posted Sat, 09/23/2017 - 04:45
5379
My Trt
ad
Ok guys and or gals, have a major question here. I’m on Trt and my doc prescribed me 200mg test cyp per wk. after being in there for 24 weeks my test levels came back at 350ngl. There has to be something wrong with my body or something. I can’t figure it out. He kept me on same dose for another 12 weeks but told me that I was almost at the max they give for Trt.
Stats
29
5”3
Bf% 11
- Bookmark
- 0
- 0
Hey fella, I posted on the bloods, but I will copy it in here too, in case you miss it...
Ok dude,
Well this is what I see
1. Your blood sugar is a decent bit below. I get hypo at 70 and you were at 64.
Symptoms:
You have low TSH and low T4. By low I mean bottom quarter of the reference range listed. Optimal would be somewhere around 1.3/1.5 to 2 for TSH and from 1.2-1.3 for t4. Below optimal tsh and below optimal T4 can indicate that the pituitary isnt receiving the info it needs to crank out tsh, or the pit isnt working properly or other weird issues like t3 pooling or whatever but you absolutely will need to know t3 levels because if they are low too you are definitely hypothyroid, but they might be absolutely perfect only bloods will tell. Adrenals can also influence overall thyroid system function. Without doubt, we should look at T3 as that's where the rubber meets the road. I think you need a full Thyroid panel including T3, Ft3, Rt3, antibodies, binding globulin. (some will argue its overkill, but could differentiate between a thyroid and an adrenal issue if either were to exist).
Your sodium is high. Intake too high? Dehydrated? Either way, there is an imbalance in your electrolytes, what with potassium being in the lower half of the range.
All of these things combined are enough to make anyone feel sh!tty. You listed the symptoms as low testo symptoms, yet those same symptoms (other than T bloods) are also indicative of hypoglycemia, adrenals, or hypothyroid, or electrolyte imbalances. But you actually seem to have a bit of an issue with all of these. Problem is, these systems are all interconnected with guess what.... testo.
I am glad your diet is good and I am glad that you're only using an anti-inflamatory, but you should know that some nsaid's can affect thyroid metabolism/function. I have read it can + and also -, so either could be bad, for example, low thyroid then reduced by nsaid's makes issue worse, normal thyroid then reduced causes hypo, high thyroid reduced now looks normal and so on... just something to look into yourself given the medication you are on...
Mate, you should really consider an endocrinologist, or some type of holistic hormones doctor person. This is fast becoming my canned response when I see results like this coupled with the feeling sh!tty symptoms you mention. Ideally you would be speaking with someone who can address; TRT, Adrenals, Thyroid, and also your blood glucose (you should really start monitoring that yourself before meeting another doc, a meter is cheap as chips and its an easy thing to do with the meter logging the results)
Yea I got it on the other one. Thanks bro
Here is my blood work that was taken for my total testosterone
https://www.eroids.com/pics/trt-2
I would be deleting your birth date and the Dr name.
Gotcha
How do I upload my pic in comments for my blood work?
upload in the submit a picture section on the main page. then link to it here
I've been reading your past posts. You've been experiencing the same issue for years now. You also said below that you did your cycles in the past by the book... but you didnt at all did you...? No ai or pct in early days and blast/cruise or simply cycling too often... clearly cycling while fatter than yoy said you were in your stats, per your pics...
I mean even back then you knew you were fkn it all up
>
So dude... I am going to be straight with you... I don't trust that you really know what you are doing. It could be a simple metabolism issue or DHT conversion or whatever... but given youre making a mess of pinning and cannot see that... and think you did everythi g right in the past when you know you didnt.... there is no point.
I recommend you go to an endo and wish you the best with it fella. I hope you get sorted.
I totally 100% agree with you bro. When I started 5 years ago I didn’t really k ow what I was doing 100% I had Schreddedcheddar help me out. I was young and like the power that a cycle gave me so I didn’t follwow correct protocol but, I did come off after a long cycle and got my test levels checked 6 months later and was at 450. I’m just trying to figure out why my test levels are so low at being on 200mg per week when everyone else is only taking like 100 mg per wk and is around 700
I'm going to tell you in all honesty:
1) Your doing something wrong in measuring/injecting.
or
2) Your system/body is so far out of wack, only a hands on doctor is going to be able to help you.
or
3) Your telling us a fairytail.
1 question,........... how many weeks is a vial of testosterone lasting you???
The last time where I split my 200mg 2x wk I only had enough for 9.5 weeks. That’s 100mg x2 wk. I’m in process of trying to get to the docs and getting my lab work.
