posted Fri, 03/10/2017 - 08:29
3749
IGF1-DES
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Hey everyone, I've been using gear on and off for about 14 years. I'm 35, 5'11 somewhat lean 280 lbs. I'm brand new to the IGF1-DES world. I'm having a hard time finding an exact dosage or protocol and was looking for some feedback from anyone that has experience with it. Today was my 1st day with it and the pumps were great. Since it's out of your system in 30 minutes. I did 10 IU's at the beginning of my workout and 10 more IU's 30 minutes into my workout. Looking forward to hearing from you guys, thanks!
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brick topis it possible to use this on and off constantly, like a month of des and then a month of l3r, i am thinking that maybe the body gets used to the igf even if its des or lr3?
I've used it pre workout at 20mcg in each side of the body in the muscle I'm going to workout. So 40mcg total and I LOVED the pumps I got from it.
PPGFreak did you feel a sense of heat like feeling running through your body 10 -15 min after you inject? I agree with you on the pumps. It brings a whole new meaning to no pain no gain lol
First things first please edit out the source name. It's not allowed in the open forums. Secondly, I'm not quite sure what direction your going in with your question. Have you done any research on the IGF DES? The DES imo should only be used for spot injections on lagging muscle groups. LR3 is more for doing a cycle of and with that you only want to stay on for 3-4 weeks because your body develops a tolerance. I don't believe any protocol would be necessary with the DES because it's in and out so fast. Just like you wouldn't do a cycle comprised of tne or suspension. For example, if you're looking to build your tri's you'd only use it on days you work your triceps or maybe even on a heavy chest day but other than that it's unnecessary.
Have you actually used it? I've heard the opposite on IGF1-DES that it's not site specific.
its debatable if its site specific or fully systemic like LR3. Some will say since the half life is so short it's going to spend the majorly of its life in the spot where you inject it but Igf-1 will bind to receptors in damaged muscle cells so if you haven't worked out your biceps and you shoot into your bis sure some of its gonna bind to receptors in your bis but it's still gonna go all over your body and bind and activate receptors all over. But if you just destroyed your biceps and you shoot in your bis there's gonna be a lot more damaged muscle cells then then anywhere else so the majority of it will fill all the receptors there and then whatever Is left will go elsewhere, hopefully to the muscles your trained the day before and not the intestines.
Thing is half life is irrelevant with igf-1, doesn't matter that the half life is so short as long as it makes it to where it needs to go before that time is up and it will because once these igf-1 receptors are activated they stay activated for something like 24hrs. Wish I could find the source but it was a long long time ago that I read that. That's why I think Des is somewhat superior to LR3, there's no need for a 20hr half life that just gives the stuff time to float around the body binding to receptors all over. And I've gotten much better results from des.
But Des is fun to shoot pre workout for the pumps but In my experience the best results came from taking it post workout then drinking my shake and eating. Pre workout there's not much damaged except the prior days of trainings muscles then throughout your workout you damage the muscles but the igf-1 is mostly gone by then. There's really no sure fire way to do this there's no studies for use in athletes or anything it's kinda just guessing at this point since it's still fairly new. But I'd probably take a small dose mid workout and another small dose post workout. Or all post workout but I can't really see how pre workout is going to have any effect on muscle growth at all. Like I said it's fun and gives some sick pumps but we're in this to make gains.
Have you tried intra-workout ? I usually workout for about 20 min trying to attack my heavy sets then I take a quick trip to the car to get my 50 mcgs intra-workout supplement in. After that i complete the last set or 2 of the heavy compound movements than work on isolation pump training the remaining 40 min.
That was very insightful, thanks man!
Yes. In fact I've used both and it's exactly the opposite. Because of the half life of the DES it's out of the system so quickly that by the time it gets into the blood stream to circulate it's almost gone so it spends most of it's time isolated in that one muscle group. Whereas LR3 has a half life of I believe 24 hours so it has time to fully absorb into the blood stream and circulate throughout the body. And 24 hours is a conservative figure. I've heard of it lasting as long as 30 hours in the system which I'm assuming is based on a couple of different factors. For example, using acetic acid as opposed to bacteriostatic water to mix the LR3 preserves it longer so it may be able to be broken down slower. Also depending on whether you inject IM or SUBQ may determine its absorption rate.
Thanks for the info dude, yes I've done a ton of research and have heard a wide variety of opinions. Which one do you like better?
I like the LR3 better personally. I feel it gives the most bang for your buck. Like I said I think DES should only be used to boost lagging muscle groups or if you're like my buddy who goes hypo easily and can't use the LR3.