posted Wed, 04/06/2016 - 15:26
4615
High Test in Cycles?
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Hey ya'll...
I am looking to gather first hand info from guys who have ran high test cycles. By high, I mean 800+. I have seen other boards where guys talk about running crazy amounts, 2 g and up even.
I have no intent of personally exceeding 800-1000 myself, FYI. But, would like to hear the inside scoop on high test doses, if possible. Specifically, how good/bad were gains? Side effects? Did an AI control that estroen conversion well, etc.?
I am looking to start 800/wk in combination with .25 a-dex and 50 mg of anavar.
thannks guys
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So my question is does it matter if the high dose is a long ester like test enth or cyp or pinning sust or a test blend at high dose per week, talking 1000mgs of test e vs 1000mgs of sust per week....
I know that the body supposedly absorbs more of certain esters in comparison to others.
i.e. You get 'more' from 100 mg of prop than 100 mg of cyp, in a sense.
Everyone is different on how test or any compound effects them. For me if you are running such a high mg of test you are looking for mass. I can tell you I've ran over a gram a week in the distant past. I was... "mass". Watery, round...mass. I had no clue what proper diet was...I just ate...and ate. Was around 350lbs of strong...crap! I loved it at the time because I was flickin 45plates like boogers, strong. It was obvious I lifted but had no "physique". So fast forward to current times...
I can do more with 300-500mgs of test a week with proper food intake, concerning quality of gains, than I ever did using a higher dose. Maybe now that I have discipline I would utilize a high test blast better. But why? To throw a larger amount of drugs in my body to combat sides? When it comes to quality and the compounds you can use, test is not the first choice but it is a necessary compound with all cycles.
For me, and this is only my opinion, mega doses are only warranted when one looks like they run mega doses...meaning it is eye bleedingly obvious they have everything locked the fk down from diet, to lifting, to supplementation...basically a pro or one who has the genetic possibility of becoming pro. Or a strength competitor. Because I'll tell ya what...most who run high mg cycles don't look too impressive and I only judge because of the fact they are running such large amounts in the first place.
Mg amount falls short behind the amount of quality nutrients you ingest and the amount of sets you smash on. Be concerned with those 2 first. Don't rely on the amount of gear determining what you get out of it...it depends on the environment you are presenting the gear with! Massive muscle destruction with massive nutrient uptake! Knuckles bro lift on!
AnonVery good +3, I too use to run high doses and my diet was only decent... But my sides were ZITorious and I was holding water .. I tweaked diet and lowered doses and I better utilize the gear with less sides and look better... And my BP is under control
Exactly! We are suppose to feel and look great doing this! Enhanced! Not hindered by the compound because of "abuse"(excessive use.) knuckles brother
AnonThank you fella
Give them a vote if you find it helpful.Permalinki very much agree with all that you said bro! TY!
flicking 45 lb plates like boogers....LMAO, I know exactly what u mean though, haha. That feeling of T levels through the roof is pretty much amazing. It's definitely a high of its own... That superb 'focus' you have in the gym is pretty sweet.
Most definitely! The high you get pushing past previous weights that were near impossible...and moving it with force...thats when you have complete belief in yourself and capabilities. That belief carries over into other aspects in life. Lifting/working out, the best activity there is to strengthen mind body and soul!
Edit: Double post
Currently running a high test cycle and although the gains are unlike a moderate test high tren cycle they are still comming in thick and steadily.
And it's cheap. Like the other bros said , food and maturity come in to play but if you're a lean 230 odd man a high test cycle could be for you.
Honestly I felt no difference between 1100mgs and 750mgs. I had to see what a gram was like and i was not impressed. I was horny as shit lol, but I truly believe my body can only really use about 750mgs ew max. So thats where i keep it these days. I had no problems with estrogen using just 50mgs of proviron and .25mgs of adex 2-3 times ew, my e2 was 56 which is where i like it when i bulk. I dont remember any sides, BP was good, not to alot of bloat, i did end up getting injured right when things starting getting good, right around week 7 or so. But im running 750mgs right now and my strength is going up just as fast, muscle gains are the same. It depends on BW in my opinion, a 220lb 6 footer is not gonna need or be able to use as much test as a 6ft 250lb bodybuilder. all things being equal (diet, training etc) .I just felt like i was wasting good test that cycle.
Thanks, Irongame! Proviron is something i am unfamiliar with. From what little i have read, it supposedly increases the potency of other AAS being run with it? And will increase libido? Would u mind giving me some personal experience with the stuff? I have also read it converts to DHT, so how bad is the hair loss with it?
