+ 10 Muscle Memory - My recovery without gear
I often read cycles / posts from guys that have been ill, had injuries etc and dropped weight as a result. Understandably, they tend to be impatient to get back where they were and they want to jump back into a cycle as soon as they can. I've been there myself with injuries, two shoulder surgeries in a year cost me time and mass, the first time I was also pretty impatient, almost certainly that had something to do with surgery number two.
Earlier this year I had to undergo chemotherapy as mentioned in a previous post. At the time it happened, I was sitting around 290lbs, training and eating really well and seriously considering 2015 as the year I SHOULD win a big title. There's no denying it, best condition I've ever been in, I would have been 265lbs+ on stage. Obviously Mr Chemo decided against that. 1st August I weighed myself at 252lbs, an ugly 252 I have to say as well. Being pumped full of poison for six weeks doesn't do your physique a lot of good.
Yesterday was the 5th September. Scales told me 271lbs. I've stayed off them for a couple of weeks, if I'm honest I was a little scared how I'd recover. No gear, decent training, good diet, MUSCLE MEMORY. Even after poisoning, it works. My BF is pretty similar, perhaps a touch lower actually. The temptation to jump back on was huge, the only things that stopped me were 1) aches and pains left over from the chemo made me worry about injuring myself 2) truly testing out this muscle memory theory. The geek if a scientist wanted to know ;)
So what's the point? Don't get too down about injury / illness etc, you'll bounce back and invariably quicker than you think and in truth it's part of the game we play. You don't have to put a recovering body through the extra strain of AAS just to hurry it along, taking more risks of red jury or relapse. Patience! Doesn't feel half bad earning it back the hard way either.....
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Trying to remember what little I learned about 'muscle memory' while in school and as a trainer back in the day ....
IIRC it was generally thought that MM was essentially improved synaptic connections and more easily achieved muscle excitability after long-term training that allowed one to bounce back much faster after a layoff. That said, I also seem to remember a study with mice showing improved hypertrophy after a single AAS use in the past. Too lazy to look it up though.
One thing I know for sure ... even after 5 months clean with no pct and not training due to an injury, and dropping to 183 lbs, three weeks back and my wife was like "Are you juicing again?". I was also sorta stunned at how quickly my body was recomping with just diet and training. Much faster than two years ago before I started hitting the sauce again.
Btw ... I know it was five years ago but I hope you're still doing well.
Forgot to remind ... though I cannot remember the physiology of the process, it is generally accepted by us humans also that previous AAS use will make a sizable diff in gains years later. Hence the whole "life time natural" thing that some harp on. Lol
Muscle memory is a myth. It doesn't exist. It is psychological and has nothing to do with your actual muscles.
I completely agree with you on this and have always thought this. A muscle doesn't have a 'memory' that allows itself to get strong again much quicker, all it is down to is the fact we have performed that exercise many times over in the past and so are quicker to be able to perform it efficiently again rather than learning it over as a beginner.
Point in question is when I returned to benching again after years of alcoholism. To get back to my previous max again took just as long as it it did the first time around. Every Kg was as hard to add as before - I did not suddenly progress in stages of 5kg a time because of 'muscle memory'.
This study disproved it. They say what we consider muscle memory is actually stored in the brain and not the cells of the muscle.
https://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1...
No it doesn't!!!!!
Absence of evidence ≠ evidence of absence
It is hypothesized. You are correct about it not being proven. I misspoke. I personally don't believe the cells in muscles retain information about previous physical activities. I believe it is all in the brain.
Agreed brother.
Right on man.
Couldn't agree more with there being something in the brain that is involved
Bad Achak Bad Achak !
Don't worry we will get you trained yet.
Muscle memory has a perfect example in Push-Ups , After doing more and more push ups our mind develops a sort of neurological numbness to the motion allowing us to do more and more push ups the more we train that particular muscle movement .
Hints muscle memory but no I don't think the cells in our muscles actually increase in memory.
What? Then where are the voices in my head coming from?
Well said. Thanks for sharing. This is always an interesting topic
You are actually right on the money. Read this study. It validates what you said.
https://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1...
I dont know the science behind, but theres definitely something that helps recover lost muscle.
Every time ive had dramatic weight loss (lets say more than 5 or 10 kg) i recovered size and strength faster than it would take me to gain it for the first time. Also its very convenient that when i recover, it stops at the same plateau i was at before losing it.
Let me clarify. Most people associate muscle memory with the cells in our muscles retaining information. This isn't true at all. The brain stores information about repeated activities. We develop neural pathways that help us take mental shortcuts when performing known physical activities. Our brain also signals the body what it is physically capable of doing. You will not have the same degree of mental roadblocks when performing physical activities that you've previously done.
Researchers proved that muscle tissue doesn’t retain memory of previous repetitive movements in a 2016 study. Trained and untrained muscles appeared to have the same physiologically under biopsy testing.
What you think of as muscle memory is in your brain and not in your actual muscle.
https://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1...
Right on.
