posted Tue, 04/16/2013 - 11:44
2137
Stages of PCT by week
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I was wondering if there has ever been any research or if anyone has ever done labs week by week during a PCT. I'm curious how test levels drop/climb through the course of PCT and beyond.
I understand that with longer esters you wait two weeks to start PCT, and for prop you wait 3 days. Does that mean the test is out of your system and you no long have elevated levels at this point. Does it mean you basically have minimal levels and are starting from the ground up to rebuild the balance. What kind of levels are expected at this point? Then a week later? Then a week after that? And the week after that?
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This is why I don't believe in prop taper into PCT. it makes the drop off even more noticeable.
Why can't people just patiently wait 2-3 weeks for long esters to clear?? It's so much smoother that way. Why add prop? It makes you feel more on cycle than long esters do and going into pct you don't wanna go from 100 to zero.
You make a good point, but I thought adding a prop taper would prevent you from going 100 to zero. Some say to prop taper so the transition into PCT is smoother, just like you are saying about waiting 2-3 weeks for the long ester to clear. I know everyone is different, but now I'm curious how hard of a "drop" difference there is between the long ester vs a prop taper.
No, people that say that are actually just impatient.
I actually think ive transitioned smooth up to this point. I have zero regrets about using the prop. im not complaining about my.pct (yet) im just curious when ithers have felt from start to finish. week.1 being the lowest, week 2 through 4 gets better
Unfortunately, I haven't had the opportunity to try a cycle without a taper but I will say that I definitely noticed the prop kick and it kept kicking to until the last minute and I did crash, super hard. I just don't have anything to gauge it by as it was my first cycle.
I've ran prop kicker, taper everything. I am just really not a fan of prop overall while using a long ester cycle.
Simply because when I am on prop I feel "ON" like sex drive, energy, acne, everything its increased. Pinning daily is part of it too. Pinning prop EOD sucks and just causes acne it must be injected daily. Daily pinning is not for beginners that's why I never advise it being used in early cycles. Use dbol instead, it's very effective and no side effects if you keep it at 30mg.
Prop just over complicates a cycle. When you are on a slow ester cycle like cyp or enanthate, I feel enanthate immediately. By second pin I'm busting a nut 4x a day. People think "it takes 4 weeks to kick in" BULLSHIT the second it is injected you have HIGH TEST in your system. So many people misunderstand the way esters work.
Anyways prop kickers just result in a noticeable dropoff once you get to week 4. Then the rest of your cycle feels like you have lower test even though technically the long esters are building up. This is because the way test prop is absorbed by your body you get more fluctuations and notice sides more. It hits your body more all of the sudden.
I really HATE prop taper. It feels like you are going from 100% to zero. Even with a lower prop dose than you were using with enanthate you feel you have higher test.
You do not want high test going into PCT. You want low levels. Low test levels = NO ESTROGEN REBOUND. If you test is super high then all the sudden you stop taking test prop your estrogen is going to tank way quicker than your testosterone levels will drop (while taking AI).
If you just patiently transition from last long ester pin and let it slowly trickle down leading to pct you will gradually get "back to reality" in terms of test levels. This also means you will not have any estrogen issues because if your test is not high your estrogen won't be either. You don't want to be taking much AI during PCT as this will just make pct more miserable.
Bottom line test prop complicates things.
I LOVE test prop when it's the only ester being used. But I hate having to stop taking prop during a long ester cycle. Hope what I said made sense.
Thanks for taking the time to write that. I'm here to learn and also experiment. I did run a prop taper on my first cycle, on my next I'll skip the taper so I can get a feel for the difference.. I'm kicking my next cycle with Dbol and front loading my test instead of a prop kicker.
Yeah you will love dbol my friend!! Run it lower dose like 30-40mg first 4-6 weeks. No need to use 50mg, it's a great kicker you may really like dbol.
Good wisdom brother. I think this would be a great topic in one of the forums. Because theres a beginners cycle that advocates prop taper. This is good info for beginners to really think about. +1
I'm a beginner and I loved my prop taper. I guess everyone reacts differently but I for one will do the taper on my next cycle also.
Thanks for the post. Always good topics and good info on eroids. Didnt want to hijack your post, but a beginner too with questions.
did you run aromasin. what was your PCT?
Clomid 100 100 50 50
Nolva. 20. 20. 10 10
Aro. 6,25 EOD all 4 weeks
Just goes to show everyone reacts differently. the only thing im doing different is my aromasin is 12.5 ED I was having some rebound issues I think switching from adex to aro.
This morning was the first time I woke up with wood in days!
all I know is im itching to get back to the gym.
I ran a prop taper and got bloods two weeks into PCT, if you want to see, check my pics.
So your test was pretty low after 2 weeks. Is that the lowest point in PCT or did it already crash and is on it's way back up?
I guess what I'm saying, is the first week always the worst or because levels are still on the decline, week 2 might be worse?
Thanks for sharing. I enjoy trying to figure out how I'm suppose to feel and compare it to how I actually feel. LOL. Overall, week 1 isn't so bad minus the lack of libido part.
The first week was HORRIBLE, for me at least. I got those bloods the day after second week was over, I felt fine by then. I finished PCT almost two weeks ago and I feel great. After the first week, everyday I felt progressively better.
How about the gains? How much of the gains have you guys lost during/after PCT? I read somewhere that most people lost ALL gains after cycle...even with the proper PCT. How much BS is this?
I weighed 213 pre cycle, I got up to 232, I'm two weeks post PCT sitting at 224. I'm definitely stronger than I was pre-cycle and my BF dropped almost 4 percent. I did lose 10lbs right away cause I got sick immediately after my last pin. The weights coming back now.
Im a newbie but trying to follow all the protocal on cycle and eventually into pct. just hope i dont lose all my gains. I dont want to yo yo up and down on and off cycle. This being my first cycle, I love it. Just trying to mentally prepare for pct.
I understand how people become addicted to steroids, you need to remember that it's a marathon, not a sprint. You're going to continue to grow for years to come and in the mean time, your weight is going to fluctuate.
You're right, it's a marathon and not a sprint. I love being on cycle, but I'm not going to be someone who abuses it and never gets off it. I plan on following the proper off time (on cycle + pct = off cycle). Just don't want to stop growing.lol.
What kind of weight fluctuations do you all see on vs off cycle? Just curious.