posted Tue, 06/28/2022 - 02:45
4344
+ 5 FUCK JAY CUTLER!!!
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For making such a god damn delicious pre workout, I thought I kicked this habit last year but I went and had a single sip of this marvelous temptress recently and I've been chasing the dragon ever since.
My dumb ass decided it would be a good idea to take a half scoop (that turned out to be a full one) before hitting the gym at 5pm, now I'm wired like a crack head and going to be posting dumb shit all night.
In all seriousness, if you guys haven't tried it, it's awesome. It's not going to make you feel like you're high on meth, covered in ants but it tastes delicious and as most of you are aware, that's all I really care about.
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WannagethugerSour blue straws is my fav flavor.
Used to be religious with pre-workouts, but during Covid, I switched to cold brew coffee. I really don’t notice a difference. I work out at night, so some boost really helps at the end of the day.
You should stick to you ovaltine, old man
Wise words sonny.
I have a hard time spending any kind of money on pre workouts. I think it's more the people who sell them than it is the actual product. Plus, I train at night and have a hard enough time getting good sleep.
Instead of straight coffee caffeine, there is something they call green coffee been which is supposed to have very little caffeine for a slight boost at the same time helps with burning fat better than regular caffeine. Motivation in mind is key
TricepatopsNot trying to knock on you for liking it but for the price it is a waste of money. Not much in it only 4000mgs of citrulline per 2 scoops. So you won't get much of a pump compared to other pwos. But if you find something and it works use it.
There are so many companies out there selling pwos so it depends what you are looking for. Some have major stimulants in it and some are stim free. For me I prefer 250mgs of caffeine 300mgs max or I get sick feeling. No yohimbine in mine. Also for ever professional BB making a supplement line that is decent another one makes shit and throws their name on it and sell it for more then it is worth.
I'll be completely honest with you, I buy it for the flavor. I don't like high caffeine, I usually only take half a scoop, 300mg of caffeine would have me feeling terrible, got weak caffeine genes.
I can tell you as someone that was in the industry that companies usually pick either pump or stim when making preworkouts. This one is very mental or stimulant focused, you can even read the label.
What happens is companies run out of room in the scooper, or more ingredients raise the cost above an acceptable level of profit. Or they want to create room to make a separate product to fill that need.
If you look at a company that put a full dose of everything in there the scooper is over 30g, that is massive only 20 servings because of this. (6.5g of citruline)
https://shop.bodybuilding.com/products/kaged-muscle-pre-kaged-stim-free-...
Jays scooper is only 5g
https://jaycutler.com/products/prevail
That is because they expect you to buy this lol
https://jaycutler.com/collections/amplify-2-0/products/amplify-v2-peach-...
Definitely could make a point here that they could of combined these products easily. But I still think the pre is a nice product for someone not focused on pump, because 2g of citrulline aint doing much like you said. Personally sodium + oral AAS + taboo gives me all the pumps I need heheh
PS bored at work guys
TricepatopsThe thing now a days is there are so many supplement companies selling stuff. Some are good and some are shit. But some of the bigger companies now a days sell both stim and stim free. And now they add in pump products which you can add to your PWO. I noticed you said sodium some now add pink Himalayan salt for that reason. I have one kind I like and get it cheap through Costco it is GNC Lit gummy worm flavor. Only had 3 or 4 grams of citrulline but I add more in with my Citrulline which I have by itself I got that free from buying Redcon MRE products. I go for good quality and deals just can't pay 50 bucks for 20 servings of something. By the way the Lit is only 43.99 for 60 servings which to me is a hell of a deal compared to prices of some other ones. Also glycerol is a good for pumps and filling those muscles up. Anyways would like to know what others favorite proteins or other pwo are.
Appreciate you asking advice friend. Sounds like you have some good money saving strategies, I also use redcon and there ridiculous promos.
You are hitting all the pump vectors with citrulline (converts to arginine), glycerol, sodium (most important in my opinion), potassium. Your pre-workout meal being higher in highly digestible carbohydrates such as rice and/or honey. Get that natural insulin going. And take your GH pre-workout as well with an low dose oral AAS and you should have skin splitting pumps.
My question is the "pump" an anabolic process? Will a bigger pump lead to bigger muscles?
Do you have your guys eating cream of rice with honey pre workout
LOL thats the Rich Piana secret bro ;)
For me, the pump and lactic acid burn go hand in hand. If I am getting super pumped up my muscles are on fire from the lactic acid. Once you feel the burn you are definitely in an anabolic state. You should always be chasing that pump and lactate burn since there are so many positive benefits to it.
