+ 11 My take on the Deca vs Eq debate.
Deca- Deca-Durabolin,Anabolic/Androgenic ratio: 125:37 or nandrolone decanoate, is a progestin steroid that produces very high anabolic activity and significant mass increase with milder and fewer side effects than some other steroids.-----side effects are- increase blood pressure, water retention, decreased sperm count,Deca Dick—Deca also helps the conversion rate of test into estro.
EQ- also known as a boldenone undecyclenate Anabolic/ Androgenic ratio: 100:50(about 50% converts to estro) will increase stamina and vascularity or prominent, visible veins as well as slow but steady gains in strength and muscle with very few estrogen-related side effects.--- oily skin, acne, increased body and facial hair—Eq must be taken for a longer time.
Conclusion: "BroSience"-- EQ must be taking @ 600mg min for best results--Deca can be taking @ 200mg a week and still get the benefits from it on the ligaments. As for a weekly dose of Deca--it really comes down to what you can handle--IMO ive always liked the 750mg Test and 500 deca a week.--or if new to Deca-- 500mg test 300mg deca.
size/mass/strength = Deca-Durabolin - nandrolone decanoate - A lot of that Size is water, and you will lose that water when you are done.—Faster results can take it in a shorter time. If you want size fast and strength this is for you. However, NPP
hardness/vascularity/some strength = Equipoise - boldenone undecylenate –Size can be just as good as on Deca because EQ makes you eat.. 5000cals are easy when using EQ.—Must take it longer min 14 weeks—better at 16 best at 18---However, with EQ C , and A results can be faster and can help when achieve certain goals.
Lastly:-- the real reason I choose EQ over Deca is because of Decas ability to help the conversion process of test into estro. This can be seen by many users. The can take test and eq –but going over to test and Deca they have gyno issues or sensitive nipples—Eq only converts to about 50% estro. However, if you want strength and you want to gain more size Deca is the way to go if you have your AI in place and either letro or caber on hand. The both have their place, Just IMO Eq is the better overall when weighing side effects to results over time. –But I will always pick EQ over Deca---But there is no doubt that Deca has it place, in all cycles, and a Bulking cycle if your not prone to sides.
- Bookmark
- 12
- 1
lol I'd like to know where he got his info from, eq converting to estro at a rate of 50%, that's dramatally higher then the rate test converts to estro and Eq is well known to not convert to estro anywhere near the same as test. And another good one is deca " helping test convert to estro". It's still early for me and my brains not working at 100% yet so I can't think of any drug that helps another drug convert to estrogen that we use, maybe I'm forgetting something in my morning haze. Many help do the opposite though, don't let them concert to estro. And letro and caber being interchangeable is another good one. this guy has some good posts, telling people to use test and not add another injectable for atleast like the first 6 cycles that one is very good. But this is crap. I believe deca converts to estro at about 20% the rate of test and eq is even lower then that. And no drug has an exact set rate at which it converts to estro, its different for everyone which is why when I'm on 500mgs of test 50mgs of provi keeps my estro around 50, but when my friend is on the same brand of test at 500mgs and sams brand of provi at 50mgs his estro is 133. Deca doesn't help anything convert to estro and I think even the beginners know letro is an ai and lowers estrogen and caber is a dopamine agonist and lowers prolactin. I could probably pull up some sources on that.
I agree mate, shit post by a shit cunt. There are a few older posts around that are outdated and given he was a source, people wouldnt call him out back then. Fucking troll post imo.
Is it about how they compete for/bind to receptors? i.e. more test floating around = more test to convert? Not helping but upping the supply in a way??
Kind of. It is to do with receptors feeding off each other. The op should of elaborated. Certain drugs stimulate and aggravate others making them upregulate at a higher rate ie: pgr, plr, er. Nandrolone is a tricky little fucka in this regard. This prick though has just made up his own percentages for the sake of posting, forfty percent of people can see that.
Got it, cheers fella
yeah Nandrolone is a tricky mo' fo' in general
Deca dick is the deal breaker for me!!!!
Its amazing the wealth of knowledge one can find when you do just a little research.
Another aspect to think of is when you go on juice you suddenly get a lot stronger. Muscle grow faster then tendons so when injuries occur it is very often that your strength has sky rocketed without your tendons having time to get strong enough for that load. By all means, increase the weights, but maybe stay away from pr's and singles until you have been on for while and your tendon strength has caught up with your muscle strength. Deca, Eq, anavar and gh are some of the best known tendon strengtheners. Drier compunds do not necessarily weaken your tendons (apart from Winstrol which supposedly makes your tendons thicker but brittle) but since they give no water as immediate effect they don't lubricate and thereby cushion your joints which could make them feel more vulnerable I guess. Some of the drier compounds may help to strengthen tendons as you mentioned.
