posted Fri, 07/15/2022 - 22:21
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+ 2 Using low dose deca or npp for joints
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So after discontinuing npp within a week I've had bad shoulder pain in both shoulders anytime my front delts get engaged and am considering using npp low dose like 150mg a week to help with this and I'm curious if anyone has experience with this or if theirs anything else I can do because I really don't want to use it cuz I'm coming off my blast next week and just want to use test on my cruise... any help is greatly appreciated.
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If it is overall joint pain then I would look at e2 levels (bloodwork). The other thing that helps me is raising fats a little bit. My joints tend to be drier if my fats are too low or water intake
Byanymeans78The other thing I want to point out I only get this when I get a pump in my front delt other then that zero pain
I have been on trt 120 mgs a week for 3 years. I started to experience joint pain, have arthritis in my knees. I had some para pharma Decan 300 laying around so I added 50mgs to my test twice a week and joint issues subside. I’m kinda of sensitive to the deca knocking my D down so I actually run 30 mg twice a week and I have no joint pain and my guy is always ready to go.
Byanymeans78Nice
TricepatopsYou have to first find out what is causing the pain as certain things or injuries will not be helped by deca or anything. Once you figure out the cause then you can address it with things like NPP. Also though you don't want to mask pain and get hurt worse to where you can't even lift. I know anavar is good for joints as it is prescribed for burn injuries which increases collagen in those areas. Also low dose test is good but anything over around 299mgs of test actually makes joints weaker. Ever wonder why there are so many AAS users getting tendon or ligament injuries on cycles? Muscles respond good to test and it takes the tendons and ligaments a lot longer to get stronger also.
Do you use an ai at all when running just the Test? If you do I would consider dropping it as estrogen produced by the test will help lube and protect your shoulders too. I have rough shoulders also and I know the odd time I have used adex on a test and Dbol cycle my shoulders have then really dried up and felt brittle. Creatine will help get more water in the shoulders too. For what its worth when I use NPP for joints the dose definitely needs to be more than 150mg/wk.
Byanymeans78I just did my last dose of 600mg of test 500mg of tren today and have only been taking .5 adex x2 a week I can't lie I Frankensteined this cycle together it was originally 500 test 350npp I ran that for 6 weeks upped test to 600 and npp to 4 then added in the tren ran that for 2 months then dropped the npp 2 weeks ago and ever since that anything that engages my front delts ie when I get a pump in them it's hell till it goes down a little...I also think it may be a circulation thing cuz my hands will go cold when this happens.... probably the aftermath of my 10 year iv heroin addiction.
I always Frankenstein my cycle. I like certain things from certain places.
Now I know this it will be because you dropped the NPP and stayed on the Tren then bud, this is why I always run those 2 together as although trenbolone is great for rebuilding tendons it can also be drying and dangerous for them too if you are not running another wet compound that keeps water in your joints such as Dbol or NPP. Anadrol can work too but not as well as Dbol I find. On Tren especially 500mg/wk you have to be virtually force feeding yourself liquid to not become dehydrated on top of the litres of sweat lost during the night and constant sweating in the day from the higher body temperature - then there is the amount lost during training too.
Byanymeans78And this is why I love this place... I've been drinking a 1.5 gallon of water a day but I'm also working in the heat 8 hours a day I had a feeling I might be dehydrated. I only dropped the npp to see how much water i was holding and to let the tren shine... well hopefully since today was the last of the tren my shoulders might bounce back
If you are working in the heat 8 hours a day on top of everything else then I'm sure that you are not drinking nearly enough in what you stated there. Working trenbolone at a medium to heavy dose in with a full time job outside in the sun is always going to be very hard work, I would be much more tempted to go Test / NPP / Dbol or Adrol or Anavar next time if I were you.
Byanymeans78Next run is low dose test dhb and primo...as much as I like tren I don't feel comfortable running it more then once or twice a year.
TricepatopsYou ever run DHB? If you never ran primo or DHB I would do separate cycles but that is me. See how you react to one or the other. Primo I just ran and it take a while to get really showing and lower the bf the better it made me look. DHB is like Tren imo but without all the sides. But if you run both before then that will be a nice cycle. Especially if the BF is low you should like big and veiny. Lol
Always run a new compound solo before stacking.
Byanymeans78So I'm not going to debate the relevance of this concept with either one of you because I do agree with it. Unfortunately the old addict in me even with lots of sobriety still holds onto more is better. It's fucking completely stupid but my reasoning at least behind this stack is primo is such a neutral compound that 99%of people don't even know their running it so essentially dhb will be the only compound felt. It's the sense that's been made in my head and it's being run with. I'll never debate that it's stupid. I realized this first hand by stacking test npp and tren when truly I feel I would of benefited more from running either tren by itself or npp by itself and at times during this cycle I did. But I'm thick headed and until I do it it doesn't stick.
