posted Mon, 04/23/2012 - 08:55
2099
clomid or nolva
ad
First time user and I want to run test e for 12 wks. Now I was wondering if I should use clomid or nolva or both. I have been reading a lot. It seems as if both are typical protocol. But since I am only taking test e would one do? If so which one?
- Bookmark
- 0
- 0
cdaddy7BUMP and USE BOTH Zewi is on point with the pathophysiology!!!
Two weeks after last test shot
Week 1-2 40nolva
Week 3-4 20nolva
Week 5 10nolva (thats my thing I like to do to cover my ass on rebound, so its optional)
In combo with clomid:
300 for first 3 days, and drop it back to 100 and continue with week 2
Week 3-4 50 clomid
Week 5 10-25 clomid (Optional as i stated before above)
zewiBOTH BOTH BOTH
Clomiphene--works by blocking estrogen at the pituitary. The pituitary sees less estrogen, and makes more LH. More LH means that the Leydig cells in the testis make more testosterone.
Nova--increases in the serum levels of LH, FSH, if. And also helps block estrogen.
LH--is what the body uses to make Test.
How your testis make natural testosterone.
(REMEBRER TESTOSTERONE DOES TRUN INTO ESTROGEN)
Leyding cells(your testis)---->produce Test------>(some turns in to estrogen)-------------->pituitary Gland(Makes LH)----LH goes to------>Leyding cells make Natural Test--------and the process starts again...
If you have to much estrogen well there is not enough natural Test hitting the pituitary so the pituitary can not make LH...
How Clomid works
Leyding cells(your testis)---->produce Test------>(some turns in to estrogen)-------------->Clomid blocks estrogen from hitting the pituitary(now the pituitary can make LH)pituitary Gland(Makes LH)----LH goes to------>Leyding cells make Natural Test--------and the process starts again...
Clomid is what gets your natural test going, you take nova to block even more estrogen to help the process.
It's amazing how many view clomid vs. Nolvadex. Its basically personal preference and how you react to the drug. Clomid def has more sides than nolva and nolva also can be taken in lower doses and helps cholesterol which a lot of people overlook. Again it's personal preference. You can find dozens of articles for either drug and if you really research them both you will see the benefits of one over another or the combination of them both.
Only use them when you need them. On test E, typically users can get itchy nipples about 4 weeks into their cycle. This is when Nolva is implemented starting as low as possible (a little bit of estrogen helps). Post cycle therapy would include both nolva, clomid, and hcg.
AnonI disagree, hcg is not mandatory or neccessary and the over use/abuse of hcg can permanently interfere with the hpta axis
I feel like HCG is necessary, for me at least. Especially if I want to keep anything that I gained on cycle. I will never do a cycle without it.
Anonclomid is what actually restarts your system... nolva is an estrogen blocker they work together for an optimal recovery
hrdbdyGRRRL,
i have done a bit of research on the clomid vs nolva vs both in pct debate and so far all that i have read (other than some posters on here) leads me to think nolva alone would be the best and safest decision for me and my pct. i see you are well respected, experienced and read so i wanted to get your input. my cycle is my first (500mg test e for 12 weeks - 1000mg frontload), hcg at 250iu 2x a week weeks 4-13, arimidex .25-.5 eod weeks 5-18 and planning on nolva 40/40/20/20 starting week 14). my concerns with clomid are the sides mainly and the research that i have done saying that nolva alone would suffice. can you please share your knowledge with me? also, perhaps some reading i can do to support the clomid restarts your system but nolva doesnt claims? thank you in advance. i do want to handle pct correctly, but do not want to use meds that are not necessary and that may have the neg aspects outweigh the positive.
I only joined today but I have been on this site for months. I have seen you comment on a lot of stuff. Your advice always seem to be good and people respect you on this site. With that being said, I should use both then?
AnonI have always advocated for the use both.
I was going to only use Nolvadex, but I guess I'll throw in the Clomid to, don't want my nuts to go.
I agree with beauty lady above ;-)
I paste my reply to a similiar question about nolva and clomi...
Easy Bro, at low dosages Nolva act ONLY as a SERM do not confuse SERMs (like nolva) and IAs ( 3 top: Letrozole, Exemestane and Anastrozole), similar to IA in objetives (BUT NOT THE SAME, i.e. fighting for attaching to your estro), fighting for receptors against estrogens and consecuently blocking them to act and avoiding well known undesirable effects. It is important to remark that IAs act different from SERMs do, IAs cut the problem from its root avoiding having strogen receptors, but as we know this could be bad cause we need certain strogen levels in order to mantain our inm. system and, of course, droids need also a certain balance of blood strogen to work correctly, thats why it is very important to control IAs dosage and that is because we use to take adex EOD at low dosages.
All above is being ON, talking about PCT is different, Nolva at doses from 10 to 20 mgs ED acts as SERM (normally @ 10 mgs ED), when we are talking about PCT we need to consider that Nolva at dosages higher than 10, like 20, 30 or 40 mgs ED (common dosage at PCT) acts like SERMs attaching to your estrogen receptors and helping you to raise your endo testo levels, specially at 40 mgs ED. That is the reason cause many people only uses Nolva in their PCT, cause many times is enough to restart your test levels (specially if you have not use strong HPTA sup. drois like Deca or Trembo). It is a good way of making a good PCT and avoid Clomid sides (remeber that many people has suffer serious sides with clomid).
The main reason of avoid using Adex and Tamox is simply, adex can not be used with Tamox, they interfere each other, many researchs have demonstrate that Tamox decrease seriously Adex results (about 33% of decrease) and it should be like throwing away your money... Exemestane is a bit different as does not interfere with tamox and can be used together, the key is find the balance between the SERM used and IA (prov+tamox & xtane).
HCG is different and you have the risk (as Girrrl said) have permanent problems with your HTPA Axis recovery... but I also think should be used during the cycle at e5d low dosages in order to avoid teste probs.
Lately I have been hearing about HMG which should be far better but I am looking for medical researchs without (almost) any success...
I can recommend a reputable pharmacy (Clomid) http://canada-express-mall.com/products/clomid.htm?id=kulakgm I received the order and it was on time and the pills work great.
this has been very helpful for me,im about to start my PCT and decided to use Liquid Nolva,Liquid Dex(Ananstrozole)
i just seen you the dosage you recconmend on Nolva but i really want to know about Anastrozole,How much do i take?
NastyNateBoth would be best, but if your only going with one, then Clomid would be it.
Most people use both