First cycle
So I am about to start my first cycle and I wanted to post it on here and get some opinions and a few questions answered. I am 26 years old, 5'11" 185 lbs at around 13% body fat and I have been lifting seriously for 3 and a half years.
I will be running test e 300mg once a week for 10 weeks, and dbol 25mg ED for 6 weeks. I am using 25mg tabs of dbol and I know the half life is about 4-5 hours, so my first question is, can I use a pill cutter to cut it into 4 sections so I can take it throughout the day? And I take it ED with no days off for 6 weeks, correct? Also, would you recormmend I increase my dosage of dbol?
I am prone to gyno so I have nolvadex on hand. How should I take this and at what dosage for a minor precautionary step?
I also have Clomid as a PCT and I have read to take it 2 weeks after the last injection of test e, but for how long should I take it and at what dosages? I know you start at about 40mg the first week but what about after that and how long?
My last concern is about drinking. I know it is unsafe to drink while on orals because it could cause major liver damage. But I will be leaving for vacation about a week after my last injection (if shipping goes accordingly). Would it be unsafe to drink that week because I'm going with a group of my buddies and our girlfriends and they'll almost all be drinking all week. I am considering not drinking because I know alcohol lowers testosterone levels and I don't want to lose any gains, and I'm also concerned with the harmful effects, but what are your opinions on that situation?
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Vacation + PCT = Not a good time. You better bring some ED meds with you.
If you want to keep a large chunk of the gains you made on cycle you need to keep hitting the weights and keep your diet dialed in all the way through PCT. All that hard work while on cycle can be lost in a heartbeat if you don't follow through. Shelf any cycle plans until you can commit 100%.
drolskiesorry bro,but theres a few things in your post ringing alarm bells, i know its your first cycle so questions need to be asked, first off and most importantly is your post cycle therapy, its off, you need to research,tamoxifen and clomid are the bare minimums required for maximum recovery,if your going to make the life time decision and take the dive in the deep end,and inject synthetic hormones into your body, you should at least know the basics, pct is a basic, you should know the doses and length of this protocol, its very important, as stated below, one compound at a time, its quite obvious the reason for this, as for the drinking, its also obvious, have you ever seen someone advise a cycle of test, nolva, clomid and jack daniels? no, because it has no place in this game, id advised against it, especially considering you will be getting ready to hit pct, a time you need to be training harder and eating better, yes it will hinder your gains, mentality and demeina, your first cycle can have hiccups, most do, you want to prepare yourself for this, not worrying about a week long party of booze, dedicate yourself for success through research, be precise then check again, i mean its like a couple of months away, are you in a huge rush? you could wait, research, and set your self up for an awesome cycle that you will be happy with, im talking dialed in diet, proper cycle with correct doses, a great proven pct, ai and training protocol, im not having a go bro, just pointing it out, how would you feel if you go ahead and inject yourself for 12 weeks and at the end look at yourself and say damn! what a waste? all that for this?? good luck bro, i genuinely mean that, im happy to assist you with any question you have but general knowledge and basic research is required if that makes sense, thanks.
x2. I agree with drolskie. Go enjoy your vacation, and in the meantime, study up, learn more, hone in your diet and training, and have everything prepared 110%. After you come back, and you're fully prepared to dive in, we will be here to assist you.
This is not one of those things you do for the hell of it. You do it because you want to be better than you naturally can be, and it's a lifestyle commitment (even if you only do a few cycles) so you don't half ass a single thing.
If you're gonna go ahead with it, good luck. But I think you're just not quite ready yet, and you should postpone it till after your vacation at the very least.
Read my reply to drolskie please.
I've been counting macros and finding diets for my bulking during this time and I have already been bulking at 10% for a few weeks. I have decided to change to 500mg test e (mon/thurs) for 12 weeks. But I read that Clomid works sufficiently by itself but I also have novaldex to go with it and I've seen many people say that these are a good combination for a pct so I don't see what's wrong with them? As for an ai, the place I ordered from did not offer arimidex which is what everyone suggest and I thought I could use novaldex as a substitute if needed. I don't know where to find arimidex but I would use the as an ai instead of I could. And I have decided to not drink at all. So what else do you think is wrong with my plan? I am asking for help but I don't see exactly what you mean that I won't be getting the results I wanted? Where am I going wrong?
drolskiehey bro!hope all is well!, nolvadex is best at stimulating lh, look it up, nolvadex on a test only cycle will prevent gyno, yes, but it will not stop estrogen rising, it will block estrogen receptors in the pectorial region in men, so yes if gyno was the only concern, cool, but what about aromatisation? you need an aromatise inhibitor, high estro is no good, can and will make you feel like shit plus hinder your gains aswell, whats wrong with the plan?? dosage, ancillaries and pct, needs adjusting my friend, your on eroids, everything is at your finger tips, theres not alot you cant get, cheap too, could you please lay out your new proposed cycle, ai and pct, ill see what i can rustle up for you in the way of hints bro! thanks
If you look at the section here listed under accessories sources, you will find a few shops that have adex and it is of quality. Nolva I never recommend for anyone on cycle as drol said it's not gonna help manage yor estros. Save it for PCT.