So it goes without saying that one obvious benefit is the cell swelling effect of lactate buildup in the muscles. If your pump starts burning you are on the right track. Lactate accumulation is the primary cause of changes in a muscle cells osmolarity (cell size). This increase in cell swelling stimulates muscle protein synthesis (anabolism) and decreases catabolism of protein. Win win scenario here.
So we know that the stretching of the muscle cell by certain mechanisms such as cellular hydration or swelling does indeed trigger anabolism and decreases catabolism of protein in that cell . Examples of this occurring in studies use Creatine and Glutamine. Creatine does this to a way greater degree than L Glutamine. The point is this mechanism is not theory but fact. Personally I myself love the pump. I understand growth starts outside the gym but I gotta say that pump is definitely the catalyst to this process of growth. Now was Arnold Accurate about comparing the pump to an organism? Well that's debatable for some but I will say it's a damn good feeling to be blown up and feeling good! @UncleYoked @HanginLow
Yea I gotta have that PUMP! No if, and or buts...yessir!
What a great discussion guys.
This convo kinda of morphed and got off track so I am going to summarize my initial intent of my question.
The convo was about pump supplements and whether increasing the pump through things like arginine and citrulline that convert to NO and increase vasodilation. My question was the chase of a bigger pump through these supplements an anabolic process? Did Sergio Oliva need citrulline? Are they a waste of money?
So to answer my man Dwayne, yes a pumped and stretched muscle cell will grow, but to me "the pump" is the visceral feedback of the body, not a metric to chase or measure. "The pump" is a byproduct of intensity (pushing past the adaptation of the muscle), stretching the muscle concentrically and eccentrically against load and increasing volume over time that forces adaptation.
Do I chase the pump on smaller muscle groups such as Arms and Delts? Yes, but I always keep an eye on the numbers that got me there, because you can get a good pump and not stimulate growth.
Also another point is muscle group selection. Do you chase the pump on deadlifts? Squats? BOR? what puts on the most muscle?
Reposting this from my response to Mak cuz I think I am a real funny bitch
"To me chasing the pump is for these young broccoli haircut SARM goblins that do endless pump sets without enough load or intensity"
That aint applying to anyone here, we all understand the place for the pump and I think we can agree like Arnie said Pumping and Humping baby. I love leaving the gym looking like a cock full of veins.
Bro I laughed too hard at this
Yes great point here Mak, lactic acid does have a role in exercise adaptation, especially for aerobic exercise of 30-60+ seconds. Which you could achieve doing giant or drop sets, further research must be done to clarify the mechanism by which lactic acid is mediating adaptations, particularly weight exercise-induced adaptations.
To me that is a variable of Intensity, train the muscle past expectation of oxygen demand increases LA. But again as stated above I believe we are all seeing eye to eye on this subject and is a matter more of wording.
To me chasing the pump is for these young broccoli haircut SARM goblins that do endless pump sets without enough load or intensity LOL
The pump absolutely does lead to large muscles. A lot of competitive body builders (if not all) focus on over flexing at the end of their lifts, it's the most painful part of the process that many people don't do but it's along the same principles of forcing your muscles to expand through increased blood flow. Give it a shot
Unc my friend, I have dedicated my life to bodybuilding.
Squeezing the target muscle unequivocally increases muscle activation. Is that the same as the pump?https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6871791/#!po=35.7143
This is a different mechanism than the pump we are talking about in my opinion. Not all bodybuilders utilize higher rep ranges that would be associated with "the pump". Dante Trudel's DC (lol) training was based on the High intensity low volume techniques of Mike Mentzer and Yates and is/was utilized by many BB. Jordan Peters further evolved this style to become modern and has many followers.
In the end we are dealing with some syntax here. Thanks for your comments unc.
man, I like you, you can fuck my sister. you seem to always have something intelligent to say.
My belief is that It's not the exact same as pump induced by arginine, citrulline, etc but it's along the same lines. Squeezing is going to give you more activation, strength, fiber density but overall they're both forcing blood in and expanding the actual muscle size to allow for more growth and nutrients, at least that's my theory. I could very well be full of shit. BTW I'm not referring to ultra high reps, I mean flexing and even posing and holding it until beyond the unbearable point.