That’ll be a good one, what’s the goal on that cycle
Byanymeans78Just all dry gains
Well yea that's a big factor, dehydration
Good point about estrogen press
I have seen studies with as little as 100 mg of deca per week used but I understand it's individual dependant
Yea I saw that study. Now do you believe in the increased collagen synthesis aspect of Deca? I saw 2 studies and both contradictory. My personal opinion is there is definitely some healing properties to deca, more so than testosterone. For sure it eases joint pain. Now By which method it does this is debatable
I'd have to review the medical research which I have no done for awhile to give you a comprehensive response to that but what I can say is anabolic steroids are a poor treatment for joint pain due to side effects especially in monotherapy. (Deca only cycles)
Always impressed with your knowledge Dwayne
Brother more people are impressed with your knowledge. I love these topics. Keep up the good work
Byanymeans78Bro I second this... it's always great when a topic sparks like this. I cannot thank all you guys enough. This has happened a couple times for me where the best and brightest of eroids come together for me and for that I'm really grateful.
Yea I remember you bringing up several good topics. Keep doing that. All of us, including myself can always learn something new. And thanks my man for just being grateful
I second this thanks both you guys for the thought provoking convos, I learn everyday on here or I would not come back
@Byanymeans78
For sure
You can always hang though dwayne, hanging with hanging low in the pubmed game LOL
Byanymeans78That's the definitive thing I can't come to I keep reading contradicting reports of 1 deca increases collagen synth and then 2 deca just lubricates joints covering injuries
This is why you can't just skip to the abstract of a study to learn the quick notes. If you click the link I provided it breaks down all medical research related to nandrolone, I'm going to review it later and you should as well. If you get the full study part of the medical process is reviewing all literature related to the subject, this is a resource many neglect
I think it may be a dose dependent thing here. For sure there's probably some lubrication, increased synovial fluid in joints. Some pain masking occurs. But after usage some say pain goes away forever and others have said the pain comes back
Its just my shoulders bud that I tend to suffer with, all other joints are okay. I was an idiot in the early days though. Would only leave it 24 hours before attacking the same muscle group again trying to get new records, I found gear so damn exciting and fun that I couldn't stop training lol
Tell me bud, do you have a lot of knowledge on human biology such as tendon insertions and muscle firing etc? Someone like John Haack for example - what is it about the inside of his body and the way his tendons/muscle are connected that makes him sooooo much stronger than anyone else naturally?
Byanymeans78All my other joints are good as well... what I think I'm suffering from is this...I jumped Onto this after being out of the gym a couple years and I honestly think my shoulders just aren't keeping up and the npp masked it
Shoulders are a funny body part mate, mine genetically are shit! Any kind of training them directly and they can be sore for a week and kill every other lift in the meantime lol Other guys have very strong healthy shoulders that heal very quickly and don't seem to suffer from overtraining - mainly the Mesomorphs! Lol Then you have all those nasty niggly tendons and cuffs/ball joints and sockets that are so delicate and can be easily messed up. They really aren't a body part that was ever designed well to be lifting heavy loads.
Byanymeans78Yeah that's actually a thought process I got behind I stopped going heavy with my shoulders cuz the risk reward wasn't there. Blow your shoulder out and your fucking done. Just this little shoulder shit is really affecting certain aspects of my training.
I read an article years ago about shoulder pain. I had it pretty bad. My shoulder would pop when I raised my arm and I couldn't sleep on it. The article stated that a majority of exercises worked the front and outer deltoids. The front and outer deltoids get stronger than the rear deltoids and pull the shoulder out of alignment. The cure was to do more rear deltoid work. I stopped shoulder exercises that worked the front deltoids and replaced them with rear deltoid exercises. After about a month my pain was gone. I've had the pain start to come back a couple of times when I wasn't hitting my rear delts enough.
Well one day I will be in that same position. Until then I'm riding it out lifting smart and heavy
Nandrolone definitely joint protective. I am utilizing it in my blast at 150 mg for this exact reason. The problem is you can't run this year-round as your body produces extremely small amounts of nandrolone. It is not a trt add-on, but I think it is essential add-on to any cycle that does not already have a 19n.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7108994/
Byanymeans78Yeah dude as soon as I came off my shoulders have been murder... I'm also looking at bpc and tb500
I would recommend looking into why the are hurting and not ways to mask it only. You can't be on 150 mg of NPP all year. I have never had success with anyone utilizing bpc or tb500. Good luck bro
Byanymeans78Yeah maybe a trip to the doctor is in order