So aside from that, what's wrong with everything else Im doing? I came for some advice, and this is where im looking to do some research.
Well you seem to have made an improvement in your cycle for sure. This is the way I see your cycle as it stands.
Weeks 1-12: Test E @ 500mg/wk
Weeks 14-16: Clomid @ 100/100/50/50 Nolva @ 40/40/20/20
And keeping adex on hand (i am assuming you will be buying this) for estrogen control. Either .25mg E3D or .5mg E3D, adjusting as needed to control estrogen effects.
Now, do you hve pre cycle bloodwork? You will need to get that done, then more bloodwork intra cycle about 6 weeks in, and then more bloodwork post PCT to see how you've recovered.
I will add this though... You're only 185lbs... You still have a lot of room to gain weight naturally at this point...
I will be adding the arimidex. But why is the pre blood work necessary? And I have been growing for a while.
If you don't understnd why blood work is necessary then I realy don't think you're ready... How are you going to judge how the drugs are affecting you if you have nothing to go against before you ever put anything in your body?
Edit: if you've been growing for a while and have the potential to keep doin so by upping your intake and staying natty, why wouldn't you want to continue doing that?
I meant haven't been growing** but you know, I posted this to have a few questions answered, not to be demeaned on my lack of knowledge. I have never even heard of anyone doing a pre blood test. Whether or not I "know" if the drugs are affecting me will be apparent from the blood test 5 weeks in and from the results or lack of results weeks after that. It seems to me like its a waste of money to do the pre test. I appreciate your help but I want your help with the questions Im asking, not to be told I am ignorant and should not be running a cycle at this time. I will be perfectly prepared if people continue to assist my with my questions instead of telling me I don't know anything. Thank you.
drolskiewhat if when you start, you are shut down? no test,high estro, high cholestorol,high blood pressure?? maybe prolactin?? maybe your liver is struggling or your kidneys are fucked, maybe your prostate is imflamed, enlarged or struggling?? what about your cardiovascular health?? thyroid? pancreas? who knows,its been ten years since you cycled?? thats why pre cycle bloods are reccommended my friend..............
Nobody is be meaning you. All the questions you had could've been found by using the little magnifying glass and reading more thoroughly through the various threads. Especially regarding bloodwork. And since you've never even heard of anyone doing bloods pre cycle shows me you haven't done enough research and haven't read through the threads the beginners should be reading through.
If you haven't been growing then you're not eating enough, and you need to rework your diet. Drugs won't fix that, nor will they dictate your "progress." Diet does.
Getting bloods 5 weeks in will tell you if your shit is real and how it's affecting you, but how then are you supposed to know what state your body is in naturaly? How will you know if you recover fully if you don't have a panel to compare it to? You won't. We answered your questions you asked, and it became evident you didn't do enough research. We're not be meaning you, we're looking out for you. These drugs can fuck your body up irreparably, and if you can't understand that, then you shouldn't be doing them.
Okay I understand. You're right and I value your advice and I am pushing back my cycle. Ive been looking stuff up about hcg but I don't full understand it, nor can I find it on the domestic sources. Can it be used to prevent shutdown? Because the whole shut down process is one of my biggest concerns. Or is hcg just used after the cycle to turn you back on.
+1 for being open minded and taking this seriously, there's been too many people on here who just want us to basically "sign off" on their own decision than actually seeking advice.
HCG Stimulates your own testes to produce testosterone naturally. Basically you shut down your own production when you take exogenous test, but HCG signals your body to keep producing its own test. It doesn't prevent shutdown, but speeds up recovery and makes the process easier. There are domestic sources who do carry the stuff, you'd just have to search through a bunch of them until you find one. HCG Is used during your cycle, up until PCT (I am aware there are differing protocols for some particular situations) and then you slam into your PCT to let your body restart while limitingn the estrogen rebound.
Whether you choose to use it or not is entirely your call, some vets will recommend and some won't. I personally don't think you need HCG on such a basic cycle. One you get your pre bloods done we can see exactly where your body is naturally and we can make a better judgement from there.
I see. So you think thay sticking with novaldex and Clomid is sufficient as my pct? I am going to look into the blood work process and find arimidex to take as ai and get another bottle of Clomid to match the dosages because I have an insufficient amount. Once I do more reaearch and get the additional supplements and get blood work done, I will post a new thread with the information and I will pm you about it. I sent you a friend request. I really appreciate your help and the advice that has made me realize I have much more to learn. I want to go through this cycle in the safest way possible.
I honestly do think it will be enough, under the assumption your bloods will turn up normal.