Interesting, but considering the fact that we are in theory, suppose to be off the same time that we are on in a year, leave us with just one long +20 weeks cycle on eq?
Also if 300mg deca is +/- = to 600mg eq in effectiveness
Eq as 50% conv to estro
We end up with the same estro convesion???
AnonThis is a gem for me to read ! +
From what I can gather, the use of ANY AAS (Deca & EQ included) has an adverse effect on joints/tendons. AAS forces production of type 3 collagen. Type 1 collagen is what helps repair tissue. The ratio of type 3-1 alone can have the opposite effect on joints. So you're maskin the issue and probably making it worse when you use deca or EQ for connective tissue repair
Here's one reference
http://www.cuttingedgemuscle.com/forums/showthread.php/13086-Androgen-us...
So lets talk connective tissue repair. I have always thought that Deca is king (aside from hgh) when it comes to joint lubrication and connective tissue repair. This equates to pain free workouts. I have been having some major shoulder problems lately. They hurt constantly. Only thing I can think of is the muscle is too strong for the tendons /ligaments to keep up and carry their share of the load. I have a compact frame. Very low bf. Now when I've brought this up before, it's sparked a huge debate. I know that EQ helps me a little. I'll be honest, it wasn't a drastic improvement in pain reduction on EQ. Is deca much better? Is there any science to back any of this up? Is it all different person to person? Opinions and experience please? I didn't want to start a new thread so I posted here. This topic has been beaten to death with no real conclusion. We have some new knowledgable members here and I'd like some feedback
smallguyObviously everyone knows the origin of the drug was used to create a better race horse. My question is (which has nothing to do with the comparison of deca and eq) how much eq were horses administered?
The only reason I ask is because I see guys on here talking about 600-1200mg of EQ a week. That to me sounds like a lot, which probably isnt.
Does anyone know?
smallguyEq sounds like the more intelligent route..?.. It really sounds like it
Anonlol broscience is a cool word lol
Nic Zewi, great info there. Filled some holes in my knowledge.
question, NPP is same as deca but shorter life? same sides, same everything????
Also, can it be used for a LEAN bulk instead of low test+high EQ cycle?? if so, this makes a LEAN bulk with test+NPP is a WAY shorter cycle than test+EQ... no?
Im asking this because I'm researching substituting EQ with NPP if they deliver similar results. if they do, I can run a shorter NPP cycle, this means shorter time off, this means sooner cutting cycle for the summer...if I chose EQ for this winter with 18 weeks, Im gonna have a LONG time off which will cover the whole 2013 summer and WONT be able to cut during that time.....decisions decisions....
Honestly I dont like seeing people even comparing the two compounds. They IMO have very little real life similarities. Deca is a far better strength and mass builder and a far superior protein synthesizer. Also it is hands down better at alleviating pain in the joints. EQ IMO needs to be ran for a really long time and at high doses to equal the results deca can produce at half the dosage. The advantages EQ has over Deca is the issues Deca has being a 19nor. Prolactin to some users means in some cases tragic side effects. EQ IMO is better at appetite stimulation and RBC production. When rN long enough and high enough it has a thinning effect on the skin and amplifies the vascularity in the user to a great degree. For a cutting effect 16wks at a dose of 600mg is perfect but for any kind of mass building IMo EQ needs to be ran for a minimum of 20wks and at a higher dosage upwards of 800-900mg wk. So really if a user is not prepared to run a cycle where they will need to be on for 4-5 months minimum EQ is definitely not for you. If you have reactions to Prolactin then Deca is definitely not for u. Even with caber which has sides of it's own Deca can wreak havoc on a user that frankly may not be worth the hassle. So it all boils down to each individual user and their own respective bodies reaction to each compound. What their goals are should also play an important role in deciding which compound should be ran. Length of cycle can also be a factor and personal health issues are always important. If I already have high hemotocrit values EQ probably is not for u. High blood pressure will cause irreversible damage to users that are already diagnosed with hypertension. So IMO tree really is no comparison between the two. They are used differently and the sides are altogether completely different. Making the decision to run the two a decision that must be uniquely made for each individual user. Take me for instance. I always get deca dick but guess what I just ordered a coupl of bottles of deca to run soon. My shoulders are hurting like crazy and deca dies wonders for me in that regard. Viking who gets gyno sides with deca is going through a similar thing. His contest prep had left his joints crackling n popping so he recently said he's hitting the deca as soon as his contest is over. It's a relative to our own unique set of goals and situations. Goals/Length of cycle/sides/situational scenario/health. Switch the order all u want but each of those things must be answered by the individual before making a decision.