I generally avoid winny and masteron b/c I really want to keep my hair. The whole hair loss subject is confusing to me, b/c all i hear is mixed theories (grandpa on mom's side, etc.)
John Meadows says if you cant grow on 300mg test/week then bodybuilding isnt for you. food will always be number one. you say you push food hard, but trust me it can be pushed harder. if its not an extreme effort for you to eat at this point, if you dont HATE eating then you can push it harder.
i am your same height 5'11, and my experience was to push past 230 was the hardest plateau to break. the amount of food it took to get from 230-235 was ALOT more than it took to get from 225-230. i was pushing 500g-850g carbs per day. i had to do it with mostly good, healthy whole foods, too much junk food and i get fat.
that being said, yes alot of people use high test. just like any other test cycle you can control estrogen with regular AI like aromasin or adex, you dont always need letro. same as any other cycle you should get bloods dont at 6 weeks and adjust your AI accordingly. there is a law of diminishing returns, the amount you get from 500mg/week of test is not 3x more on 1500mg/week of test. is it more? yes, but the chance of side effects are far greater and the results do not equate to 3x more lean tissue gains, that will be decided by your food.
i would ask what are you goals? are you a national level bodybuilder? (i would assume not if your here asking this). or just a guy who wants to look more muscular? these factors will help decide how hard you should push it. in most cases its really not needed. not trying to shut you down or hate on you or anything, just being realistic brother.
fact, if you dont hate eating youre not eating enough of the right foods. 5000s cals of crap is a hell of alot easier then 5000 cals of quality food.
slowbro,
I appreciate the detailed response a lot man. I also agree with you on the food situation. I definitely do consume food like a garbage disposal, BUT, you're right - there is always room for more
No, I am not by any means a national level BBer. I would like to compete someday (maybe), but I am not happy enough with my physique lol... not yet anyways!
I am aware that diet would play a crucial role, if i were to run this amount of T... As would sufficient AI. I am planning to go with a-dex, at .25 mg 2x/wk... But will adjust (increase) accordingly... and I am like you, I gain fat pretty easily if my diet gets sloppy. When I do my 7 meals, I often feel as if they were too 'light' in a sense. Like... too clean or too light, if you know what i mean? Its like at the end of the day, my body feels like it needs to be stuffed with anything and everything I can get my hands on. Ugh... it sucks.
How much protein is 'too much' by the way? 360 g's per day isnt too hard for me to consume.
360g protein is not too much by any means. somethings that helped me were making sure my digestion optimized, i did a little write up about it recently
https://www.eroids.com/forum/general/general-talk/digestion-discussion
also, keeping my fats lower. fats slow digestion down, so with my big carb meals i would do no added fats, just the fats from my meats. also liquid carbs can make a big difference and add up quick. liquid carbs shouldnt be the majority or anything, but a glass of juice with break fast helps, inta workout drink with carbs helps, post workout shake helps, a glass of juice with your post workout meal, it all adds up. its much easier to add 200g carbs that way and push to 600+ carbs. and dont foget veggies!
as far as AI that you need to run 800mg test a week? its varies from person to person. i would personally probably start with 0.25 3x a week. but i prefer my estro to be in the mid range 20-35, its where i feel my best, i know for bulking some guys like to let it creep up a bit, but i never feel good. 0.25mg 2-3x a week would be a good starting point. i would really encourage you do get bloods done, i didnt for a long time and once i started a wish i had started earlier, it really makes it so much easier to control estro. 80$ for labs a few times a year is alot cheaper than gyno surgery lol.
with all this being said, i really prefer my cycles with higher test, when i start to add other compounds in i never feel as good as just a good hefty dose of test and smaller doses of other steroids. everyone is different, you gotta try and figure out what works for you. 800 isnt too heavy of a dose.
Not criticising you but I think you would better spending more money on food than more steroids!
more food? I'm on 7 real food meals per day.... 360 grams of protein
Fair enough mate, that's a decent amount of meals, I aim for 6 a day but sometimes only manage 5.
Have you thought about trying to increase your protein to get to 2g of protein per pound of body weight? I know an extra 100g is a lot to ask on top of what your already eating but it's just thought.
Damn that's Alot of test I hit 700 mg prop a week I was pinning a ml everyday and I was bloated up had high BP all that shit! Good luck man
what im looking at is 350 prop/wk in combination with either 250 or 500 Enanth/wk... so either 850, or 600.
