+ 4 What two Pins of Test E can do to your body. A newbies first time
Pinned twice last week for the first time. Mon and Thurs of test e 500 mg so 250 mg a pin. I am getting blood work done every mon morning. I have a full blood work but since I am on an Iphone and not home i will share the levels out of range.
Week 1 blood work results. Typing all from iphone by hand :/
There is a lot more info which I will post when I get home but here is a few:
Test: 1500>. Didnt give me an exact number its over 1500 though after a week.
Estradiol: 99.2. Range is 7.6-42.6. So I am teice the normal range.
LH: .5 This is low range is 1.7-8.6
FSH: .3 also low 1.5 - 12.3 is range
BUN: 22 range is 6-20
Monocytes 1.1 range is .1-1.0
This blood work was taken after two pins of Test E of approximately 250 mg.
Pins were done on Mon and Thurs with blood work done mon after prior to pin 3.
What does this mean?
1) My test levels are already well beyond 1500 didnt say exact number. Range tops at 1100
2) my nuts have shut down.
3) My protein diet is high (bun)
4) My white blood cell count is high.
5) My estradiol is already twice the normal levels. Which means an Ai needs to be taken to keep in normal range (i have one on hand an armidex)
Thoughts? Comments?
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Chaz32621Very nice read, I can't believe it kicks in that fast so what's the point of a oral kick starter then
I agree that what ever ester the effect starts immediately. You may just not notice it as easily as the effects are cumulative and the drug is at a lower concentration. Peak concentration is reached With cypionate/enanthate that would be around 4 weeks.
Effects don't go from 0-100% on the fourth week of a cyp/enan cycle.
Wouldnt free test be a very valuable measure for a case like this?
Elaborating on what rusty said below about the test levels appearing very high, but its not necessarily usable to receptors at that point yet.
it is useable!!!! But the higher the test level the MORE ligand-androgen receptor activation which means multiple androgen receptors initiate protein synthesis.
Of course a prop kicker will cause a quicker reaction. This is because IN ADDITION to the long ester test that is already working the prop ALSO activates receptors (at a quicker rate)
many people think test enanthate doesn't work until weeks 4-5. This is wrong, it works day one. But the total amount released in the blood will not be as high in the beginning because only a certain amount is released at a time. That is why the buildup is quicker than the amount of ester cleaved off leading to noticeable gains in later weeks.
RustyhookerYou're very correct! Start that ai. .25e3d.....if nips get sensitive then .25eod. You can run bloods again in 2 Weeks if you wish so you can "map" your bodies levels and dial the ai in for best growth. 30-40 is decent range.
Nice!!! Hopefully noobs that think enanthate takes "4 weeks to kick in" can read this post and see that that is bullshit. Test begins working immediately
by the way your estro is a little high I'd start 0.25 adex within a week or so
RustyhookerIt seems that "in your blood" and "kicking in" is misunderstood. 4 Weeks to "kick in" is the time for androgen buildup and when the Esters begin breaking off into useable test. That whole scenario would make a great stickie!
esters begin breaking off immediately.
Kick in means that testosterone beings to promote anabolism which doesn't take very long. High test blood levels prove this!
waltrrusty i think you should make a post explaining the process, it'd be good info to be on here
RustyhookerAgree. Time to crack the books open. Test can be in your blood but not available til Esters are cleaved. Yes his blood is above 1500.....but if it was fully open for receptors to use then we'd have no need for prop kickers.
Front loading....another way to hit it faster by large buildup. So as the Esters cleave off and become useable, your levels are banging.
Point being, we use prop as kicker because short ESTER breaks off and useable in bout 4hrs.....dead in 48. If long Esters like enanthate were fully immediate we would not need short Esters.
That being said....long Esters were created decades ago to slow down the breakdown and use of testosterone(et Al). For less frequent pins and a more steady use.
Looking at blood tests proves the points. Look at precycle blood tests where dude has difficulty growing. Test is high yet so is his binding hormones. Which it gonna win? Lower body fat and/or add in a stetoid that unbinds and the difference is clear.
