Blood work and How to tell if recovered? what numbers are we looking for
Hey guys, was wondering what way to tell if your recovered, or on the path to recovering. Im asking because I am planning a cycle, but am in no immediate rush. I am cutting, at about 11 % bf now, going to wait untill I get to 8 % then do a lean bulk cycle. I have blood work from 4 weeks after pct ended and 9 weeks after pct ended. Is it ok to jump back on cycle given the appropriate time length if your lh and fsh numbers are good? or are you looking to get your total test back to pre cycle levels?
BLOOD WORK
Jan 2012
Testosterone total-780 (ref range 348-1197) 65% of max
Total estrogen- 53 ref range 40-115
Jan 2013 PRECYCLE first time
Test total-790 (ref range 348-1197) 65% of max
E2-20
August 2013 PRECYCLE second time
2 months after post cycle
Test total-617 (ref range 175-781) %79 of max
Test free- 99 (ref range 47-244)
Test free percent 1.6
Shbg- 53 (ref range 13-90)
Feb 2014 4 weeks after PCT
Test total-392 (ref range 175-781) 50% of max
Test free- 88
Test free %- 2.1 *note was using UNLEAHED natural free test booster, and shbg lower, I guess it proves it works lol
LH-5.9 (ref range 1.2-10.6)
SHBG-32
FSH-3.1 (ref range .7-10.8)
April 2014 9 weeks after Pct
Test total- 459 (ref range 175-781) 58% of max
Free test-78 * stopped unleashed after last Bloodwork
Test %-1.7
Shbg- 46
*so based on these numbers it looks like my total test is about 70% of the max ref range.
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TropicanaJuiceThis whole topic was just for my curiousity! Basically to see based on Bloodwork how to know your recovering and not doing damage that's irreversible aka TRT. I will never jump back on cycle if my body and my mind aren't ready, this wasn't to get an ok to start cycling again I don't want to now regardless. Again, I was gonna plan a lean bulk cycle, but had no plans on starting soon, getting to 8% bodyfat, doesn't matter how much muscle u have if it's covered in fat. Plus the body grows best in a lean state
eryximachusYou are young, and you had good test numbers before. I'm 36, and I'm at 490-550 months after a cycle.
I would highly suggest you wait a good long while to see if your test levels will return to normal. I would even suggest something like 25mg of clomid every day for 6 months, then take a lot of time off. At least 6 months.
Long term, low dose clomid therapy has worked wonders to get people back to normal, though it is not often discussed here.
Keep training, and don't use gear until your late 20s at the earliest. Trust me, it gets old after a couple years. You want to maximize what youth you have left. Before you know it, you'll be 40. Who knows where you'll be? Hopefully, you will take your dedication in the gym, and discipline yourself to make a good career. Once you're 40, after you've slept with 100+ women and have a career, you'll probably want to have kids. And if your balls are broke, that isn't going to happen.
southernmuscle615holy shit, the dudes on this board man…The guy has already done 2 cycles, at this point why talk him down??? Yes theres a good chance he will be on trt the rest of his life, yes theres a good chance he will battle with ED forever, and yes at 21 yrs old thats pretty dumb... whether he knows all that or not is irrelevant at this point, the damage is done..
Anyways..
The best numbers to aim for in anyones case after cycle, is the numbers you SHOULD'VE had before you ever started cycling: T, free T, total estro, estradiol, FSH, and LH...
Just what i knew would come out your kiddie mouth.............. BANNED.
Hey, as a 24 year old 175 lb stud, you are the perfect man for the job.
No need to talk this brother down when he can get guidance from your badass. You have that extra year of experience over the O.p that will make all the difference.
I'm cool with turning it over to you. Wish I would have thought of that before I wrote all of that shit earlier.
That's not how I roll. I actually give a fuck. Just because you think it fine for folks to continue destructive behavior, doesn't mean we will sit back and co-sign idiocy. Don't give advice if all you have to offer is "continue doing wrong" the OP has proven he can do that on his own.
