gyno on trt from phytoestrogens
ok guys, i am in a bit of a quandary. I began trt last april. i have ran one cycle during the time of 500 mg test only. I used an ai but still developed gyno. I tried letrozole and had no success in killing the gyno, so i have continued my trt dosage using exemestane. I decided to try it one more time after reading about phytoestrogens as i am an unfrequent drinker and an avid pot smoker. I don't get drunk alot, but i often maybe 3 times every 2 weeks, have 3-4 beers, as i brew my own am extremely involved in the craft beer scene in my area. After going and having a few drinks the other day(while on 2.5 mg of letrozole)to try to get rid of the gyno, when i woke up i realized that the gyno had gotten a bit worse, maybe not noticeably to others, but noticeable to me. But im protected i thought, well i am not. I did some research about phytoestrogens and found out their are certain foods etc. that contain these things and mimic estrogen in your body, and since its not actually estrogen letrozole, ai's, and even serms such as nolvadex will do absolutely nothing to prevent the onset or to stop the gradual increase of gyno due to phytoestrogens. which is where i am a bit stuck. Brewing beer is a hobby that i love to do, and staying in shape is something that keeps me focused, happy, and allow me to have a greater sense of well-being, however due to this problem with phytoestrogens, it seems the only option for me is surgery, or stopping the trt altogether(but even this may not help as gyno has already developed and simply stopping the testosterone may not help when i go out and have few beers. I dont know what to do, ive researched a ton and have found nothing that you can take to block the effects of phytoestrogens, and since all beers that i drink contain hops, therefore the only solution seems to be to quit drinking beer. im not an alcoholic and as i mentioned before, i dont drink alot. I have found that switiching to drinking liquor might help because liquor contains no hops(and therefore no phytoestrogens) but its not the effect of the alchohol i enjoy, its the taste, and the whole process of brewing that i enjoy. Its my hobby, I LOVE IT! i was wondering if anyone has gone through something like this or has any suggestions. Unfortunately, this seems like a way complicated matter and when i talked to me endocrinologist, she seemed completely oblivious to what i was talking about, so if anyone has any advice, ideas, or any kinda support, id greatly appreciate it. Thanks alot everyone.
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Maybe you're ai was bunk
How long did you run the letro protocol for? Sometimes it takes thirty days to take effect depending on BF and how bad the gyno is.
Letro can take up to 60 days in some cases to reach stable plasma levels, there was a study on it but you'll have to look it up for yourself. In any case, that doesn't mean that it has not worked since the day you took your first dose, bro. In my experiance, I don't think bf plays a major role in deciding how effective an already powerful compound like letro takes effect. I'm not saying your wrong bro, its just my 2 cents.
the first time i ran it, i ran for over a month. When i started it this time 1 week ago, i got my bf down to roughly 8-9% before i started the letro protocol thinking, as you mentioned, a lower bf% might help this along. I mean, im trying again now, but my main concerns are that i wont be able to drink any beer ever again without it making the gyno i have worse even when using an ai or serm
Yeah bro thats a new on me. Guess you better start learning to brew tequila!
On another note did you recently do a deca cycle or another 19 nor in the past year? Or have you already checked your prolactin levels?
haha, if i started drinking and brewing liquor id be in jail real quick. i cant handle the hard stuff. to answer your question, no. i have only done testosterone, have done tne, and prop, but only testosterone
I don't mean to ask a stupid question here but have you had labs run? Do you actually know what your levels are and did you do them before and after the letro? This can tell you a lot. I know I had to do the letro for about 6 weeks before it was completely gone.
nah bro, i appreciate you trying to assist me, i understand, every little detail can make a difference in something like this. i did have labs run during to make sure the letro was working, twice, but i havent had any run since. so letro completely got rid of your gyno?
Yes and no. It can't be gotten completely rid of without surgery. But a painful quarter sized lump can be reduced to a completely unnoticeable knot the size of a pea and painless. It is the only thing I know that can do that. You have to really smash your nipple and search for it and then when you think you have found it you question yourself as to whether or not you actually have one or not.
Bro this gives me some faith once you have shrunk the gyno like you said you have once your off cycle will it stay small and no gyno flares or do you allways after watch ? Also are you on trt and do you get gyno flares on cycle and have some gyno protocal or off cycle AI treatment.cheers
I had some latent prolactin gyno from a heavy deca cycle that I had taken 8 months prior. I discontinued caber early and thought that my pct would be enough. That being said I did get it after a cycle and yes I had a flare up on cycle of just test only. I must be getting older. But I am not on trt. To answer your question the flare is gone and I am not on any AI or letro. I am about 12 weeks out from a test cycle with no problems. While letro prevents conversion of estro it is also very effective in reduction of tissue at the pec/breast. This is why it is used as a more aggressive treatment protocol for breast cancer patients.
Cheers bro this should help. it would seem bloodwork is a must even off cycle to know what your combating.i have been reading about aromasin better than letro for men after i seen a post on here about it.whats your ideas on this ? Also mast as part of a cycle to play it safe if your gyno prone.i would like to look more into the post the guy made the other day about letro not acting the same in men as it will in woman leading it to be less effective in men found no hard science to show aromasin is better than letro yet still looking.
If you find the post please point me to it. That sounds like a good read. I have never tried to use aro to combat gyno so I can't speak on that but it sounds interesting. Letro is very hard on the system.
my endo says my right nipple has one and she wants me to get an ultrasound to find out for sure, however my nipples protrude on both sides when i wear a wifebeater, like little cones, its fucking nasty and i hate it.
Wow bro that sucks. I would go full letro for about 60 days or until your joints can't handle it anymore. Ramp up to 2.5 a day and when it's gone go for two weeks more and then taper down to .5 eod and them finish.
thanks for the help bro. thats exactly what i am doing, but my main concern is these phytoestrogens and what to do about them as a more permanent solution. Either the letro protocol will work, or it wont, but if these phytoestrogens are around, even when its gone, its going to come back, so im just wondering if anybody on here has more knowledge about them and if there is anyway to keep them from mimicking estrogen in your body or not. it seems like these are poorly understood by even professionals.