posted Mon, 07/16/2012 - 20:28
2856
+ 1 I Love Arizona!
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I'm in AZ on vacation, as some of you may know Arizona is a "Constitutional Carry" state. This means that walking around with a loaded cocked and locked .45 on my hip is completely legal. I've been here for a day and a half, and have gone everywhere except the gym packing. This is how it should be.
BTW, less than one percent of gun related crimes involve the use of a holster.
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CleyonWow! Sorry for not getting back here sooner, I was on vacation... In AZ and enjoying the ability to Constitutional Carry! Here is the thing that people miss, no gun has ever killed anyone.
Firearms are inanimate objects.
If you do a little research you will find that at the beginning of WWII Japan originally wanted to invade the US starting in Northern CA. The reason they didn't was because the Officers in the Imperial Army and Navy were mostly all educated in the United States. Their reports to the Emperor and superior officers were that to attack the US on their soil would be mass suicide because everybody over there has a gun!
Ur right and that created a response in vietnam, under communistic control the vietnamese people had not much of a choice to the reason a war was brought them. The masses of general population hoarded arms. Then when the american soldiers were there. kids had guns, women had guns. They acted like they were workin in a field.... Watch ur budy get smoked, u'll pull the trigger on a woman?
u must have to live in the u.s and grow up with this drilled into ur head to understand this lol, cos im reading this thinking no wonder why theirs so many gun related crimes in the u.s lol.. here in aus we cant have any auto-semi auto reloading weapons, allowed some single shot guns for shooting clubs and some hunting with a licence, think u may be able to have a semi auto if ur a special licenced security guard not sure and if you do own a gun for shooting clubs or hunting, u have to keep the gun and ammo locked away separately, and cops actually do come by your house to do spot checks to see if you are following the law(had a friend loose his licence and get a 4K fine for having ammo and gun together at home) .. so pretty much no NORMAL people here own guns, cos of the high level of gun control here, obviously as a result there is minimal violence with guns, you can get guns quiet easily here on the black market a semi auto handgun can be bought for around 3-4K, we have shootings here in aus but 99% of them are bikie/underworld related and are only ever shooting themselves or rivals.
tread-mYou actually answered your own question and didn't even realize it. You said you can't have them but they are easy to get underground. So there is the point, if they are illegal the only people that own them are outlaws. I don't know about you but I like the fact that when someone kicks my front door in they can assume I might be ready for them, and they would be right...I don't like the idea that only the outlaws get the best weapons. Does that seriously make sense to you? "Gun related crimes" are crimes. Crimes that would be committed with or without a gun usually. If I want someone dead and I'm hell bent on killing them with or without a gun, they will end up dead. I also like the fact that my country chose to arm its people in case its gov got to repressive. If you want to repress your people as a gov you will be much more successful if they can't shoot you in the forehead! Lol...crime or no crime, I like my rights and I like knowing I can protect them with something besides a stick. : )
i do get where ur coming from with ur last comment, although highly unlikely lol
Amen brother Tread. Besides If you look at Australia before removing it's testicles in 96' (I think that was the year). You see that violent gun related crimes really didn't decrease or have any correlation.
lol bro... removed our testy's in 96? that happened in 96 because in april 96 a guy called martin bryant killed 35 people in one afternoon and wounded 23 others with firearms that were brought LEGALLY lol,the ONLY other massacre style shootings here was in 02 at monash university when a student shot other students with a legally brought pistol from his shooting club.. lol so ur last comment is bullshit saying it has no correlation.. like i mentioned, 99% of shootings that occur here now are bikie/underworld related, these arent your home invaders, these are shootings over million $ drug deals gone wrong/turf wars, not pety crims that are going to shoot u cos they want your tv.
