posted Tue, 04/03/2018 - 03:48
3185
-1 post cycle question
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I have been on a TRT cycle of test E and sust for the past 6 months....1/2 ML twice a week....I sustained an injury and wanted come off of it......I know i need to take clomid and nolvadex....I just need to know the amounts and time? Any help is appreciated
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Looks like you are self medicating, not a good idea!!!
Go and see your doc, get blood test done to see where you are
Do some research
What you are doing to yourself:
https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/c969/5f24e1e5daa4a2dc68f2204f5c3d92e27c...
The original PCT presentation
https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Nelson_Vergel2/publication/32026956...
Formal explanation of the PCT - Chapter 11 http://corpus-scientia.com/forum/index.php?/topic/1558-free-download-ana...
The PCT has changed since, evolved. The creator of PCT; Scally, doesnt use as much HCG or Nolv and frontloads for Clomid can differ, if i remember correctly.
What you post doesn’t make any sense man
Are you engaging with trt doc or you’re just huh I’m doing trt dosage
Nobody on this earth can help you with this post
1- if you been with trt doc then probably he try many methods before he put you on trt because trt it’s the last thing he will put you through is trt
2- you just messed up by doing trt by your own choice
I’m just assuming by what you have post
Get yourself a good trt doc maybe there’s a chance he can
Fixed you
The only help you need will come from an endo who you need to be completely honest with. Self prescribing TRT, especially as half assed as you did, is not something that we condone here, nor are we doctors looking at your specific blood work ready to make a medicinal diagnosis.
You fucked up by being a cheap-ass “professional” thinking you knew better and could skirt the correct way of doing things. Own it, and get an actual professional to set you right this time. Go to your endo, be completely honest, accept your reaming, and follow their advice.
You have NOT been on a TRT cycle.
You went to get onto TRT from a doctor (men's health clinic?) and balked at the price.
You then went blindly to your friend who had you start a very bad TRT regimen. Why the hell would you stop a long estered Test just at its peak to start using sust which is going to cause havoc with your estrogen levels? (if anything you should have done it the other way around if the idea was to "jumpstart" your TRT)
Now here's the clincher. Because you didn't see a real doctor, you don't even know if PCT will help you. If blood work showed your testes were not working clomed is not going to help you.
Do you even know what your test levels were before "treatment'?
Do you know the reason your levels were low to start with?
Why are you still listening to your friend? Unless your hernia surgery is going to be 8 to 12 weeks out you're not going to right this ship in time.
You were on a modest dose until you started your sust and you should be alright to stop taking the sust 1 week before surgery and pick it up again after (but get back to using test e or c instead). If anything like BP is an issue the docs will point it out. If they ask you about your BP issues or any other related sides tell them the truth that you are on "TRT" and are taking 1 mil test C split over 2 injections per week.
I appreciate the info...So your saying that I can not come off this???? I went to my personal physician(over a year ago) I told him I was tired and lost my sex drive...He took blood and told me my testosterone levels were low....and suggested I try a gel(which was not covered by my insurance).I didn't know at the time I needed that number....and I have no clue why they are so low...I assumed it was because I'm pushing 40 and between 2 kids and 2 jobs along with a shit diet has taken its toll on me...I'm not even sure if I'm having surgery yet....I have a pain in my abdomen where I had a mesh put in from a previous surgery...so let's put that aside....Since I started this cycle...I have felt great... and I have seen results in the gym and with my energy levels and sex drive.....are the levels I am doing bad for my health? The place that i was directed to use ships pretty fast although they do have some inventory problems....Should I order some test e and test c....How many mg? and how long should I stay on it.....is there a timeline where i go off cycle? The guy who suggested my current cycle is missing in action...The person who told me that it could effect my pre op is a nurse...(who might not be acclimated to this world) ....I have 2 shots left of test e and 1 10 ml bottle of sust left....again...I know my lack of knowledge in this subject is bad..that is why I'm here asking.....any help is apprciated
Sust is a blend of esters with varying degrees of release, it will fluctuate your test levels radically which in turn will cause your estrogen levels to fluctuate wildly as your body tries to regulate a balance between your E and T levels. This is one reason you have acne.
The Gel is offered as an easy way to increase your test without shots. It does not mean you can't request, and get, injectable testosterone.