First off you sound like popeboy did when he first joined... you should see him now.
What you are saying is an impossibility. So you need to figure out where the breakdown is. First off, get your hands on the results so you can see what the lab is doing and how they are measuring your results.
TRT is akin to being low on vitamin B; you will feel lethargic. Get a booster shot of Vitamin B and you will fill energized. After a while, you feel normal again, even if you continue to take high doses of B supplements. The same with Testosterone. If you're chasing that high, you're an addict. Welcome to normal.
There are also a host of other things that could be an issue; poor diet, lack of sleep, stress, lack of activity, lack of daylight, thyroid, hgh, hydration, psychological issues, drug use, alcohol, etc.
You should be trying to eat as much as you can and hit the weights to gain as much mass as you can. Your T levels are over 50% higher than what they were. I'd be psyched about the possibilities if I were you. More mass = more natural testosterone.
Be honest and disciplined with your doc. There are health risks too (cholesterol, BP, temper, RBC, estrogen etc.) going slow is a good thing. After 3 to 6 months, revisit you dosage question. see if your doc will try and get your low level to be in the mid-normal range and not low-normal. If your sides are manageable and you sound reasonable and mature, he might entertain that idea.
Normal is a range. and what you're testing for when doing blood work is the lowest level. Your peak levels are apt to be much higher.
I've heard a lot of heroin and meth addicts say much the same thing.
RustyhookerWell said! Test can also placebo you forward or back depending on mental outlook. Stress alone can kill the sex drive on even a big cycle.
The big picture .....
Question....
You have spoke about levels and all that jazz...
How do you feel?
Now compared with pre trt?
I question what you say about a split dose schedule yielding the same results as a 1xweekly dose. Its physiologically impossible... bloods tested at steady state, with all othet things being as equal that is.
So the big question is how do you feel?
How do I feel? I feel like I’m always tired and my sex drive is horrible. I felt the same way before Trt. At first my sex drive and energy went up then it just dropped back off. When I was splitting my dosage up I believe the doc told me my levels was like 380 then but I ran out and they wouldn’t refill it. I was like 1/2 cc short when injecting 2x per week. Hell I don’t believe those are 10cc bottles at Walgreens. More like 9cc you can’t be wastingbthat much oil when injection 2x right?
I have to say that does sound very strange dude
How you feel really is where the rubber meets the road.
I dunno man. Something sounds off, between the levels and the discrepsncy with the inj amounts...
Can you fill your prescription elsewhere?
Also if everything on your side is square thrn maybe you need to see someone who can treat the person rather than the level?
You'll never see an underfilled vial of pharma product, they always put more to make sure the doc/patient has full doses; waste included.
Thats what i was thinking.
It doesnt sound right
None of it sounds right,............ we have had a run of T _ _ _ls lately, maybe im to sceptical.
Nah, you're... it's been a bit of a sh!t show recently.
I think a lot of people have a default-to-lie mode, when they are online. Almost as if the lie is easier to process than the truth and will help them get a co-signer!
So do you believe me a little bit more after seeing my bloods? I’m open for suggestions or anything. If I could find a chart to print off or anything I could show my doctor to try and get him to push me a little bit height so I feel better and all that to where I’m at least in the normal zone for my age. I just want that before I do any actual cycles or anything. That’s why I have been clean from doing my own and only following doctors since February.
I have not lied about anything. I told you what I’m taking per doctor. But you dumb asses assume I am freaking lien. I will get my blood work and post it as soon as I can get it from the doctor.
Easy tiger. We werent calling you a liar
But its such a strange situation its hard not to wonder wtf is happening
I dont yhink you are a liar. But I suspect you may be making a mistake somewhere??
Settle down, we have seen this story 100 times before.
Maybe your that 1 in 101 that is telling the truth.
I dont think I've seen this story before.
It's quite unusual.
I look forward to seeing how this all unfolds.
How can a body not release exogenous test into the bloodstream?
Is it locked in the depot? being converted to something? What the hell is happening to it
The story I refer to:
20 something. Check
Low testosterone. Check
Dr not doing enough. Check
I need co-signer so he can up hid dose. Check
Dr doesn't know shit. ????
I agree his story is just enough different that it might have merit.
https://www.eroids.com/pics/trt-2
Good to know that it isn't just me.
yep, ive seen different serum levels on different people, but nothing like this.
pretty weird.
im at the opposite end, I'll hit 1800ngdl from 200 a week, split.
could a differebt ester, or no ester be the answer? pellets or a gel?
Damn thats... thats a huge difference by comparison.