I just keep reading other boards, where guys claim that if u run high test along with the proper AI, your gains can be phenom.
i have ran heavy in the past, but never with an AI. I didnt think they were necessary.. long story short - I just followed the recommendations of the local juicers, who all were strong AF and said ''estrogen blockers kill off your strength gain, you need that estrogen for your joints, blah blah blah''. It wasnt until i discovered eroids that I actually learned some shit, sadly.
It is largely dependent on your goals, prior cycles and personal preference. I honestly don't see a point in going crazy with the doses. There is only so much you can gain during a cycle and thats mostly dictated by your diet and training. Go beyond that point and you gain mostly water. Pros might need high doses as they run gear year long and at serious doses. I know some people that claim that test has little effect on them and run close to a gram or more. I personally never felt the need to go beyond 500 - 600 but I prefer low end doses. I'm not a pro and there is no need to put so much strain on my body. As with absolutaley every drug, the higher the dose the higher chances for side effects. I don't think you can overdose, but I'm fairly sure that taking in 2g of test a week is not good for your system. My suggestion, use the lowest dose possible that gives you satisfying results. Play more with different stacks rather than milligrams. You can have excellent results, save few bucks and feel great during and after cycle
RustyhookerWhats your stats, goals and priors? Full cycle layout?
im on TRT; blast and cruise. Countless cycles under my belt, TBH. But i am @ 230 lbs right now, on TRT. unsure of exact bf% currently, I just know I can see abs and obliques pretty well...especially in morning. Been training since 17, and my strength is pretty good. Not that this means much, but I can press my bodyweight close to 30 reps.
As for the layout of the cycle....
Prop - 50 mg ED
Enanth - 500 EW (split in 2 shots)
Var - 50 ED
Arimidex (Ph grade) - .25 EOD
HcG - 250 iu E5D
....all ran for 6 weeks, followed by an additional 3 weeks of just 750 Test E and the Arimidex @ .25 EOD
.....then, I was planning to cruise again @150 TRT + 500 iu HcG + an AI of some sort, for a few mos. I really TRY to stay away from and DHT drugs (mast, wini, etc) for hair sake, as well as anything that converts to Prolactin (tren, deca, etc.) for penis sake.
As for my goals, I really just want to continue adding lean mass and strength. I would like to avoid the water weight as much as possible.
DIET: 7 meals per day... primarily white rice and fish, egg whites and oatmeal, chicken and sweet potatoes, and shakes post workout. Low fat diet, with high protein and moderate-high carbs..
TRAINING: 5-6 days per week on individual body part splits followed by 20 min cardio... plus, 45 min cardio on my 'off days'...
thank you for the help Rusty!
RustyhookerSTATS......AGE, HEIGHT, WEIGHT, BF. It's really simple. Everytime I see a trt with general nothing its because they're self prescribed and doing something funky.
The cycle you posted....backwards/improper. But there's always options.
Huge difference in stats for a dude 6-1 230 at 25% bf and a guy 5-6 230 at 8% bf.
oh sry Rusty. 29 y.o. , 5'11'', 230 lbs., and i believe i am somewhere around 10-11%. TRT is dr. prescribed, @200 EW. But I can cruise on more like 150 and still feel decent enough.
Rustyhookerdeleted. Op watch spoonfeeding and diaper change
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bigmurphSo you are trt blast and cruise you have good Strength and your diet is on point. The only thing I see that troubles me about you running a gram is your age 29 brother blast and cruise trt already. Are you competing or do this to make money in some way.
This is just my opinion at your age you're done having kids and you do know that problems will come from running gear like this so I just want to say i hope there is a reason behind it. If not you can accomplish alot with alot less now if you're competing or making money somehow off of your physique it makes sense but if you are just doing it to be big. I don't feel that its worth it. Like I said just my opinion brother.
Good luck and good gains brother
bigmurphI don't know much about it but im going to take a shot and say if you're going to run close to a gram you're going to need letrozole to control the estrogen. Of course I don't know how prone to gyno you are i just see that as alot of test and with that comes alot of estro. I just can't see adex controlling it. But I could be wrong as I have never ran anything over 750mgs and that was sust.
Im also a very firm believer in lower doses are better than going high. I see close to a gram of test being for someone who has been running on for years and has never come off and has worked his way up.
I wish the best to you i myself am very interested in this post.
Good luck and good gains brother
yeah man, I am interested to hear some insider opinions on this