posted Mon, 02/24/2014 - 08:07
6532
Adding HCG to TRT
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Hi Guys,
I started HRT with HCG Monotherapy at 1,500iu 3 X's a week. This brought my test levels up to 700 from 320 and free test from 50 to 100, but also my e2 from 25 to 125. My doctor switched me over to Test Cyp at 100mg a week, or 50mg twice per week. My test level's on the cyp were brought to 707 and 150 for free test. With the Cyp I was also on .5mg of Adex twice per week and my e2 came back at 19.
I am now adding HCG and my Dr. wants me to take 500iu twice per week in addition to the Cypionate, and stay on .5mg of Adex twice per week as well.
My question is will adding 500iu twice per week to the Test Cyp further boost my test levels?
Thank you :-)
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Where the hell can I find such a nice Doc?
Lol
Try Zocdoc.com
To everyone sorry if this is not allowed.
Will do!
HCG is very potent stuff! If you have a good brand and take in higher doses...BOOM! Take Nolva or Arimedex to counter the Esrogen.
If you are over 35 take 200 mg DHEA daily with HCG. DHEA alone turns to E. However given the LH signal it turns into test. I have gotten pretty buffed doing this.
However, HCG is a great rejueventing treatment to counter age related hypo and used properly is probably healthy for men who have no heart or prostate issues.
I had no luck with that protocol 4 years ago. Hcg when used with test cyp is tricky because hcg can convert to both testosterone or estradiol.
Since your testosterone is already high your body will try to balance you test to estrodiol ratio. You will feel good while on hcg but my endo abandon the idea because the unpredictable e2 spikes.
Everyone's body is different I wish you luck. Just my two cents hcg would be a waste while on test cyp. Your trying to restart you gonads while shutting them down. Pick one you can't have both. If your on trt or hrt you will end up with test cyp or e
"hcg can convert to both testosterone or estradiol."
Impossible for that to happen. hCG can stimulate both testosterone production as well as estradiol production directly in the testes themselves which cannot be combated with an AI but it does not convert to either one.
Also hCG is used alongside testosterone in TRT not necessarily for testosterone production but for the health benefits associated with it. hCG mimics LH. you have LH receptors all over your body not just in your testes. It is important that those receptors get stimulated from time to time and that is the thought process behind hCG when taking testosterone for TRT.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/16285473/
Believe it or not, hcg will increase estrogen. Hcg along with testosterone is purely cosmetic if he is a hypo
Never said that hCG doesn't increase estrogen. What I corrected in your post was that hCG doesn't convert to testosterone nor does it convert to estrogen. There's a big difference between the two statements.
It's an analog,
analog convert to a target hormone. Weather it's estrogen or testosterone it depends on the body to valence the levels out.
If testosterone is to high the (lh analog) Hcg will convert to estrogen to signal the body it has to much testosterone and needs to balance it estrogen accordingly to the testosterone
Oh boy.
Lol don't get mad do we agree to disagree.
You say it mimics, I say it converts. Who really cares as long as we know its process in the body. Shake
I never get mad on here nor do I get frustrated. And we definitely do not agree and there is a huge difference between converting and Causing something to be produced.
You really need to get some of the stuff sorted out if you want to understand the HPTA.
Sorry instead of using converted I should of used produced. Now we are on the same page.
I used hcg with an endos supervision for a year and 8 months and fully understand this hormone.
I wish you continued success my friend.
Hcg caused me problem with estrogen, the endo did not like the yoyo, at one point she had to put me on letro. most people never have an issue with it.
I do miss my boys being huge. Lol I use small a small dose from time to time to get them to a decent size. Take care brother
HCG can cause estrogen problems in certain individuals. The one thing I can say about this is that both positive and negative side effects are typically dose-dependent.
Someone with your sensitivity issues I would suggest trying 75IU five days a week and see where it puts you. You really do need some stimulation to your LH receptors throughout your body.
Hey bro I took HCG with my Pct Just prior to my latest cycle -
My strength and energy was incredible and my nuts grew back bigger than ever-
Now I'm on again and it's been 7 weeks and 6 weeks into my cycle they have al but didsappeared -
Are you an advocate of moderate dosages HCg in middle of cycle to 'reset ' your receptors or is that horsehit I heard years ago-
I am aware that most of the leading TRT docs encourage both test and HCg throughout -
Maybe this should of been a new post
HCG throughout the whole cycle from the beginning up until four days before PCT.
It has nothing to do with resetting receptors. It has to do with stimulating LH receptors throughout your body.
Thx whynot-
HCg throughout?