Your test levels could have been low normal. Often time more activity, weight loss, and a good diet can raise those levels naturally. If you went to a men's clinic chances are they are selling something you may not need. Go to your GP or an endo Doc.
Blood work would show if your low T is the result of non functioning Testes or if you have a problem with your "thermostat" as my doc put it. Which involves your hypothalamus, pituitary etc. If your testes are not working, clomed won't help. If your "thermostat" has malfunctioned, clomed therapy is usually the first step to jump start it.
TRT is for life! when you start using exogenous test, you shut down your own production of test.
Typically 200mg of test C is all you need per week but you need to work with a doctor to find out what that "sweet spot" is. You also have to monitor your RBC count and cholesterol. The process can take over a year.
Higher levels of test -especially over long periods of time, can have several detrimental effects including high blood pressure, cholesterol, and red blood cell count.
You keep talking TRT and cycles. There is no such thing. Testosterone Replacement Therapy replaces the testosterone you can not produce naturally. Like a diabetic, you need to take injections for life
A cycle is a boost of exogenous testosterone to increase your levels beyond normal. There are many side effects including shutting down your own thermostat. Cycle are kept short. typically never longer than 12 to 16 weeks. The length of a cycle depends on ester being used, goals, and experiance.
PCT or Post cycle therapy is to try and jumpstart your normal production after a cycle has shut it down.
The nurse who told you about the pre-op work is correct and probably is referring to blood pressure mostly RBC can be an issue too. You can donate blood to get your RBC down to normal
Sust has a blend of long and short esters. if you stop injecting it will be several weeks before it is entirely out of your system. If you stop injecting 1 week prior to a surgery at your current 500 mg weekly dose, most of the short esters will be nil and the long esters should have your levels at near normal / low normal and your BP should be down as well.
After surgery, and before doing anything else, I'd go back to a real doctor and find out the true reason you felt the way you did and follow his guidance, If you want to do cycles, study cycles and have the discipline to follow protocol.
"Professional" 2 jobs? Wow you must make a shit load of money!
Seriously though... you need to come off that because obviously you need to do some research. Look.. you've made it to this site so you're 70% of the way there. Look through the site for information that will prepare you for your road ahead. That's what makes this site so great. We don't like guys coming in here that make 0 effort to try to help themselves. You need the help of a professional to be honest. He's the only one who truly knows what's going in with your hormones and can make an educated decision.
Start your pct.
There's no way you're 39.
With that said... what da fuq are you doing?
Sust and test e? And for TRT? Even a 1/2 ml a week you're doing a cycle
Sust 500
Test e 250
You need to seriously reconsider your life choices. It's people like you and also the kids in my gym that are going to ruin AAS and give it a terrible wrap.
Let me ask you a question what did your "cycle" look like when you were "on?"
(Can't wait to hear this)
Gotta be the first time you've been called a steroid snob.
To the op I would personally follow Gregs advice above. Keep us posted.
..First....I don't like your tone guy....I'm a 39 year old professional .....Just because I am not acclimated with how the steroid world works is no reason for you to question my credibility you fucking asshole....This is how this cycle was sold to me....along with a text on how to use it and what i need to get for the pct...And it's jerkoff's like you that turn new people off from asking questions and getting informed you steroid snob
I don't like your tone. First claiming the classest level of being a "professional" suggests you are "white collar" educated, and financially comfortable. So I find it incredibly ironic you chose to put common sense aside, your educational training aside, and skimp on your health to save a few bucks.
So here you are hat in hand asking for free advice and doing the research you should have done over 6 months ago. You sir are due for a bit of a scolding, you obviously don't have friends who are looking out for you and give you a wakeup call. And, you are still operating on the cheap coming here instead of going back to your TRT doc.
I'm a professional fireman with a side job, kids and mortgage.I'm not cheap by choice....I didn't know I needed to display my resume of this forum....Do you think it's helpful telling a guy he's stupid and cheap???? I assumed this site was created to share information...not to scold people.....I'm blown away by some of the assumptions that have been made about me after I posted a simple question....And to be clear...I did not know this existed nor did I trust it...I chose to trust a guy I thought, knew what he was talking about..I didn't even know what I was doing was so bad till now....and not one person has explained why yet.All I have had was criticism .I went to my personal physician ....not a trt doctor..I am completely turned off by this experience.....maybe I will go to a trt doc...At least he would give me an answer without degrading me.....holy shit.....you can keep this world.....And this is the reason people hate gym rats and meat heads..bunch of stuck up snobs.....hat in hand....on an info site???????Are you kidding me?
