11
6786
+ 3 2nd Cycle Opinions?
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First cycle.
Test Cypionate 250 - 1ml/week, 10 weeks
Arimidex - .25mg EOD, 10 weeks
PCT
Nolvadex - Wk 1 40mg ED, Wk 2-6 20mg ED
HCG - 500iu ED for 3 weeks
Gained 7 lbs, kept about 3 lbs of it after pct. Not sure if I did something wrong of if I low dosed it or what. Oh well
Second cycle
Weeks 1-12
Testosterone Cypionate – 250mg Monday/Thursday Weeks 1-10
Testosterone Propionate – 100mg EOD Weeks 1-4 and Weeks 11-12
HCG – 250iu Monday/Thursday
Arimidex - .25mg EOD
or without the prop? Adding too much? What you guys think?
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cdaddy7I would consider Test P 100mg EOD for Weeks 1-3 and Weeks 11-14
Definitely like the 2nd Cycle much more than the 1st. I'm a believer in the Test P for 2 wks ending the cycle and have not done it for 4 wks to end a cycle, but I don't see that it would hurt anything.
Good Luck Bro and Grow!
CleyonI think that second cycle looks very nice. I like Zewi's suggestion on extending the Prop at the end of the cycle, it will allow the Cyp to get all the way out of your system, and still keep you up all the way to the end. Good job.
120 replies not including this one. Damn smallguy we must really like u brother;-) Hope this goes well for u
smallguyThanks a lot GUYS. Always learning. Hey GS, IRISH told me to get in contact with you about my diet and what not. If you have some free time, would you mind helping me out with my current meal plan? I'm pretty good with diet, but would love to hear what you have to say.
No doubt brother.
zewiDo the second cycle.
But make it Test C to 12 weeks
and the test p 10-14
Start pct 3 days after last shot
You mean on Weeks 13 & 14 ?
smallguyWhy just 13 and 14?
to keep your levels stable. your using it to taper of from the long ester. not have a massive test blast end of cycle.
smallguySo prop should be started AFTER the cyp and be ran for 2 weeks only, correct? Is the test blast at the beginning of the cycle ok? Or should I omit the prop in the beginning?
Definitely run the Prop in the beginning of a Cycle to get things started until the long esters take hold.
At the start is ok. Your using it to kickstart the long ester test which hasnt kicked in yet.
smallguyI knew that. I was referring to the "test blast".
zewiyes
smallguythere it is. if this one goes well, I'd like to run the same cycle above with stanazol included at weeks 7-14 at 50mg ED. just bored, ramblin
Supernova283I haven't read the reviews and I'm hoping someone already said this, but DO NOT USE HCG IN PCT. HCG is known for suppressing LH at high doses. You want to run 2500IUs a week! NO!
DO NOT RUN HCG IN YOUR PCT run Clomifene with your Nolva and you'll be fine.
His revised cycle is a few posts down. He took it out of PCT.
smallguyThanks for clearing that up guys. I've read in so many different websites and forums to include HCG in your pct. SMH
Clomiphene
Supernova283It's the same thing. Clomifene is just a different spelling. Like color and colour and gray and grey.
Can you write out your full revised cycle bro.
smallguyWeeks 1-12
Testosterone Cypionate – 250mg Monday/Thursday Weeks 1-10
Testosterone Propionate – 100mg EOD Weeks 1-4 and Weeks 9-12
HCG – 250iu Monday/Thursday
Arimidex - .25mg EOD
Week 13-16
Clomid – 100mg ED (Week 13-14), 50mg ED (Week 15-16)
Nolvadex – 40mg ED (Week 13), 20mg ED (Week 14-16)
Exemestane – 12.5mg ED (Week 13-14)
D-Aspartic Acid – 3g ED (Week 13-20)
I've gotten enough thumbs ups from you guys to seem that this would be fine to do without hurting my health. So far, this is the plan
GS has great skills! Do it
smallguygs?
The prop finis is for the two Weeks after test cyp. Example...prop for Weeks 11-13 and start pct two days after last prop. Then you're not spiking your test.
No aromadin during pct. Just nolva/clomid
smallguyWhy no aromasin?
zewiand you don't take arimidex or aromasin in a PCT..
Its NOVA and Clomid Only theses are SERMS --arimidex and aromasin are AI
AI= on cycle
SERMS= PCT
Supernova283What's wrong with Aromasin during PCT? It'd help with the estro rebound as nolva would and is known for increasing test levels.