That also will keep natty producing?
So no shrinkage into raisins?
Yes hCG throughout your cycle and for TRT.
We tried
1000iu 3 x a week for 6 months
Then 500iu x 3 a week for 6 months
Then 250iu x 3 a week
Then 100iu x 3 days then she gave up.
I do 250iu x3 a week for a month every 6 months. I will try 75iu a day I have 4 10,000iu in my stock pile.
That is a pretty exhaustive trial and error process for you. You just happen to be one of the unlucky ones that doesn't fare well on hCG (but definitely not the only one).
Since you are so sensitive to it. My recommendation would be to try 150 IU one day a week and see where that lands you. My original recommendation I am afraid might be too much for someone as sensitive as you.
Thanks for the idea. I'm getting labs at the end of march I'll start after so I can have a base line to com pair. I'll repeat the labs a month later.
Fr sent I'll keep you posted on that thanks bro
You're welcome. Good job on the labs. If you need any other help just ask.
Hey bro would you accept a friend request ?
yup
WhyNot,
Do you do the blasting and cruising like some others do on this forum? I am not at that point, and I don't know if I will go that route. I want to get my TRT dialed in.
At some point I might be interested in upping my test dose at most, but don't know if it is worth possible risks at my age.
Thanks...
I do not blast and cruise.........I prefer my HPTA to function as long as it can on its own.
Are you on TRT, or just know a ton about it? :-)
I am not on TRT but I work with people and their TRT protocols.
Thanks for the help! I was just curious...
You're welcome. If you have any questions just ask.
You have a legitimate question. And yes it will boost your testosterone even further by how much you can only tell after you get blood work done.
Every time you introduce a new compound into your TRT protocol you will have to dial-in.
Your e2 seems kind of low. What is the range for E2 and the testosterone and free testosterone in your blood work?
He's giving you in my opinion too much hCG. 150 IU three times a week Would probably be ideal for a total of 450 IU a week.
Also I would add Pregnenolone and DHEA to your protocol to back fill some of the pathways that are disrupted by your TRT.
Thanks for the reply. I am taking 100mg of Pregnenolone nightly per his request but not DHEA. I think I could have used less Adex on the trt only regime, but now with the HCG I believe it should be fine. I'm not sure of the ranges as my blood work results are in my desk at my office.
When you get a chance please post the ranges. I have a feeling your E2 might be too low.
For ranges it says Estradiol < OR = 39 and mine is 21
Testosterone Total 250-1100 and mine is 706
Free Testosterone 35-155 and mine is 143
The two labs that the Dr. DID NOT like were ALT and HDL as my HDL has been dropping after being on HRT, and my ALT is rising. I have changed my diet and added Niacin and Fish Oil. I put the numbers below.
1/10/14 11/20/13 09/11/13 08/08/13
ALT 47 45 37 33
HDL 25 30 ? 33
By the way my LDL is good at 77
I am confused first you said your number came in at 19.
Do yourself a favor and ask for a "Estradiol - sensitive" test. You need to really figure out where you're at with your E2. Regular tests are just not sensitive enough for a man.
Your ALT Will benefit greatly if you incorporate Diindolylmethane (over-the-counter) into your daily regimen. Do some research into it.
I won't comment on any of the cholesterol until we can nail down your E2.
Hope this helps.
"Your ALT Will benefit greatly if you incorporate Diindolylmethane (over-the-counter) into your daily regimen. Do some research into it."
Diindolylmethane was supposed to me N - ACETYL CYSTEINE
Diindolylmethane Will help manage your E2.
Sorry just out of it this morning.
I made a mistake as my E2 was 21 and not 19.
Before I started HRT my E2 was 24. When I was on HCG monotherapy of 1,500 iu's 3 times a week my E2 was 125. I then switched to 100 mg a week of Cypionate without any HCG and the Dr. wanted me to also take 1mg of Adex twice a week. After taking the first 1mg tablet I felt like crap and with some help from this sight I realized it was too much and likely crashed my E2, so I switched to .5 mg twice a week and the Dr. said that was good based on what happened.
Try incorporating Diindolylmethane along with some Zinc, it might help you manage your E2 Without an AI. If you can drop the AI from your protocol you would be a lot better off.
Thank you very much for all your help as I really appreciate it!
Kind regards..
You are welcome if you have any other questions just ask. And regardless of what I say or anyone else just continue to explore on your own and learn and educate and verify all the information you get as it is your body you only get one.
I will do it in the a.m.
I appreciate your time!
How old are you and what is your bodyfat %?
44 years old, and I'm guessing around 20% body fat.