tread-mSo you think if guns had been illegal those individuals would be perfectly normal productive members of society? Not only would they have got their guns they wanted , they would have been just as violent. Guns have nothing to do with it brother, they had legal guns because they could get them legally. If not, they would have obtained them illegally. Your statement is silly given its like me saying you would not have killed someone with a 2x4 if 2x4's were illegal or knives or frying pans or a bow and arrow or anything else. You are blaming a sick individuals action on a gun when the gun did nothing on its own. You can't outlaw stupid or sick or duranged, its called life and you just can't fix everything with laws. Again, these people did not care about the law or they would have known ITS ILLEGAL TO KILL PEOPLE! Just open your mind before you say anything, think about what you are saying, these people were not going to be fine without a gun and I can assure you, they would get a gun, legal or not. I can run into the mall with my big ass truck and likely kill 100 people before I'm through, should we outlaw vehicles? Of course not, we just have to hope more people will be normal and know there will be hate filled people in the world. At least here I can attempt to defend myself with a weapon that I legally have even though many of the criminals do not have them legal. These people you refer to broke 100 laws, you think 1 more would have fixed them huh?
hahaha dude... no ur not getting my point.. yes guns werent the reason y they died,obviously the sick person who did it was. but i'd much rather him chasing 62 people around with a bow and arrow or rock than an easily obtainable gun, which do u think would cause more damage lol. 99.9 percent of people that have guns are responsible, but like everything, theirs always going to be some monkey fucking things up, its much safer someone snapping and wanting to kill people if their isnt an easy supply of guns to get their hands on, how can u not see that? to get a gun and go on a killing spree, u have to know the right people here which are normally underworld figures, and no, before 96 here when the laws where changed, their were 13 massacres(a massacre is classed as more than 4 people murdered) in the 18 years before it.. have a guess how many their have been since?? NONE. not one! lol. a regular person would have NO clue as to how to get a gun here. obviously, in the states, if they wanted to kill someone with a gun, they could get a gun, here?? not so easy buddy.. not every angry person has 4k to spend on a handgun, let alone have any sort of a clue how to get one. my minds open buddy, i just live outside the u.s and see the other side of the arguement.
With that reasoning we should have banned jumbo jets after 9-11. Perhaps we can ban spoons for making people fat, and pencils for making people stupid.
lol no.. ur missing the point completely bro. its a simple task of weighing up what you/people think is more important and taking precautions to stop/minimise it from happening. u mention 9/11... obviously jets cant be banned, but what happened after 9/11? what precautions happened for it to not happen again? u guys would know more than anyone in the world how crazy security went to prevent it from happening again to minimise risk of it happening, airport security will never be the same again because of it. ban spoons for making people fat? no, but again precautions, worlds evolved and u dont eat the same as people did even 10 years ago, america(closely followed by aus) is the fattest country in the world, a minority of people wont control themselves so governments are trying to come up with the best ways to prevent it, same principle.. lol
tread-mWell hell, let's just appoint one gov official per person to follow us around and tell us what we can and can't do, these stinking individual right s are a bunch of BS anyway right? Lol...had to jump back in now we're talking about regulating our food. When you visit here hit California brother, they will give you the key to the city! Well, they will have to borrow some more money to buy you one but not a problem...lol
i strongly DONT condone anyone to have the right to be able to tell people what they can/cannot eat or put into their own body, when it comes to people harming themselves like eating or drugs, i believe no one has the right to tell them what to do, if they want to jump off a building, i'll even give them my blessing lol. but when it comes to things where their decision harm others, completely different story.
lol aslong as its me im happy.. hahaha.
tread-mHell I'll go too you're a good dude. Can I bring my Desert Eagle though? Its the equivalent to the American Express in OZ, we never leave home without it. I promise not to shoot anyone while we're in Cali unless we're having a cheat meal and some lib tries to cram those Apple fries in our face while we have our french fries. Its my damn cheat meal I don't want an apple! Lol
lib tries? apple fries?? f*ing u.s has all the fun shit, cool food.. guns.. dont come to aus cos we dont have those here lol.