TropicanaJuiceThanks that's all I was looking for in the first place, I have waited before for my test to return. I'm not even trying to jump back on cycle. I don't want to be on trt... That's why I take proper time off. Thanks for the help
Yes some damage may have been done but there's absolutely no reason to promote further damage...... WTH
There are a bunch of numbers that you need to look at but the most important number that you should look at before is the two digit number at the top of the blood test sheet. It's listed next to "Age:". You should wait for that number to read somewhere in the range of 27-30, before cycling again.
Hope that helps.
All my love, no homo
Ed
TropicanaJuiceLol, I've done two cycles and wrote like 80 posts and I've never got flamed this much. But I agree I'm at a young age, however it's something I really want, I truly love bodybuilding and would do anything for it. I'm not reckless with my cycles, or doses, I don't stay on, and I make sure I get bloods, I'm simply asking if your lh and fsh are in te normal range and your test levels are slowly rising then would getting on cycle (hypothetically) do any more damage then waiting till your test levels came all the way back?
Don't take it personal brother, but when I see a post like this I see a young kid looking to get around the "time on+pct time=time off". Surely you've been around long enough to understand this concept but it's not what you want to hear is it? When I see kids looking to cut corners and taking it to the extreme, I see an unhealthy pattern that is going to lead you to trt at 25. This is where you are pouring gasoline on yourself and just wait for the flaming.
I've looked at your pics and honestly bro, you could have gotten just as far natty as you did on juice for your EBC pics.
Yet for the sake of giving it your all you ignored the fact that at 21 juicing is foolish and did what you wanted to do.
You say that you truly love bodybuilding and would do anything for it, but really you should re-phrase that by saying "I truly love body building and would do anything for it as long as I do it my way."
You have a number of guys on this post including the big V himself telling you to lay off the juice but it doesn't jive with what you want, so really, why even ask for advice? You don't want it if it's not what you want to hear, so why waste yours and our time?
I gave my two cents, it wasn't what you wanted to hear so it's shit.
Never mind the fact that I ran juice at your age and now looking back realize that I would be bigger and badder today had I not done it at such a young age.
The difference between you and I besides the fact that I was much bigger than you at 22 is I had no one to turn to, I didn't have old guys pointing me in the right direction. You have a gift here with guys like Vike, yet you seem to know more because you are more dedicated. Right?
Doesn't make sense does it brother.
I think it's great that you have "wrote like 80 posts" unfortunately brother that still doesn't make you any older, and judging by your response to the "flaming" I think it's safe to say that the 80 posts haven't made you any wiser.
So I say look at your blood work and do what you want, just don't ask for help if you aren't going to take it.
TropicanaJuiceI think you truly got me wrong brother, I will never cut corners when it comes to recovering and my health. Hence why I run pre mid and post blood work. I have no plan on getting back at the moment, I'm worrying about cutting. I've been off since December, I know the drill this post wasn't for someone to tell me it's ok to juice again, I really would like to know if guys consider total test returning to pre cycle blood baseline as being recovered, or the fact that there levels are rising over time. I posted this because I actually DONT wanna fuck myself up, I do want to have kids and my levels aren't back where they were pre cycle yet that's why I'm asking. Guess I shoulda asked if I should be worried that my test isn't all the way back yet and showed blood work, lotsss of ppl got the wrong impression apparently.
Everyone has a different base line. If you ran bloods before ever cycling, a few times that should give you a good idea of where you need to be during the recovery. I think this is why is so important to max natty potential before cycling. It gives you a better baseline for comparison. If a guy runs a blood test 49 lbs over weight his base line test numbers will likely be lower than it would be if he took a couple of years to drop the fat and build muscle. If he jumps into a cycle as a fatass, has a successful run loses considerable body fat he really won't have a good base line to compare. Not sure if that makes sense or not.
TropicanaJuiceYa that makes sense, thanks
We'll put bro! +1
Oh .... Can a get a amen from the congregation..
I'm going to try not to break any rules here. Most including myself would not give a 21-year-old advice on a cycle. I will say this though if your numbers are not back to where they were. Then no do not start another cycle. I am very curious as to what your test levels were before you started your cycle.
TropicanaJuiceI'll pull up my numbers later
Your 21 bro really? why are you using aas at such a young age your natural test levels should be high enough where you will make great gaines if your eating and training hard
TropicanaJuiceI'm almost 23. It's my decision, I have goals and bodybuilding is and will be my life, I don't need to be lectured, I get blood work pre mid and post, I'm smart as can be about it. aas taking smart are not bad.
