+ 28 Mass Spec Explained~Sleight of hand exposed
It is time for a little education on mass spectrometry testing, I hope you all find it useful and for those that don’t perhaps you’ll find it interesting. I will keep it as simple as possible without getting too technical.
There are several different types of testing in the mass spectrometry world and we are gonna focus on two for right now. They are the most common results that we see here on this site. They are the HPLC Column test and the Spectrum test. While each one has its purpose and is useful in its own way, without being applied correctly they can be very misleading. At the heart of these tests is the molecular weight of the compound being tested. The spectrum test identifies all the ions within a sample based on their molecular weight within a predefined range. 0-800m/z is the range that all anabolic steroids fall between with the oil, BA, and BB being outside that scope. The molecular weight of the target compound is compared to a known sample to verify the compound is present. Once that is verified we take the quotient of the target compound (X) and the total of unknown ions that make up all the other molecular weights (Y) to arrive at a purity (X/Y). The density of the target compound relative to the suspension is again compared to a known sample to verify if the correct dosage has been made. While that measurement is accurate, it cannot be exact. That is more of a function of the HPLC column test.
The HPLC column test differs from the spectrum test in that it separates all the ions that pass through it and separates them into different groups where it then tests the purity of that individual group. This process is extremely useful for identifying an unknown substance in a compound, as well as it is very precise for showing a dosage. It does not calculate the amount of target compound compared to the other substances in the sample, therefore, the purity calculation that it performs is only on the target compound. (When I say target compound I am referring to the one that we are most interested in such as test or tren.) This purity percentage is very misleading since people think that it is an overall purity, which is not true. To oversimplify it:
Full Spectrum Testing: 10 people in a room, 2 blondes, 8 brunettes = 80% brunettes
HPLC Column testing: 10 People in a room, 2 blondes, 8 brunettes. 2 blondes are put in a different room and now = 100% brunettes.
Now that all that has been defined I get a lot of PM’s from people and sources that are excited because they just got an amazing find from a standup guy in China that wants to send them 99.9% pure raw material and has tests to prove it. When that raw material is put through the spectrum test they are always disappointed in the results, and rightfully so because they were sold on the idea that they had ultra-pure raw material. The problem is that our friends in China are running the HPLC column test, which we know isolates the target compound and then tests it for purity, and are selling it as a full spectrum test. You can spot a column test easily enough because the purity is always 98-99.9% pure. That isn’t to say that 97% isn’t possible with a spectrum test because we have seen that once or twice, but it is very rare.
So the moral of the story is that if you are in the market for raw material and you are being sold a Ferrari at Hyundai price, you might scrutinize the proof a little. Then take your newly gained knowledge and wield it so that you don’t become a victim.
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angusYou told me that you prefer Chloroform and zip ties.....wtf?
Waiting on you to ship it to me asshole! Right now I'm just working with what I got!
angusI'll send you some zip ties, I have the really thick ones and they work really good.....just ask Andi, but I'm not sharing my chloroform!
One doesn't need chloroform. Just take an ether based starting fluid and spay it into a tag that is semi-saturated with mek, (the base for PVC cement.) that works for me in a bind.
Ill put some padding on them. I don't want them to wake with bruised wrist and sore asses. That would look bad on me.
angusYou get used to it after a while, lmao.
RustyhookerSo if a source posted last week that their gear is 99+% purity....then thats bogus?
ZewiAnabolXDon't you worry Fast--Mass Spec is getting done so don't you worry.
RustyhookerFast48 never worries. All testing by anyone is appreciated.
angusThat's a double edge sword....chances are that the test is real, it is just being used out of context. I doubt the source knew that when they posted it.
RustyhookerEasy enough to do. This stuff gets complicated quickly. Irali FDA testing too. Lol!
ZewiAnabolXGood stuff..
Great info! You out some wrinkles in my brain! Learn something everyday! +2!
...and take into consideration you are dealing with China ;)
AnonWhats wrong with Chinese Ferraris ?? LOL
AnonAngus , does the HPLC test results ever describe the separation percentages ? In other words would it say test started with 1000 lbs of women, after 200lbs removed 800lbs yielded 100 % Blondes, therefore we'd know it was really an 80% blonde group.
if it showed say 50% of foriegn substance removed to yield the 99.% then we'd know the product was really only 49% pure right ?
angusI think that is just another way of describing the same situation. The column test was designed to segregate ions and look at the properties of them but not compare to the other separated ions.
Excellent explanation. Great analogy. That deserves a +1000
ANGUS u da man but jeez i got a headache right now ....... 8 brunettes is playing on my mind lol
angusThank you! It sounds like the start of a bad joke.....
8 brunettes walk into a room with Vike.........ED watches on while licking his lips.......
8 Brunettes and 2 blondes climb in the back of Ed's van..... None come out.
I thought there wAs at least one red head in there?
That was the blood in her hair when you got done...
I have seen the pictures of all of your women acolytes at your house! Your headache is because 8 brunettes was the low number that you started with years ago and you can't imagine going with such a ridiculous low number again :P!
Hahahaha... youve seen too much in my house already....... next time i must get you drunker then you forget everything lmaoooo
AnonWow Thats a fantastic explanation ans write up. Also a topic that I think I can safely say most of us know so little about. So thank you for this valuable info !!!! ++
Give them a vote if you find it helpful.PermalinkNice explanation Angus +1
LaTTTimer99Eroids PhD - wow.
Excellent learning! Thanks!
Anonsticky please.
X2
X3
Great post and great information. Thanks!
That was great angus! Way to dummy it down for us chemical illiterates! I tell you if Eroids primary mission statement is a review site than people like you and beaker are the ones that make factual accurate reviews possible. This is no small contribution on your part thank you for taking the time and using your skills to enrich this community with much needed knowledge!
angusThank you, my goal is to merely keep people informed and safe. I'm glad that it helped you, and am hopeful that it helps many more along the way.
Thanks for dumbing that down so I could understand it. Lol. So are you saying that the HPLC is basically worthless for our purposes or does it have value? +2
angusIt does have a value in that it is very accurate for finding dosage. This will be very important for peptides and things where every little bit counts. If you pay for 5000mcg then that is the only way that you'll know whereas the spectrum is not as precise. I feel the spectrum is more useful for orals and suspensions because we want to know everything that we are putting in our bodies.
Gotcha! Thanks again. This post should be a sticky for sure.