Agreed! The apples and oranges argument is getting old and blanket statements can be dangerous to the uninformed.
EXAMPLE:
I happen to have Gilbert's Syndrome (my body produces an excess amount of RBC) This is a hereditary condition that has no visible symptoms. The only reason I know I have it is because I believe in regular and thorough blood tests. Now someone with this particular condition who chooses a long EQ cycle runs the risk of "blood sludge" being that EQ increases RBC count. Now, as I do enjoy a good EQ cycle now and again by being well informed in compound effects and sides as well as my own physiology I have learned I can run EQ successfully by expelling a pint of blood a wk. (may sound a little creepy but I'm a solutions guy)
Now this is just an example of how the one size fits all advice and preference pushing can go wrong. Its one thing to have personal preferences, its another to be pushing this as better than that to a majority crowd of novices
My .02
Muscleg33kwould donating blood hinder your gains?
So u donate blood once a week? You said expel so I wasn't sure how u got about it.
I used to but now I handle it myself and to be clear its not the entire cycle, more like mid to end
FK me... leeches and the brides of fkn dracula come to mind!... what do you do with the red stuff?.. bin it or give it the dog.
I just drop 'em off at the hospital bro
Like I said, its a little creepy but it's not illegal LOL
I couldnt do that bro.. i hate needles! lol
...says the guy with a needle sticking out of his ass! LOL
zewiI donate plasma. So i can get paid..
How much you get for that? I might try that shit!
zewiYou can make 50$ a week. Depending on were your at.. and you get paid extra on your 10th visit and 25th and 50th and so on..
But an extra 200$ for gear.. its so easy, to stay in stock..
$50/week is not bad, considering i still got 8 more weeks to start my new cycle that's $400 bucks for gear that i can use by December. Hell i might do this twice a weeks and never have to work again lol
Lol. There's a limit. Depending on where you are it's once every week or once every other week
Would do if wasn't diseased :/
zewiLMAO...
zewiGood add-on i like it +1 from me.. Thanx for rolling over me. lmao.
Nah bro I got nothing but respect for u:-) U my brother n arms! We ride together we die together OG Zewi!
Excellant response bro!... proof is in the learning curve once again,you just like myself saw a dramatic increase in late gains with that little extra time on EQ that is were its at in my book having a mindset to say to yourself "ok this run is a bulker"and stick to that plan no matter what! too many people dont have the patience to run EQ properly and expect it to work like deca with quick blown up type gains, it simply does not work that way.
Also after a long EQ bulker it is far far easier to step into a cutter because the body is in far better condition due to the slow lean hard vascular gains made... in my time i have used EQ for off season dirty bulks, mid season leansemi bulkers and also ran it right upto show day with with tren A/drost stack and been ripped to the bone... another thing about the steady gains from EQ is that they stay with you for a long long time whereas a deca gain will be short lived due to edema... like you mentioned i will be running deca in a couple of weeks but differently for me from any other cycle i will be using Adex every single day as long as i am on, that as you know for me usually is a non starter even running tren E i dont rely on Adex i hate to pile stuff in unless i really feel that i need it... i probably get bit with the itch because i never run anything else but test when i use deca and will probably run approx 1200mg test to 600mg deca the only other thing will be my beloved oxys pre/workout x 4days ....the joints are screaming for it right now so its a must for some pain relief.
12wks max for me on deca ..@ 600mg ... 20wks min @ max 1200mg bold (EQ)
It's all about the learning curve. Once we get what and how our bodies react it opens up a whole new world of growth. I'm just hitting the the tip of the iceberg. The way u talk about AAS bro is almost like dirty talk. Shit gets me a lil too excited! No homo!
Good lookin women and quality aas.. nothing more i need bro,life is sweeeeeet!
nice write up GS you are like a book of knowledge + 1
Eq....my fav! And doing great on just 400/wk.
Great read. I've always ran Deca. I'm on my first cycle experimenting with EQ now. Running them both together tho.
I like EQ because of all the benefits it provides. Strength, joint health, vascularity, increase appetite, thick dense muscle growth, helps with cardio and just makes you feel good. No bad side effects for the most part.
cdaddy7You already know my take on EQ vs deca....not to mention now 1 test is on the scene we have more options to choose from...Deca is quick but the quality gains in time prove Eq to b the choice in my book....everyone is different and choice will b as well
good read bro, I have always been a Deca/Npp guy but the more u and cdaddy talk about Eq I am thinking about giving it a go +1 from me
Anongood post zew man!
Great. Thanks for educating me before on EQ zewi. +1 bro