posted Wed, 08/21/2013 - 12:23
5266
Gyno - Should i still run HCG?
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Okay so I've just finished my 16 week sust deca cycle, I'll be starting pct 25 days after last shot...(which was today)
I bought some hcg to blast after cycle, although i recently had gyno creep up due to increasing sust dose, I have bloods coming next week... But should I still run this HCG or will it worsen the gyno? So far no puffiness, it itchyness just a small hard lump under each nipple.
Thanks
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dont run nolva it can make gyno related to deca flare. If you can try and get raloxifene instead imo.
also ....hcg....def can cause gyno,However at low dose of 250-500iu's I wouldnt be too worried.
O yeh and Im not going to look up a scientific study to prove that hcg can convert rapidly into estro- either believe me or dont.
I do know that HCG is not absolutely neccessary. At some point gyno is not reversable so why would you take the risk being that you already have it ?
Thanks for the advice.. Just posted my blood work: http://www.eroids.com/pics/pre-pct-bloods-comments-please
Okay got a slight problem this is my first time using HCG. Im taking the advice and blasting.
I have Oregeon Pregnyl 5000UI kit.
comes with 1ml water solution, and the powder.. I mixed them both gently.. Since i want to reuse i had to put the solution in a 3ml barrel... I didnt think to use my own bacto water as i dont think the water you get with the kit is safe for keeping? Now i have about 1.5ml solution in the barrel, and i injected around .3ml IM glute.
I put the needle in the fridge, will this solution keep for 1 week? I have no idea what water comes with the kit but it says Sodium Chlordie 0.9% so will this keep for 1 week?
Whats the easyiest way to adminster HCG? I guess i should have taken 1ml from my own 10ml backto water, add that to the powder, then draw this into a syringe and add back to the 9ml bacto water? Because now its hard to get the dosage correct.. as im playing with about 1.3ml
AnonBoy I think you are getting further and further off track, if this does not go right for you dont blame me !
First I dont undestand how you have 1.5 ml in the barrel if you mixed with 1ml of water , the lypholized powder does not take up .5 ml of volume .
If you mixed 5000ius with 1ml of water and injected .3 ml you just took a 1500 iu dose !!! No good !!!
You need 250 - 500 ius every 4 days .
Second no one told you to "blast " all you were supposed to do was extend your cycle a bit with your sustanon while your deca cleared out and your HCG helps prepare you for PCT.
Im sorry but if I missed someone instructing you to do this , but I dont think they did. And you certainly arent taking my advice . I dont think my help is "helping" so good luck with this.
Here: https://www.eroids.com/forum/steroids-qa/pct-anti-estrogens/pct-after-co...
All the dosages i looked up was around 1-2k UI E3D.
Yea sorry the barrel was a little over 1ml, and i divided it up so roughly .2ml equaled 1000UI HCG and thats what i took..
How long will the rest keep for? Bro im taking your advice, its hard though as soo many conflicting comments, and no one is giving me exact dosages
Anon500 ius at the most every 4 days
Thanks! Ill do that. I should probarly add the remaining solution to 9ml of bacto water? to its easyier to dose? I estimate ive used 1000UI already. so i could mix the other 4000UI with 9ml of water which would leave 1000UI divided by 4000UI, then i can use the correct pins to draw.
Anonoh fuck I just noticed you say things like "mate", and "post" and your weight is in Kilos, are you outside the US ? If so sorry now I understand why you dont have blood work already.
Yeah from the uk, hah no worries 'man', I have the blood sample kit, i spoke with the lab, they said take it monday morning then send it back, as if i send it tomorrow they said it might not get done till monday/tuesday in which the time can have an effect on the results..
So im 90% sure ill have the results back by this time next week.. There was a mixup with the payment etc which is why its taken so long.
BoxjumpYa were is his bloods?
I don't think HCG is a good idea, your existing condition could get worse. It's a very common side of HCG and honestly having felt with a gyno issue before, that would be the last thing I wanted! I'm sure your in the same boat lol post your bloods if you don't mind when you get them, I'm sure all of us would love to take a look!