Cells can die. But, they deflate faster. So, muscle memory is a thing. At its most basic/transactional, it happens every day when you use energy/water in the cells, cells need to reinflate. cells use protein too and we replenish it, but the cells are still there.
The biggest part of what we do in the gym is about hypertrophy, which is about inflating muscle, and making single strands bigger. Hyperplasia is harder to do (making more actual muscle fibres). We see a reversal to a degree in hypertrophy when we switch the gear off and it partially deflates as the body gets rid of things like water, potassium, sodium etc. (like a baloon).
Fat cells do it too sadly. When we 'burn' fat, we are releasing it from fat cells but the cells remain alive, somewhat dormant, waiting for a Domino's delivery to fill them back up again.
ETA:
This talks in way better language than I can, about the difference between fibre growth, new fibres, cell death etc. and what might be muscle memory:
https://physoc.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1113/JP276354
Excellent post my friend! I have lost the majority of my muscle gains that I achieved through 5 years of bodybuilding do to a chronic illness I have suffered through the past two years with. I still have some muscle tone but have gained a lot of fat for a person built like myself (on the thin side).
I am definitely ready to get back to training but alas covid-19 for me hitting the gym. So in the meantime I will be training at home with exercise bands and body-weight resistance exercises. That's all I have and I'm not going to be sure about it because it's better than nothing and it's definitely better than being sick!
IfbbmoeYea I am guilty of always being paranoid about taking time off especially with injuries and hopping back into the gym too soon but realistically it is better to wait it out than to come back too soon and cause more damage. I'm glad you are bouncing back nicely I'm sure you are going to be better than ever in no time
Onward and upward brother Cat! Something tells me you've traveled the unbeaten unforgiving path before your set back. Hard work isn't hard for the hardened soul! To a speedy forthcoming brother...knuckles!
I stayed on test and Deca when partially tore ligaments from my spine. Lost practically nothing with 6 months not training! I'm almost back just slower than I thought it would be.
Edit I mean strength wise almost back size not greatly affected but I went from 280kg deadlift to starting back with 110kg for example
AnonThis is one hell of a great post Catalyst and this sure hits home with me. Muscle memory is a wonderful thing and I truly hope it holds true for myself too. I myself have lost almost 3 stone in weight over the last few months through worry and not eating. Some days I would be lucky to get one solid meal down me.
But that now is about to change and I sure hope I can gain back what I've lost a lot quicker than it took me to build in the first place once I get my nutrition back in place and workout schedule nailed down.
You'll get it back mate, probably quicker than you think too. If you need to moan / chat / a kick up the backside drop me a line.
AnonThanks mate, it means a lot.
Give them a vote if you find it helpful.PermalinkVery informative thank you!
Very educational post.. Last year for a bad back injury I had to stand still for almost a
year without being able to touch weights , obviously I lost everything but
when I had the chance to be able to train again recover it was easier and faster than I thought!
Well done buddy, thats some nice recovery gains there without any drugs.
I dropped about 7KG this month due to a virus and also gained some fat, just started lifting again yesterday, feels so good to start up again.
Muscleg33kjust finished my 10th treatment of chemo with FOLFOX. It could be the last since I'm dealing with terrible nerves. I still go to the gym few times a week however my strength aren't the same. I lost like 10-12 lbs since the chemo. my Chemo doctor knows I'm on TRT and let me continue to take 150 mg of Test C weekly.
RustyhookerHope you heal up soon!
There is no question muscle memory. Seen it 1st hand with myself.
I have noticed that it does diminish some with age.
I seem to always be taking two steps forward and one back with life's injuries, illnesses, and deaths in the family. Glad to see you bounce back and wishing you lasting good health.
I think muscle memory is better than my memory at this point in age lol. It's good to hear you're back in the game and doing it sensible. I'm going to have to hit you up soon in the diet clinic for a bulker, I need to put on some weight if I'm going to do a comp this spring.
Anytime mate. I'm starting to plan something similar so there will be a potential red meat shortage on the horizon in the near future. If you want o talk through cycles etc I'm more than happy to help.
I was toying with the idea of competing end October until I realised I'd be nowhere near my best. No point competing in a tough NABBA show even if I'm at 80%, it just wouldn't be good enough and I'm a bad loser ;) Rebuild and come back better 2016.
LOL bad loser or biggest loser. Cat goes all roid rage on stage with a can of whoop ass lmao, just imagening. I'm sure Ed would find the video for us.
I'll shoot you a pm soon and tell you what I have planned and then you can tell me the what you would do.
great post, the human body is extremely remarkable when it comes to healing and repairing its self. with proper diet and a planning anything is possible, this is a great lesson to all the guys and girls that are to quick to jump the gun and think that gear is always the answer its not..... +2
RustyhookerYessir! Glad you got back into a good groove. I went from 205 pressing the big weights to breaking elbows. Rehabilitation on my arms was wrist curls etc with a 16 oz can of beans. Couldn't even hold my own coffee cup. Dr talking about fusing my arm and muscles partially detached due to bone break. Was a hard journey but worth it.
I remember that. You bounced back, it's the "type" we mostly are. We scrape ourselves up and get on with it.