I dunno
Personally, if i had to, i think i would try go the route of pellets. Arent they more stable??
350ng/dl?
Id imagine you'd see peak plasma levels up at 8-900, however timing matters.
How many days after a 200mg shot were the bloods taken at at what time of day?
7 days from last injection. Blood taken at 9am
you'd see peak plasma levels at about +2 days or so and a swift drop off after that
So clearly my friend, your body is working fine, but you need sub weekly shots to maintain levels
Go back to your doctor with a print out of the pharmacokinetics of the test ester you are using, a print of your current bloods (+7 days from shot) and also a printout of typical t test levels as shows on peaktestosterone website.
Show him those three things and then slap him/her in the face with a wet fish
Get yourself self-administering the same total dose, split in half, injected twice within a week
to know peak plasma levels bloods must be taken as per the pharmacokinetic of the ester (somewhere around +2 days, and then to know what your body drops to, measure bloods just before your next inject is due, within the hours beforehand or what have you.
typical nadir value on 200 mg per week would be 800 ng/dl,
http://ajpendo.physiology.org/content/281/6/E1172
so your levels are less than half of a normal nadir value on once weekly injections.
I'd check those peak levels, 24 rhs after admin.
also consider pellets or the name brand version of Test U
You are unusual in your response to Test E/C,
I'd advise against trying to school your DR, but just discuss ways to keep levels more consistent through the week.
That study you quote is of t enth in a cohort of healthy men forced into hypogonadism. Strikes me as a different situation to OP!
Dose matters, as does ester and individual metabolism of the drug. The patient's response will always 'school' the person administering the drug.
X2
350ngl is not a real unit
post up your bloods
I’ll have to get a copy from. My doc. He never gave me a copy he just called and told me that it was at 350
OK, he probably meant nanograms per deciliter.
I really cant think of any way that a legit 200mg a week would come back that low.
What were your pre TRT numbers?
Have you run cycles before?
https://www.eroids.com/pics/trt-2
Pre Trt was 250 and I cycled before and done it all by the book. Waited 1 year clean and found my slyest was only at 250
do some bloods on your own, with a different lab
labsmd
or privatemd
There's something wrong with your test levels in your doctor needs to figure it out. So you think running a cycle before the next test is going to help you and figure out the issue?
No I know it won’t help the issue but I’ve beem calling the doctors for past 40 wk and I just need that boost for a few weeks. It sucks to know that my test levels s are that of a 70 year old person. I’ve tried to do it all the legal way but if the doc won’t give me anymore what is a man supposed to do?
I agree that messing around with a cycle won't help you figure anything out. I mean, say you do and your level comes back normal. Is that because you're still coming down off a super-physiological dose, or because the trt is working? If your doc sees a normal test result, will he even try to help you figure anything out? When you go back to a trt dose, you'll be even more lost. Then it will take you a year of tests to even convince your doc there's an issue. In the long run, you'll be shooting yourself in the foot for a unplanned out experiment.
I decided not to run a cycle at this time and am waiting until I go back to the doctor in December to get more bloods done.
Stick it out like a man and find the proper solution. dose. Give your doctor a chance and the time he needs figure out the correct, sustainable dose. (adjusting frequency as well as dosage)
I'm not buying into your story.
Get your numbers correct (have a physical copy of your bloods).
get blood drawn in the morning before you are supposed to inject (or morning day before).
Even, ask the doc to take bloods on day 3 or 4 to compare your levels.
Could be, you need to pin 1/2 mil twice a week. There's more than one way to get higher levels without upping your dose...
I have nothing to gain by lying about what I’m taking. I tried splitting my dosage to to 100mg 2x per wk and still came up with almost the some according to the doctor. I don’t have the actual paperwork just going by what he called and told me. He bing a family doctor he said as long as I’m in the normal range that’s all they will do. I will try and get to the dr and get copies of my labs to post. Just frustrated Bc I’ve been on 200 mg per wk for past 26 weeks and he calls and tells me that my levels are at 350 and my bloods all look good.
Remember, like some pointed out already, that's 350 ng/dl 7 days after your weekly shot. So, the lowest your number is is at the low end of normal. Before that, it was higher. I can't say an exact number but probably double that or so. If you split to 2 doses per week, the low number will go up. The post injection number will actually stay lower. But to see, you will have to test at around 3.5 days after instead of 7 days. You can't test 7 days after a 100mg shot and expect it to be higher than 7 days after a 200mg shot. It doesn't work like that. If you test at 7 days you skipped a shot so of course it's going to be low.