god help anyone who tries to jump 2 massive guys with roid rage cos they havent had their cheat meal, especially if ones got a gun. haha
tread-mHUH! Lol
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tread-mOk brother, I went and di a little research and you know much more about your country than I do so you correct me if I'm wrong. The AIC has done a study and in the yrs after the ban and buybacks the assualt rate with these particular firearms have increased at the exact same rate they were increasing prior to the laws. This means in my opinion the same people who would have used the legal assualt guns to commit crime are continuing to commit those crimes now that they are illegal. As I understood the AIC iis pro-gun control so not only are the stats not likley to reflect a bias to support your understanding of guns, they may be biased to statistically report less. Their own study shows the stats if you care to google them. Hate is not in a gun brother is all I'm saying, hate is in people and as with these in this study, the hate didn't go away with a law. I will tell you this, if a gunman walks into a walmart on a mass killing here where I am he will likely kill less people than in a state firearms are not legal to carry. Good people with a carry license are around and can stop people hopefully a little quicker. I guess its this for me, if I ask yoh if you would rather rob a house where you know people are armed or one where they are unarmed which will you choose? Same with a carjacking or a robbery of a store or anything. When 99.999% of gun owners are responsible people I fell better with the other fraction of irrisponsible people walking around with them legal or not. If I get shot in the face I really don't give a shit if the guy had the gun legally or not..I GOT SHOT IN THE FING FACE NOOKA...SAVE ME!!! LOL..its an agree to disagree I know bud but at least we can share our thoughts without getting shot. Now if its that crazy ass Goth, we can't talk freely like this, he'll say its religion based conversation and shoot us both in our asses and ship us to ground zero for religious fanatics ! PEACE I'm in hiding before he see's this.
lol its all good bro, im not taking offence to it, its in my personality to have fun debating people, im not trying to have a personal attack or anything, lol we're just both head strong people, like anyone is on cycle hahaha. i do like my point tho of... how many massacres their were before and after the laws were changed.. 13 massacres in the 18 years before and ZERO in the 15 years after... lol just saying
tread-mAnd that is a VERY good point to make brother. I hate the mass killings and particularly our kids trying to get an education and make their way through life. At the same time I ask myself if that solved the problem and the answer is no. The mass killings probably account for what, a millionth of 1% of killings? Maybe? Having said so if crime has not decreased in terms of. The killings these weapons are involved with statistically was it effective? I have to love the fact that it does in fact seem to be the very reason for the argument you make and can't argue that point. As happy as anyone it has been effective in that one way. I guess we could outlaw all guns on the planet and then the only people on earth that would have them would be hundreds of thousands of outlaws. I just don't like knowing if someone rolls up to kill my family I have to try and fend them off with inferior weaponry. You made some good points brother nice discussion!
thanks bro, well played on your end too
apparently its a sign of intelligence been able to debate without making it personal or taking offence.. dont think the person who made that up had me in mind tho lol ;-)
I'm offended. Now I hate the whole country of Australia. Even that damn Mick Dundee, and believe me brother I used to love that crocodile killing bastard. Which by the way he would have been dead if it wasn't for guns.
tread-mLol...maybe not . I just like debating like you. I'm that guy watching a debate on TV wishing I could say something and can't! Lol
hahaha i pissed myself laughing reading that lol
Im also a huge firearm advocate...... but if you have to take a pistol everywhere you go, YOUR GOING TO THE WRONG PLACES!!!! But I also carry and leave it at the house on most days..... really don't see the need to whip it out everytime they fuck up my order at Dairy Queen!!!! Im of the opinion that we as ppl still generally care and wanna help each other, not shoot a mfer dead in the streets cause he cheated on 5 card rummy!
I love guns.
People don't realize how good we have it in the U.S.
Actually you can conceal it now legally! No permit
shoxingbiceps17So no carry permit is needed? In my state I do the same everyday, but I need a carry permit
CleyonNope, no paperwork needed! Don't have to be a resident or anything. As I type this my Kimber Tactical Pro II is sitting on my hip. And I'm out having dinner with my family.
tread-mI'm in Tx, we can carry in the vehicle etc without permit but you are right, that's the way it should be. Much less likely someone will come in a rob a joint knowing many will be draggin heat and less likely to have car jackings, less likely for innocent people to be murdered. It happens still and that's the lib argument, but there is no question in crime stats that you are safer in places where more than just the outlaws have heat! Fing duh! Libs argument is outlaw guns it will be safer. Safer for fing who, outlaws? They don't obey the fing laws anyway! So now what, they KNOW they are the only ones with a gun. Yeah that makes perfect sense . F all that, you pull up on me and pull out a gun you get a nice little overdose of lead. And while we wait for the cops I'l drop anothe r clip in this bitch and prop your ass up weekend at Bernie's style and get in a little target practice! Hey enjoy your vacation prick, I'm at work! Lol
shoxingbiceps17Very nice, I EDC my dan wesson compact, nothing better than a .45cal 1911
Agree with ya!