AnonI respectfully disagree , Gyno is not a side effect of HCG let alone common. I f you show me something that has info Id love it .
Gyno is a result of estro or prolactin . HCG wouldnt cause a prolactin issue and its very arguable that it will or will not cause an estro surge , especially at a resonable dose . In this particular case we dont even know what the cause of his gyno is, but given he ran and AI, and no caber, Id lean towards the prolactin as his cause.
He is most likely going to have a very rough pct because of his cycle and I dont think all you guys frightening him with ip so facto logic regarding HCG are helping
Im so stuck right now... Just ordered some pharma grade letro, and some Caber. Should i run them both now and stop the Adex? Should i start the HCG now also? Will letro make me lose alot of str or gains?
Thanks
AnonI say you try to remain in a holding pattern till you get that blood work back. If anything stick with the AI you are running but start on the caber, a little caber isnt going to hurt anything no matter what . Im doubtful its estro related though, my money is a prolactin issue in which case that caber will be a godsend. You gotta get them results back !!
The blood are being sent back tomorrow, so should get results in around 2-3 days.
My gyno seem to have carmed down, lump in left nipple seems to have gotten much smaller and not so hard.
My last deca injection was about 3 weeks ago now, and last sust shot was 100mg last week.. I have PCT scheduled for 13/9/13 should i start my HCG now? i was planning to blast 5000UI throughout 2 weeks.. then start my PCT? cant get hold of toremifene should i go with nolva or use clomid only?
a few cycles back, i waited a bit to long to get bloods done, i was running deca, with prami, running 1.5mg a day of the prami, my prolactin was .4 and normal range depending on where you go for a males is typically between 4 and 18ng/ml ive seen some say as low as 2ng/ml is within normal, mine was .4ng/ml which is about 10 times lower than normal. honestly i hadnt even noticed, i was making amazing gains. i just backed down to .5mg and it went to 3.8ng/ml in 2 weeks. but honestly i wouldve never guessed it was as low as it was. i had no issues at all. im no prolactin expert or do i claim to no anything more than high prolactin sides, but having it low didnt bother me one bit so i dont even pay attention anymore to prolactin accept to make sure its 4ng or under.
Anonright well thats why Im saying that running that caber wont hurt a thing. If he slams himself with letro and he has no estro issue it could though. Without bloods I think caber is the only safe addition at this point. Let him slam his prolactin in to the dirt it wont hurt a thing, and it just might clear up his gyno.
I agree 100%
The kit is in the post... Should be here any day then ill send it back to the lab.
Im 70% sure its prolactin too, i was messing with my nipple sqeezed it a little and liquid came from them.... i know this happens with everyone if you sqeeze hard enough, but there wasnt much pressure. And prolactin relates to this right?
Do you think i should start my HCG now? I did 1 more shot as recommended of sust at 100mg, so far i stopped deca 2 weeks ago then ran a 500mg then 100mg of sust the last 2 weeks, which should be ideal? Im scared to start HCG incase it worsens.
thanks bro
AnonI really dont think the HCG will worsen it, and as far as I know HCG does not cause gyno. Estro does and its arguable as to whether or not the hcg will even raise your estro, or arguable as to whether or not you even have an estro issue. Still though stop bouncing around, you need to get your info before you keep adding or changing things.
Fuck this mail order blood test, go buy a blood test at Privatemdlabs or directlabs now !!! You'll probably be able to get blood drawn tomorrow or Friday and have your answer by Wednesday ! You dont even need to fast for estro and prolactin.
Yeah i dont think im gona run it just in case, Ill defently put my bloods up.. there already paid for just waiting to take blood.
I dunno if im being paranoid or what.. but i feel the right nipple as gotten worse.