You opened that can of worms with your attitude and comments. I've spent about an hour of my time replying to you and your self righteous indignation, and high horse, attitude. You are owed nothing. Members here are not paid professionals, they are giving you free advice based on personal experiance. They are asking personal questions because they are not giving you cookie cutter advice. Yes, hat in hand. Humility and acknowleding your fuckup is your first step to getting it right. If you want to continue arguing with me like a child over this I'll gladly remove you from the site.
My professional hourly rate is $250 an hour. You're welcome.
I asked a question.....that's how this can of worms was opened....I was offended when someone questioned my integrity by insinuating I was lying about my age...If you read this time line you will see I was not the aggressor...And as I do appreciate your advice...The crux of it was I need to see a doctor..(which after doing some research, have found that the usa is full of scammers in that industry)..So feel free on having me removed...I will never use this site again...This experience was so unpleasant, that I would never dare ask another question on it again...if free advice is accompanied by sharp criticism, then it is not free..I help people for a living..I do not force my opinion on them while I am helping them...And i'm not the one on my high horse as I am the one asking the question....good luck
Your best reply to someone who questioned your age on a site where we get a ton of kids pretending to be older would be to politely hold your ground and not go full psycho and overly sensitive to criticism. So yes, you did not start out the aggressor but you caused the backdraft when you posted your hypersensitive reply.
Professional, very professional
You're on a high horse (still) because you feel you deserve better treatment (you're a hero fireman after all)
You made a mistake -own it.
You don't know who you were replying to. What his standing in our community is. If I walked into your firehouse and started laying into one of your teammates for chopping a hole in my roof or breaking my driveway with your water truck in the same manner you replied to goose I can assure you I'd be getting an ear full from you and other firemen as well.
.
You wouldn't be so damn offended if you even had a clue how many kids come on here trying to get info without putting In any effort. I bet it's 10-12 in the last couple weeks alone. So get off the high horse take a pill and absorb the knowledge that has been given to you.
A 39 year old "professional" who was told by a friend to use X of amount of steroids and went along with it without doing any research whatsoever . Smh
be honest....did not even know this world existed....Remember....I'm engaging in a illegal activity...and after asking a question...All I have received is criticism.....I came here for answers and help...And so far only one person has giving me a decent answer...the rest have been a critique on my lack of knowledge....And not once in that criticism has anyone told me what is actually wrong with the levels I'm taking....I am completely turned off by this experience .....Do you guys get off on doing this to people ???? Or do you want to actually help...??????????
You cussed Goose and then you want to know if we help people? I dont help people like you. Your a tool...
It broke my heart ;'(
Poor Goose :( #Goosedidnothingwrong
Don't feel too bad. "Steroid Snob' - I like it - it has a certain air of nobility to it. By the power vested in me (which is none) I hereby dub thee: Sir Goose.
Aren't they all?
He didn’t cuss at you he stated his opinion. -2
Kind of confused. You are on TRT but want to come off it now?
I was told to....I had hernia surgery on my abdomen and it might have ruptured again ...I was told by a friend that if I do need surgery again...I should not be on test because it could effect my blood work for the pre surgical checkup...I am pretty new to this....so if you have any other suggestions...I'm open to them...also...I'm on my last bottle of sust....this is how the cycle was sold to me....so I either have to order more or go on a post cycle till i figure out what is going on with my abdomen
The way it looks to me now is that you are running a full blown cycle and not anywhere near a trt dose of test. You wouldn't stop your trt just because you are having surgery. I have been through a few surgeries myself and and trt isn't stopped because of that. You are taking a supraphysical dose of test which can lead to problems. You first need to find out if you actually need to be on TRT otherwise running a PCT is pointless if you need to be on TRT. It is even more reckless to be self-administering TRT when you actually don't need to so you need to get that figured out asap.
X2
Yea a general answer would be to dose clomid 150mg per day or nolva at about 30mg/40mg for around 2 weeks and then the following 2 weeks lower your dose. Just based on experience it's also based upon how much gear you ran
nonsense
Another spring chicken. Cluck fucking cluck
Cookie cutter google advice. How many weeks after his last injection does he start? When should he draw his first post cycle bloods?