Brother i think you need to sit down and have a life check!... i just clocked the pics from the EBC expecting to see a genetic freak who grew just from looking at gear pics lol..... man to be serious you have some serious learning and hard work to do before you put the rest of your life on "hold" indefinitely..... my suggestion would be to firstly become a nutrition expert as that is 85% the game as far as i am concerned.... bro i am a coach and compound consultant in real life and if you came to me i would refuse to take your money until you got yourself into some sort of aesthetic physique and would definitely advise against steroid use at this stage ... use your youth well instead of destroying yourself for the future imo.
TropicanaJuiceViking brothe I respect you, what do you mean by get myself into asthtic physique? And what do you mean by putting my life on hold
That statement means to me like you care about nothing else!... at your age you should be looking at nailing down a great career and investing in property etc.... you should be nailing chicks by the van load and partying every night!..... a bodybuilding lifestyle needs 100% commitment and a self-centred approach to accomplish high goals in physique quality or competition if thats your bag.
Aesthetic comment was aimed at the fact i personally would say you need at least 2yrs hardcore diet and gym time to even start looking like a bodybuilder ... you are a big boy no disputing but the stereo-typical double inverted pyramid bodybuilder shape just is not there yet brother.
I am not aiming to rip you here bro... i want you take this onboard to make a better you without wasting your precious youth by jacking up on compounds you really dont need at your age.
TropicanaJuiceAnd yes I'm cutting now untill I get down to 8%, 6 pack abs there even when not flexed, veins in my arms, the whole nine. After that I wanna lean bulk and put quality muscle on. I got to 242 on cycle and like I said, didn't look good with my shirt off, with my shirt on I was big but didn't look like a bodybuilder, so that's why I have been cutting those pics are old and actually embarrassing I just looked at them. Then I just wanted mass, I was always super skinny so I wanted to pack on the size now I know the scale isn't important, rather the mirror
Nailing chicks in a van down by the river
TropicanaJuiceBodybuilding takes 110% commitment. Is that bad that I want that now? I don't party, don't drink, don't dtay up late, others might not find that fun but I am having lots of fun cause I'm workin for somethin I love. And I deff was fat in those pics, that was awhile ago I realized that with my shirt off I looked like a powerlifter not a bodybuilder, I have cut 30 pounds since then, I have a bodybuilder body coming in now.
its great to have goals my man but why not train as hard as you can till you hit that wall and get as big as you can with out AAS then start using them? we are just trying to help you bro we don't want you to hurt yourself or do damage that you cant reverse at such a young age that's all
Good luck with your dreams, but that attitude will not get you any help here.
TropicanaJuiceI don't have an attitude lol these comments are just irrelevant to the question I am asking and I don't need a lecture
You're 22.....and bodybuilding is your life eh?....that's sad man.
TropicanaJuiceWhy is that sad? Lol it's something I care about more than anything but family...
Because you're 22 man. Live your life! It'd cool to be involved in BBing. But you're still a kid.
TropicanaJuiceTo each is to own I guess, I'm sure there is something your truly passionate about that you would do anything for, bodybuilding is mine, that means eating clean, counting everything that goes into my mouth, busting my ass in the gym, researching countless hours on nutrition, it's all apart of bodybuilding and I don't regret not drinking or eating whatever I want whenever I want. I'm just not a big partier anyway I still of course live my life and have fun no doubt, just with bodybuilding goals coming first
Check it out guy, Im competing in 19 days. BBing is huge part of my life but not my whole life. I'm very passionate about BBing but you have to be a fool or just plain old blind to think you have or could make a career out of BBing. No disrespect but only the top 3 in the world can make a living off of BBing, the rest have jobs just like everyone else.
TropicanaJuiceIk I don't wanna be a pro bodybuilder, I don't like that look I like 70s bodybuilding more asthetic, but I don't do it for the money I do it for myself. But ya I guess I could loosen up a bit. Enjoy my life and don't obsess over bodybuilding, it's hard I have OCD and am very obsessive/passionate about thinga
Agreed. Smh