+ 1 Thoughts?
Hi guys I'm new to this forum and have a few questions.
I was on HCG monotherapy from my doctor as I was feeling tired and tested low for test, as it was around 350. He started me on 1,000iu 3 times a week, and told me to go to 1,500iu if I felt a lack of response. I went from 1,000iu to 1,500iu the second week and stayed on this protocol for 4 months.
I recently got my blood work back and my test level was 700 and dht was in check, but me e2 level which was 25 before I started went to 125. Also, my blood pressure went up as well. My doctor wanted me to stay on HCG mono, and add Arimidex. I told him I wanted to try test cypionate, as I thought HCG mono was worse on e2. After some going back in forth he agreed to put me on test cypionate.
He thought my response to the test would be similar to the HCG so my new protocol is 100mg of cypionate, or 50mg twice a week, and 1mg of Anastrozone twice a week with injections.
How does this sound? By the way I am 45 years old.
Thanks....
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It sounds legit bro. That's the commonly prescribed trt dose for test, and he's actually right about you getting the same response in test and e2 levels. In fact, if you were responding to the hcg - from a therapeutic standpoint - you're better off that route than supplementing test.
Hcg essentially is an exogenous form of the gonadatripic hormones LH and FSH. These play roles in the production of sperm and the sex hormones testosterone and estrogen. However, although exogenous hcg will suppress the natural release of LH and FSH, it will stimulate the natural production of testosterone, which is what you're after.
On the other side of this coin you now have exogenous testosterone. Once you start supplementing the sex hormone, natural production of it becomes inhibited. Remember: LH and FSH are what stimulates and drives it's production. When test is supplemented the brain gets the signal "there is enough, or too much" thru negative feedback. This shuts down the processes responsible for producing testosterone, which means you have the testis no longer producing and the pituitary is no longer releasing LH and FSH. That's two sides of the axis being shutdown when you supplement test, as opposed to one side when using hcg.
The choice is yours of course. Just know that hcg while on trt will help keep the cells in the testis somewhat active so that they aren't completely shutdown. This helps with both testicular atrophy and fertility issues while on trt. Mention it to your doctor.
Thank you for your informative post. My doctor who is big on the more natural way of things did explain this to me. He wanted me to stay on the HCG monotherapy with the added ai for the high e2. I told him I read that HCG elevated blood pressure and he said that test can do the same. I also told him that the HCG looks to have no long term studies on safety and that I also read it can desensitize you system with higher doses associated with monotherapy. He agreed on both and said this is why you can cycle HCG monotherapy.
I told him I would like to try the test cyp and see how I feel, as I believed I could do a restart with HCG or clomid. I also said I would like to leave the HcG out of the protocol as we both agreed if I stayed on the test treatment I could always add 250-500iu twice a week to the test protocol.
From what I read the adex dosage of 2mg a week looked a bit high, but I know it varies. He is actually a very conservative Dr. That knows I have done a ton of research over the last 4 months and am educated about my decision. Will be interested to see what my response is in about 30 days.
Thanks so much!
You're fairly knowledgable about your condition and options for a new guy. That's a good thing. 2mg a week on adex is appropriate IF hcg is part of the equation. Without it, the amount depends in the test dose. 0.25mg twice a week is what I would go with on the dose he has you on.
One other question I have for you guys. My blood results came back after 4 months of JUST HCG with a dose of 1,500iu Monday. Wed, and Friday of test 700 and E2 of 125. If I had been taking Adex during this time, I know that my E2 would have been lower. My question is would my Test have been higher as some of it was aromatizing into E2?
I think this is what I understood from my Dr.
Thanks!
Thanks man. No HCG at this point, just 100mg cypionate with the 2mg of adex.
Will this amount be that bad if I take HIS advice and retest in 4 weeks.
If the adex amount is too much, from what little I know this will cause e2 to be lower, and push test even higher, is this correct? I appreciate all your help!
test level will be the same, the reason the estro rises is due to the body seeing the extra test and attempting to "level" out. At least according to what I read.
Thank you. Will be interesting to see what the e2 level is then in 4 weeks. I appreciate all the help guys...
Boom!
My first level? Are you referring to test level? If so it was 350. I started the first 2 weeks on 1,000iu of HCG 3 times a week, and after the first two weeks went to 1,500iu 3 times a week for the remainder of the four months. My e2 level started at 25 and wnt to 125 on the high dose of HCG monothrapy.
Thanks!
Hit the reply button to the person you're responding too. It makes the thread easier to follow.:)
Sorry I'm new at this.
Thank you..
Welcome to Eroids brother. You're gonna find a lot of useful information for you here.
You're good.:)
what was your 1st level at? if you were on just hcg and you bumped to that high a level something isnt right
No he did no question about how I know about AAS and anti estrogens. When I first went to see him I knew nothing about ANY of this. I just did a lot of research once he put me on the HCG mono that took my e2 from 25 to 125.
I have lifted weights naturally for the last 20 plus years. I was upset my test was so low as I was feeling tired and I wanted better body comp results and a better feeling of well being. It looks like most guys that use adex on trt are dosing around 1mg a week with 100 mg of test. And 2mg of adex for 200 mg of test, but I know it is most likely dependent on the individual.
I think I won't question him on the 2 mg a week as I retest in a month and at that point we can adjust down if need be.
Sounds like to me after you get your blood work done, that you take it to another doctor and get a second opinion.
So your doctor never questions why you know so much about aas and also about anti estrogens? He also never questioned that you knew how to read your bloods? I want the name of your doctor because i will fly where ever you are and have him for a new doctor. What was your estro level?
The doctor wanted me to try HCG and if that did not work he said we could always go to test, but he wanted to try the more natural route first. When my results came back prior to my app he suggested possibly trying Clomid for men. I told him I would rather not do that as I have heard bad results.
I thought based upon what I have read from you guys on this forum the adex dose sounded to big. I asked him if I should just run the test without the ai and see how I tested in a month. He said I tend to convert the test to estrogen as shown by the resent results with the HCG mono. My response was I thought HCG was more problematic with e2 then synthetic test is. He said I should take the ai as I would still have a problem.
From what little I know is the adex will cause my test level to go higher? This protocol will just be one month before I do another blood test.
I have not used AAS in the past.
Thanks guys :-)
OK, so you TOLD your doctor you want test cyp and he said "sure, no problem!?" Also you said your blood pressure went up and so did your E2 and he still prescribed what you asked him to prescribe? LOL And he also told you to take 50mg 2 times a week? I'm sorry I am a TRT patient and if I TOLD my doctor what to put me on I would have got jack shit. Also my current doctor will not let me pin 2 times a week; he says 1 time a week is good enough. Sorry to sound leary of this but it just doesn't sound right. Especially 1mg of anastrozole 2 times a week. Shit my doc told me .25 E3D only when symptoms arise since I am on such a "low" dose. My Doc wanted me to not use it for 3 weeks when he saw my blood pressure and it was only borderline. 137/79
Hcg at a larger dose does convert to estrogen. 100mg of Test Cyp a week dose sound like the average dose. But the Adex sounds a little high. .25mg sounds more proper. If you were running 500mg a week then your AI would be adjusted. I would wait and see what some other guys that are actually on TRT suggest.
Edit: do you have any other previous AAS use?