FR accepted, few free to PM me anytime.
We are all here to learn bro, look up some of the other threads and you'll find online labs that you can get bloodwork done on the cheap (if you're not in a state that's regulated).
I look forward to your new thread when you're ready to start the cycle. Good luck with the research, and you can always ask me for help.
Another quick question. How do you go about drawing blood to send into those private labs? Because I can't do it obviously and I don't trust anyone who isn't certified to do it.
You get them drawn at a lab, and they email you the results.
It basically works like this. You purchase a panel to be done, then you take that and walk into one of their certified labs. They draw the bloods and then do the testing, and you get the results.
AgedJuiceThe mental and physical side effects mixing gear and alcohol are nasty.As far as the liver goes you need to fully detox it before you start drinking.I have gotten Hep-C from that pairing in the past.I was fortunate to not have done serious permenant liver damage.Dont forget the psychological aspects.The aggression that can come from alcohol and steroids is dangerous.Its gottn me locked up before.A normally good drunk may not be so normal drunk on gear.Even being off the gear there are thinks to consider.You go into a chemical depression in during post cycle.Obviously the severity will differ person to person.When your in a chemical depression and you drink that depression can multiply by 10.This can happen to a person who isnt depressed.I am referring to chemical depression it has nothing to do with being unhappy.Dropping the oral is a good ideal.Take liver products either way Testosterone can harm the liver when mixed with alcohol.Let me clear,the combination of alcohol and test becomes much more toxic together.Sacrifice the booz for the body Bro!
Thanks for sharing that experience and advice. I definitely won't be drinking now.
StevebAlcohol negatively affects protein synthesis so it will hinder you.
Alcohol really is a killer when it comes to getting optimal gains and thats all what we are looking for or most of us would still be natural. Gotta really pick your poison if you want to be safe in the long run. I personally have not had a drink in years, it messes up my workouts more than anything and drains my motivation. I agree with humpnpump, stick to a test only cycle for your first run, 500mg (2x250mg pins per week Mon/Thur) will give you pretty damn good gains just remember to eat tons of protein when on cycle, at your weight you should aim to take in roughly 300 grams a day. Stay hydrated and get 7-8hrs sleep minimum. Also aim to get bloodwork done around week 4-5 to see where your test/estro levels are. Good luck
Ya I haven't been drinking recently because of my determination to get bigger. I have read that it doesn't make a difference whether you pin 500mg once a week or 250mg twice a week because of the 2 week half life. What's the difference? Also, how do I ask my doctor for the blood work? do I say I would like blood work done to check my hormone levels? And what will he say when they are so high? Also, what am I looking for when I recidve the blood work results?
Multiple pins will keep your blood levels more stable though you could do just one a week if you had to. When you get your blood work done you want to check your estrogen levels and make sure they are not too high. (if your estrogen levels are elevated you will need to run some type of ai to lower it, start with a low dose and work your way up if needed. Usually .5 mg of arimidex every 3 days is good).Depending on how detailed you get you can check your red blood cell count, test levels, cholesterol. Should not have a problem with your red blood cell count but you can donate blood a few times during cycle just to be safe. Also you should bump the cycle up to 12 weeks, took me around 7-8 weeks to really feel the test kick in on my first cycle which was exactly the same thing though everyone is different. Do lots of research on proper pinning techniques so you reduce the chance of infection.
Yeah I've watched a lot of videos on pinning. Medical and amateur. So you don't think I could use novaldex to prevent the gyno? Because arimidex was not available to me where I made my gear purchases and I have no idea where to get arimidex.
Dude use the eye glass and search what you can to learn. You don't want to be running a cycle and go to your primary for blood work, you do this through private labs online. If your primary finds out your cycling your insurance will drop you like a rock.
Ok thank you.
One compound Test E first cycle 500 mg, 300 mg will shut you down and get your test levels just above normal. One compound test e per cycle to learn how you respond. You may get gyno from test e but if you add in dbol how are you going to know what caused gyno. Dbol aromatizes and will cause estrogen to elevate quickly and then how do you know which caused gyno test e or dbol. Take it slow and start 1 compound at a time and see how it goes. See what I'm saying hoss, no need to rush, first cycle test e you will gain 10 to 20 lbs. Baby steps bro no hurry. Summit a cycle log and we will dial you in and get you pct straight.
Do you think I would get better results if I ran 500mg test e instead per week instead of 300mg + dbol?
Steroids are drugs and your going to have a different reaction to each compound. Figure out how you react, add one c
Steroids are drugs and your going to have a different reaction to each compound. Figure out how you react, add one compound each cycle. Do test cycle first then add an oral like dbol or another injectable to see how that goes. A test e cycle 300 mg + dbol is a wastes trial run. You'll get the same results with 500mg to 600 mg test with hardly no fluxuation in hormones and side effects.
Thanks for the reply. I'll post a log tomorrow.