Another think id love to know is, will these lumps disapear? or will they stay there now? And in the future if i run a good AI will that prevent gyno from cropping up? I was careless this time i started adex then stopped towards the end and thats when it came up, but now im thinking am i going to be prone to it cause the lumps are already there?
if you run the right gyno protocol, since theyre fairly new, they may go away. i had a small one about the size of a pea maybe small gumball from a long time ago, that went away from running masteron prop for 6 weeks. but you need to get a good protocol to get rid of them. aromasin and arimedix work well together to treat gyno. but to get rid of lumps you may need to lower your estrogen pretty low, which may be uncomfortable. if i get puffy or a small lump i need to kill my estrogen for a bit to get rid of it. its all trial and error till you get your body figured out
The most common side effect of hcg is gyno and it can make current issues worse. I would avoid it to be safe. Run toremifene instead. It will increase LH and FSH better than the hcg and its effective at combating gyno the primary prescribed use of toremifene is to block estrogen in tissue for breast cancer patients and to maintain hormone levels
AnonWhere did you get that info ? I have heard zero regarding HCG causing gyno .
When you speak about HCG, are you speaking from your own actual usage , w blood tests ?
The ONLY arguable side effect I have heard is it can cause a rise in estro . Now if you agree with that theory then are you using that to suggest this feller already has an estro issue and will exacerbate it with hcg, I can understand your concern, but to simply say HCG causes gyno seems just wrong. But Id love to learn more on it so show me what youve got.
My personal experince is even at 500ius every 4th day for 2 months there was no increase in estro. Recently I had an estro issue but that was due to bunky AI, not hcg (which I didnt use past month). My suspicion with this guy is he didnt get blood work during cycle and his AI was bunk, he didnt control prolactin and now his estro,progestin,prolactin is so whacked out hes getting gyno . I still say he needs to continue with a good AI, extend his sust shots a bit and start in now w hcg in prep for the rough pct he is about to have.
through aromatase activity, as the lh and fsh raise and the surge in testosterone within the testes rises, often fast it can lead to fast aromatization of the test to E2. the HCG does not directly cause it but through the process of rapid test production it can happen. is it likely. that i do not know. i also believe its related to the amount of hcg you are running. i have tons of info saved on my laptop because ive been trying to round up as much info as possible on HCG and write a good informative article in support and against for its use depending on the need for use. ive been crazy busy so i havent gotten to get it all together. im sorry
Anonno no hurry, and I thank you for your reply so far, I am always interested in new info .
Its just that in this particular case Im not sure that threat of gyno hes experiencing will be worsened by the HCG. I do think he could have an estro issue sure, but even by your description of how estro results from HCG I dont t5hink that it poses an imediate threat vs how hard this guys pct might be based on the way he ran his cycle.
Give them a vote if you find it helpful.Permalinki have a heightened sense of caution when it comes to things that have any potential to flare gyno or raise E2, because im a super fast and high converter. i sometimes allow this personal fear to come across my posts and need to be cautious in doing so. i would agree with your assessment but i also would still recommend him running toremifene over hcg, because it raises lh and fsh and is an effective AI in pct, plus it does treat gyno
AnonI always look forward to your replies, they are a pleasure to read.
I have no experience with toremifene so I certainly deffer to your expertise. And yes my advice on HCg comes from my experience too, so I guess its only natural that our posts would each reflect that in the advice we give.
Now how will that toremifene work if his gyno is prolactin related ? Will it be effective ?
lol no it wouldnt be effective, although even with low levels of prolactin it can be aggravated by elevated E2. the only thing that that will work for prolactin is prami or caber. but he does need to get both under control. i have had prolactin levels of less than 3 and E2 over 800 and had leaky nipples. but this has only happened when im on a nor19 has never happened regardless of either level if i wasnt on a nor19
AnonWell Im hoping he takes my advice of extending the sust run a little to let the deca clear, and keeps hitting the adex at 1 mg. I think that should control any estro issues even if he dicided to use HCG . Just trying to make his recovery smooth. Seemed like things kind of spiraled a bit on him , and the best course might be slow and steady.
wait wait wait, hes ending the sustanon and deca at the same time? ugh bad idea. get on him. thats a recipe for hellish recovery and rebound issues
AnonYep
Don't worry, my last shot was last Friday, I did 500mg, it's trisust by pro chem which only needs injecting around once a week, although on cycle I was pinning twice a week... I stopped deca last Friday, didn't shoot any with the sust, so I'll run one more week low dose. Whilst staying on adex
Thank you, ill post bloods when i get them should be next week..