Yes the androgen receptor binding doesn't happen the second you inject it. When ligand is available it binds to receptor and an immediate reaction happens, such as protein synthesis.
Once blood levels rise, testosterone becomes available.
As you can see it took less than a week for his test levels to rise past 1500.
Its a pretty quick process. However the total amount of test available in the blood at a given time needs to be really high to actually see visual gains. Protein synthesis is happening immediately, but the rate is increased with higher blood levels and yes long esters take longer to build up.
RustyhookerA good thorough forum would be good. Showing how blood levels vs useable levels occurs. Trt guys with nonworking nads use a simple 100/week and their blood levels are that of 21-25year old. Bound vs unbound. And how those Esters break into useable form.
Definitly not a sudden bang at week 4...very true!
Yup a graph would be good for visual
http://www.harryfisch.com/images/serum-testosterone.jpg
as you can see peak test levels are hours after each injection then by the third week they are gone. This graph is of test cyp injected every 3 weeks
doctors are finally seeing that cyp needs to be injected more than once per 3 weeks now lol
of course since we inject biweekly the peak levels are rising faster then they are falling, which is why from weeks 4 on test E/cyp is in full force!
waltrthank you for the explanation +1
You make the complex sound simple man...so how soon into a Test E cycle would you suggest first labwork?
RustyhookerSimple test e blood test is usually week 6. But if you can afford it just to really map your own body....it would be fun to do testing weekly.
RustyhookerSimple test e blood test is usually week 6. But if you can afford it just to really map your own body....it would be fun to do testing weekly.
Well I am not Rusty but here is my opinion:
After one pin your body changes. So why not get the first test asap? Your E2 may be 5 times the normal amount. I like numbers.
Lets say you begin an AI and then your E2 crashes. Means lower the dose. Or perhaps could show if gear is bunk.
Not everyone shares my mindset but if I put something in my body I want to know what its doing.
because this is not necessary. Unless u are hypersensitive to estrogen you can wait a couple weeks to begin AI. Your not gonna die having a medium to higher than average estrogen level for a week.
Why would your e2 crash? This is why you start with a low dose and increase as needed. Your gear is proven real since your bloods show greater than 1500
Sound logic. Keep on posting during your run.
Yeah I will. Plan to do blood work monday again. I want to add the AI (armidex) but not sure how much I should take given my E2 level. I gotta research some and ask a few questions.
just take a typical dose. 0.25e3d.
Off-topic but I'm curious as to why you chose arimidex over aro for your first cycle? You seem like you've done quite a bit of research so I'm interested to hear your reasoning.
I found a lot of information coming back and fourth for either side. Ultimately, what I read was that if you are doing a light cycle Armidex is better and heavier cycle Aro. I also read during cycle armidex.
I also read that Armidex is "lighter" meaning that what I read it lowered men's estrogen by 50% at 1 mg (I believe? I would have to double check) while Aro was like 85%.
So to me, less is better. I did feel in my research it was kind of like a pepsi vs coke choice (Maybe not that close).
I could be wrong since this is my first time and I gladly accept correction if someone that has more knowledge comes along.
Good job studying bro! You're absolutely right.
It's true arimidex is not as powerful as aromasin. But that's a good thing. No reason to completely eliminate estrogen we are just trying to "control" it.
It's kind of a personal preference. Aromasin requires a strict dosing protocol and is more powerful. Adex is much easier to dose and adjust to find a perfect amount needed to control your estrogen.
Some people react better to one than the other. Gotta try both and see what works best for you.
RustyhookerBingo! Estro is needed in the body for normal function. Finding your bodies happy spot is key.
Gimme some time to look up some links, but IIRC from reading a good deal about these two, Aro tends to have less sides for people, and at the very least has been shown to be easier on lipid profiles than dex. Only downside I remember is that it tends to cost a bit more than dex.
EDIT:Also supposedly ASin does not cause an estro rebound upon discontinuing the drug, where dex will. just because of the two different types of AI that they are.