What's your logic?
zewiyou don't take both its either aromasin or Arimidex
smallguySo if I use arimidex on cycle, I use arimidex PCT? Or no arimidex PCT? Heh?
smallguySo ditch the arimidex if I'm not having gyno issues? Is that in there just for gyno?
Should I just omit it completely and only add if IM starting to get gyno?
HCG 250IU EOD in cycle? 2500IU EOD for 3 weeks Post cycle? Should I include HCG in my cycle AND post cycle?
No, do not include HCG in your post cycle whatever you do. Not only will it be wasted, but it could be counterproductive. HCG and SERMS are a big no-no as far as I know.
A lot of people will tell you not to take arimidex or any AI unless you need it, but I say no, fuck that. It's much smarter in my opinion to take preventative measures instead of getting a problem and then scrambling to fix it. There seems to be this popular belief that AI use on cycle will hinder your gains to a certain extent. However, my buddies and I all take Letrozole, the strongest AI starting day one of our cycle, keep in mind that Letro is FAR stronger than Arimidex, and on my first cycle of test cyp and winstrol I still managed to gain 25lbs in 12 weeks. Same with everyone I know, so I'm totally convinced it's much better just to be cautious, and take preventative measures and take your AI from day one. Another concern is that your estrogen will be too low and thus have sides, which can be true if you don't start at a low dose of AI and find the perfect dose that doesn't kill your estrogen, but still stops test conversion. I take Letro which is supposed to absolutely demolish your estrogen and have tons of sides, but I've found the perfect dose for me, and now I have the best of both worlds.
Gyno is a fucking bitch, and most of the time requires surgery and can really fuck up your self esteem, it's nothing to be fucked around with in my opnion. But this is just that, my opinion.
smallguyIm going to agree with you on the "fuck that, its much smarter to take PM instead of getting a problem then having to fix it".
Thanks man
Dont ditch yoyr adex......wait til estro appears. If used too early...low estro issues happen. Not fun
cdaddy7And one more note on that either use the arimidex or exemestane not both during the cycle
smallguyI was planning on using arimidex starting at .25mg EOD.
cdaddy7Good deal b sure and start it beginning week two. Looks solid and make sure ur diet is on point and at least 2-2.5g of protein x ur body weight. A lot of guys drop the ball on this and this heavily dictates ur muscle growth. Steroids makes ur body anabolic but if u don't feed it properly with nutrition it will not grow
smallguySo 440 to 550g of protein a day?
zewiyes start near the lower end.
smallguyholy shit. this is only when on cycle right?
how many grams of protein are some of the big guys on this forum taking in a day? just curious
If you're unsure about prop, you could drop it down to 50-75mg? But being that you're young (possible higher natual test) and 210lbs, not sure if you'll notice much? Some vets might shine better light on that low of a dosage? But I don't know how you reacted to your first cycle? Be ready for some pip possibly at 100mg+ per injection of prop, doesn't always happen but I've had some pip due to prop from 2 different sources now. Read up on heating techniques (PIP) just in case you need them. It's helped me.
smallguyIm expecting some pip :-(.. Atleast its only 4 weeks at a time though and not an 8 week prop cycle..
Touche
I like the cycle, kick start with prop and finish with prop gets you up and running quickly and clear fast at the end.
You don't mention your stats at all but I see in your profile that your 24yrs old, 6', 210lbs and about 12% bf so it's a great early cycle.
How did you get on with the first cycle with regards, BP, acne and other side effects. Did you get bloods taken? might help working out why the low gains. Would rule out bunk or under dosed gear if you had yourself tested.
I'd be inclined to increase the dose to 500mg of cyp/enanthate a week depending on if you had any problems on the first cycle.
There isn't any real noticeable difference between cyp and enanthate. If you can feel any it would be down to the vials being differently dosed and not the ester. UGL labs can be a bit up and down with dosing.
smallguyBP increased, acne started. Lost sex drive the week I started my PCT and didnt get it back for the duration of the pct. Now all back together. I'm going to get bloodwork done tomorrow anyway just to make sure everythings good.
I do believe he is going to up the cyp to 500mg? Says 250mg Mon/Thur? Good advice though bro, I've def noticed up and downs with ugl's.
Missed that :-)
Yeah for sure I've got a collection of vials from different suppliers and labs, some batches from the same supplier and lab vary in strength which makes it hard to gauge.
Consistency appears to be missing from a lot of this stuff.
Yeah, guess it's a small price to pay... but definitely sucks. I have a good UGL in my area, but by the time everyone gets taxed and it gets to me, I've paid almost double what I can get it for around here. Fucking taxes!