LOL man that's a compliment, is there a plaque for "Unc offered me his sister"*
*Pending picture
LOL
Absolutely brother I love the pump. And yes I believe we are all in agreement I squeeze the fuck out of especially smaller muscle groups to drive blood and hypertrophy.
You gotta get that pump though, how it happens is another variable, Jay cutler would spend about $1000 a week on massages towards the end, get that nasty pump > roll around and stretch between sets > deep tissue massage the next day to stop the muscle from healing up in a bunched up pattern. Then do it all again, mfer was huge for sure.
I personally don’t need massive high rep ranges to get a nasty pump. I take the reps I can while reserves are high and squeeze to an intense cramping sensation results, then repeat. It for sure increases activation allowing the remaining reps a more efficient effect. Think of blood flow bands too, forcing blood to stay in the target muscle longer, it increases the internal pressure and pumps the shit out of the muscle.
There’s so many ways to do it, but you definitely won’t get big without getting a pump, and I agree you don’t need higher rep ranges and extreme volume to achieve the pump. But that pump tho..fucking love it.
What a lucky girl at the ball I am to have two sources asking to dance.
What came first the pump or the contraction?
What drivers hypertrophy at the muscle cell? You will not find "the pump" my friends. Perhaps my view is more micro than macro and visceral and that is the misunderstanding.
Blood flow restriction is a partial restriction of arterial inflow to a target muscle. A pump would be an excess of blood flow not restriction... So to me a different mechanism.
To me the pump is a visceral feedback, excess blood flow but not a metric to chase. I say chase load, volume and intensity leave the pump for the stringer boys.
Always enjoy thought provoking and cordial debate my friends. And I believe we all see eye to eye and I might be knit picking different interpretations of "the pump".
Friendly banter is all!
Here’s a link to a Ronnie Coleman interview where he literally said his main goal is to get that pump, in 10-12 reps he said he needs. About 3/4 of the way down. “Chase the pump”
https://www.muscleandfitness.com/flexonline/training/10-training-tips-le...
His quote >The tighter the pump, the more your body will grow, so keep it going. Who knows where it will stop?
It takes me 1001 reps. Look at my guns. You must have noticed.
Lol
Oh he’s in a stringer, I thought that’s what you called stringer boys.. I’m just busting your balls man!
Bro you got me fucked up lol I am too serious
And I did buy that too!! That's my walk around and sip drank on a warm summer day
I thought i was the only guy who drank pre workout pump products on the drive over to the BBQ POOL PARTY
Taste rules all!
Just saw the formula, looks interesting.
Nice blend of caffeines, happy to see di-caffeine malate come around again. It usually was paired with caffeine citrate (the tren ace of the caffeine world) malic acid has nice health benefits
Huperzine A another lesser used ingredient, I remember when everyone was trying to use it to reduce somatostatin along with peptides. Nice nootropic effect from hup and alpha GPC by increasing acetylcholine.
nice blend of focused based ingredients with a moderate caffeine yield of 250mg, I am gunna try it out! Thanks for sharing
You mix it or take a huge dry mouthful!?
I take a huge mouthfull
Oh you mean the pre workout, no I mix that with water
Would it still be considered a pre workout if you mixed it with vanilla ice cream? Lol
I'm going to try that tomorrow, I'll let you know how it turns out.
I buy jello mix and put a scoop in there for pre workout jello bites. Little dextrose in the jello as well helps with the pump
This guy living in 2050 right here!
I’m jealous this wasn’t my idea, but I think I’m going to sell this shit now!!
Cialis/jello mix.
(Don’t worry, all my items have ONLY the listed ingredients)
I used to buy Carnivor Vanilla Caramel beef protein. Tasted great in milk. Always wanted to try it in a vanilla milkshake. Never did.
LMFAO
Use milk. Like a man.
Jay is one of my biggest inspirations its good to hear his knowledge actually translated to supps cuz most guys miss the mark.
I feel you bro, the pre 2000 cutler was my favorite.
What sold me on this was his marketing video, fucking love it.
Dude is still a God, love that guy... 40% homo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nx6GqCXiH94
THAT QUAD STUMP THOUGH!!! The day the Earth shook!
He could definitely hold his own against anyone back in the day
Yukon_JackI like when he grabbed dudes quad next to him before the stomp. That was the intro to quad stomp & out-tro to the dudes quad he grabbed. Dinosaur legs!!
I believe that was Dexter Jackson. Both legends
Yea that was Dexter
Dude and he looks fuckin great for his age. I base a lot of my training off his shit cuz its obviously working lmao