As I stated in the reply I was giving a general answer for normal circumstances. In his case it's a lot different. But obviously waiting 2 to 3 weeks considering it's sust. And with the absence of a doctor he for sure isn't getting blood work done on the regular. The main conclusion we have come to in this forum is he needs to go to a doctor. After he revealed his dosing and time using it changed everything from a standpoint of a correct response.
Exactly my point because to him it is not obvious and he would have started right after his last shot, making 50% of his PCT non effective, finished the PCT and never follow through with blood work to see if he needed to continue his PCT for a bit longer. Or if it was working at all.
It's dangerous to toss out comments like that. They do that at other sites, we don't do that here.
No I mean your right, I picked up real quick that there was a knowledge gap. I shouldn't have assumed that he had the general knowledge when it came to the subject. But once again I didn't pick up on his level of subject credibility until much later into the forum.
thank you....You are the only person who has actually answered my question...I appreciate it
Just because some guy told you to run a pct a certain way , are you going to believe it? I hope not ... I hope you have figured out that before you start pumping chemicals in your body, to do YOUR Own research and not just go to an online forum, asking for help and do what you’re told. Christ man, if I suggest that you go suck a dick ( no homo) , or jump off a cliff are you gonna just say ok n do it? Or will you use the space between your ears that the good lord gave all of us and think for yourself....
if you want help that’s fine, that’s what eroids is about but you also need to bring more to the table than just asking for the answer to the prob.... use the magnifying glass up top and search for a pct based on your cycle... read read read and then come back here n propose a plan based on what you learned... people mite be more apt to help you , knowing that you actually put in the effort to help yourself but still need some guidance
this was not my first stop....i tried researching pct for my cycle And have gotten very vague results...that is why i asked here..i am not taking any of this as gospel....and believe me...I do not plan on asking any other questions....thanks
Interesting how the one person (who may or may not be 25) offers you incorrect PCT information regarding TRT (which I’m sure he has years of experience with) gets you all giddy. Are you looking for actual advice or just for anything that remotely resembles what you want to hear?
He's the only one who actually answered the question.....The rest of the post are telling me i'm an asshole...without explaining why the doses I am taking are so bad????...I came here for info.not crticism..so yes...any info would be appreciated....
You can’t be an idiot and do stupid things and not expect to win stupid prizes. Your reaming in this thread is well warranted. You can’t get info and not expect criticism, that’s not how the world works. If you’re too thin skinned for criticism you need to readjust your state of mind.
If he doesn't plan on going back on that trt (which I hope he takes some time off of it to regulate) then clomid and nolva will do just fine. If he plans on continuing treatment than hcg should be considered. But just based off his situation I think regulating and using realistic dosing is in order. Which once again nolva and clomid would be productive
What you’re proposing is a similar PCT that is standard here for a regular cycle... if he ran a regular cycle, sure PCT might work for him. What he ran was not a normal cycle, for a normal amount of time. He abused AAS thinking he knew better than a doctor.
If he wants to recover, he needs to see an endo. That’s the only advice he needs. The endo may have him run some form of nolva or Clomid, hcg, HMG, or a combo. But that’s for a professional to decide, not ya throwing shit at the wall and hoping it sticks and helps him.
I'm assuming an endo is a doctor????
Endocrinologist
We are crossing similar paths here. Just stating the pct's and their average doses was my intention along with recommending seeking out a way to get his body to regulate. But going off the premise that he doesn't want to use a doctor (based upon the forum conversations) is why I even threw a dose out there. Obviously with anything concsulting a doctor is best. But we all know some just chosen not to.
Him not choosing to follow his doctors advice is what got him in this mess in the first place. You’re new so I haven’t reamed you too hard yet, I know it takes a bit of getting used to the way we do things here.
TRT isn’t something to be taken lightly the way he has. Him not wanting to use a doctor doesn’t mean we can substitute our advice in. Again, you’re new so you’ll get the hang of things. Welcome to the forums and hope you stick around and see how we do things differently here and why as opposed to other forums out there.
Fair enough, i appreciate the welcoming. I'm picking up on the tone of things for sure. I see we are going for a much more realistic point of opinion instead of general answers.
Just giving a general answer. It's not specific to your cycle but just an average dosing level. Don't be offended by the others unfortunately they get off on giving opinions about things that weren't asked. Whether or not I agree with your cycle choice is irrelevant. The question was about a pct, my answer was given in a general circumstance! Best of of luck to you!