Ill grab some toermifene and letro just in case.
AnonUnfortunately I think you might fuck your self worse going that route. That letro might cause a wicked rebound if you do this wrong.
Ok well, I'm still taking 1ml adex a day, been doing this for around a week since I first noticed gyno sides, I know they say anything more then .5mg is a waste but I'm going with it.
What else can I do now to help Gyno, I feel it hasn't gotten any better since I started the ai and nova, I stopped the nolvadex due to the fact I've been on deca, I'll have 1 more sust shot, it's tri-sust by pro chem so has longer esters, I'll be running this very low tho like 100-200mg, as I want to avoid more estro. The bloods will be here by wendesday and I'll post them up.
I maybe starting a hgh cycle this week too, I've been thinking about it a lot, I can get legit hyge at a good price so I may run a 8 month cycle, should I run an AI throughout hgh at low dose? Like .5 adex E3D, alternatively I'll buy bulk hgh from cheaper pharma. Kigtropin.
Anonok I dont know who told you over .5 mg is a waste, but I dont believe that to be true . Now the question is what cauised your gyno ? Too much estrogen ? Or too much Prolactin ? Both will do it .
No you dont need AI while on HGH . But lets handle one thing at a time, you are making decisions too quickly.
Now when you got blood taken do you know if they were measuring prolactin ?
Great thanks for the help bro,
Okay so i should carry on with the adex 1mg ED? Yes i specifically asked for prolactin, I use a mail order service as my GP wont keep testing bloods, and its convient for me, The kit is ordered, which i have to send bank to the lab, i forgot about bank holiday so thursday/friday i guess.
Should i grab some caber/prami now in case?
AnonYes for now I would do another week or even two of the sustanon, and your smart to keep the dose low, thats fine. 1 mg of adex a day but pay attention and judge your body in 1 week, you can over do it the other way too. Now because there is the potential to rebound on adex make sure you have enough to carry you through pct on a light dose.
The HCg is up to you, Id still do it if I were you, because at 1mg a day adex its going to control any possible estro issues, and if the gyno is prolactin related then the hcg shouldnt matter . Some peptides do cause increase in prolactin but I dont think HCG does. Wouldnt hurt to double check that though.
Caber or prami , yeah itsa always good to have if you can get your hands on it.
As far as your blood test goes, Im confused, this is an at home test ? Who draws the blood ?
Great! I have 5000UI hcg on hand (oregon) was planning to blast before PCT.
I have 2 boxes of adex, ill get another, Hopefully it is prolactic related then, as i want to run HCG.
Yeah the tests are popular throughout the bb community from Dr Limited, They mail you blood sampling kit, you take blood from fingers, and then send to lab.
Ill keep you updated on the bloods. On another note regarding the HGH, do you think it would be okay to run it now? or should i clear up gyno first?
also without bloods, how do we even know? we dont
no do not run hcg at all. it will very quickly convert to estrogen, which may compound your problem. If the problem is progesterone from the deca, a cabergoline/prami dosing is needed. You may need both.
AnonHave you verified that with blood work ? I have spoken to people who have verified the contrary.
AnonThe gyno probably crept in because you had weak AI or didnt dose it right, or didnt monitor your self through blood tests. And I thought I told you in the other thread to take at least one more sustanon shot so as to carry your test run out a little further while your deca drops out.
More sust, get going on HCG and keep hitting the AI or even increase the dose. Was it adex or asin ? If it was adex dont even stop that, because you'll fucking rebound and those tits will be c cups by the time your done.