posted Fri, 07/03/2015 - 09:19
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Terrible advice, sust was made for trt not building muscle. With the prop and phenylprop it has to be dosed at minimum eod. Twice a week means you have a 3 day then 4 day window. The 4th day window you dropped the prop. The other issue with sust everyone seems to forget is it has deconate in it, that stays in your system for 21 days. After a sust cycle you have to wait 3 weeks to start pct. If you give advice, study the product you give advice about.
Sust is my go to for adding mass but your right it needs to be dosed rod at a min I do mine ed it's how I've always ran it and for me my body responds best this way
No disrespect intended but you should head your own advice you are wrong and do not understand how sust works and was designed and anything that applys to the trt world can translate to cycling... in this case Clayton was correct and you are giving the terrible advice my friend alot of misinformation in your statement visit the forum i set up for you the idea that you need to pin more often with sust is complete broscience
When you get a chance, look up actual hrt and trt forums and see what the doctors and users have said about using sust and why its not used anymore or very rarely for hrt. If you keep getting your info from other aas forums you will keep getting broscience answers. Thats another place I get my information from, My endocronoligist has patients flying in from all parts of the USA to see him, my visits are double the cost of a crackpot.
Your right you got alot more cycling expereince than i do and the awnsers are not always straight foward ... as always i appreciate the heated debates on here and you know your my buddy on here so wasnt trying to be a knuckle head. Id like to do some more research and pull bloods cruising on the sust but not to disprove anyone just to expand on what we already know.
Anyways i had to stir it up on here haha
Respect
Thats what we miss here sometimes, actual open minded debates with a sprinkle of cynisism lol.
..
My friend, while terrible advice may be an opinion in your and others minds, im simply stating what has suited me. In fact I believe I wrote sust was made for hrt. I have never had an issue using sust the same exact way I've used enanthate. My bloods were extremely elevated regardless of the fact, 5-6 weeks after starting. In fact my last run with sust was excellent. I dosed twice per week and my gains were comparable to using any long estered testosterone at equal dosing (maybe mine was extremely overdosed, every time, which may be the absolute reason?) This advice given by me may not be the conventional way of using it. In fact I believe I made a point to generalize sust is able to be used in any scenario depending upon his preference. My experiences are first hand, not what I've read online. If it worked for me just fine then I fail to see why others aside from me use it twice per week and do fine with it. This talk of E2 going insane with all the spikes and such are based on studies and charts etc which are backed by science, but we are not running sust how they base their studies on. In fact I'd say 80% of the people using a test base are utilizing an AI which makes these spikes irrelevant imo. This may be off topic, but this business of people using orals as preworkout''s dosing them as they please, with no consistency, hormonal spikes everywhere, etc just interchanging whatever drug they have on hand that day seems almost in line with my ideation on sust. That practice seems acceptable so why would a not so conventional way be written off so fast? I would guess that over the time utilizing sustanon at 2 doses per week that there is a certain compounding effect so to speak that saturates blood levels to the peak mine are around week 6 of a blood draw. Btw, I'm not trying to argue with any members as this is not my intent. I am simply giving him first hand experience of my use. If anything I said is off and makes no sense then fr me and let's have a discussion. I love this type of discussion, that's why we are on eroids is it not? My thought can be wrong in yall's eyes, but have you tried it? In fact I'm open to trying your way as well. I respect your opinions, but telling me I am wrong or giving terrible advice is irrelevant unless you've tried it.
Also I thought that the decanoate ester goes without saying. As with any cycle you have to plan your pct on the longest ester.
Well said and dont second guess yourself because thats how misinformatuon and broscience gets spread. I think you deserve lvl 1 for always helping out on here personally well done
Long winded as hell but well done
Im on trt, when I moved I got a new endo and he is the best in my state. I travel 2 hours to see him. I personally asked about using sustanon and he said I would have to inject it every 3 days to stay stable and then said my numbers would get too high with deconate. This doc has me on 150 a week and he has me do it every 6 days to stay stable. You can inject any way you like but do it your way and get bloods done so you can see how the spikes affect both levels.
HK1911Sustanon life is 12 to 15 days. Do to the longest easter is test decanote
just read what you guys are saying and i hate to disagree with you but your endo is wrong and doesnt understand sustanon.
Fair enough. Well stated and I appreciate your input. You may have just saved me from a whole lot of hormonal bs down the road. Truly, I appreciate it and will do so when I run sust again. Fr sent so I can update you when it happens
I completely disagree. Sust has prop and phenylprop esters both which are short. Phenylprop and prop in my opinion should be no less than every other day. Phenylprop could stretch to every 3rd day. At minimum I will run Sust M/W/F. If your only pinning twice a week why even run Sust? Stick with enanthate or cyp and keep your levels much more steady. The spikes and lows with prop and pp aren't worth the instability if only pinning twice a week. It's all about consistent levels. Spikes in test can cause spikes in e2. Take a look at half life charts. You'll see what I mean.
Wrong you dont understand sustanon or the action of the different esters
https://www.eroids.com/forum/general/over-40-trt/sustanon-your-doing-it-...
I'm not gonna get into a pissing match but I base my advise to people on personal experience nit what I read or parrot from eroids and other sites. I pull bloods on a very regular sometimes bi weekly basis. For me PERSONALLY, my E2 levels get way out of whack on sustanon when I inject any less than m/w/f. I'm gyno prone and do not care to have these issues simply because I want to take advantage of a longer ester like deconate. If you are comfortable injecting once or twice a week by all means have at it. Don't assume I don't understand how esters work or the effect they have on my body or my levels. As I stated in my post, "I" disagree with a twice a week pinning schedule I did not debate science or say it wasn't possible. Let me go further, In regards to the phenylprop ester, I have personally used this in a twice a week schedule which everyone would say is wrong. But, it works for me. I like a low dose npp with a test c or e cycle. Is it wrong in many opinions? Absolutely. Does it work for me? Absolutely. Again, I stated how I like to use sustanon. I'm sure you have your opinions on different chems as well.
Why did that even come up ? You sound a little defensive of all the comments yours is the only one containing something like this
You are basing what works for you to tell someone else what works for them is wrong ... you see the hypocrisy there ?
I understand you mention your e2 levels (higher levels if aromatisation could be due to higher levels of test not necassarily unstable blood levels) but how were your test levels on m/w/f compared to twice a week ?
Unless i see bloods showing why sust should be dosed eod as opposed to once a week or e11d im not buying it guys are dosing sust like they are running test prop then claiming thats the rule instead of the exception..
Not defensive bud, just not gonna argue what has always worked for me. Didn't mean it that way at all. I'm sure you are a personal experience kinda guy as well, anyone with any experience with anabolics has to be, because what works for one doesn't always work for the next guy. I do disagree with the 11 day protocol. I see the theory but it just doesn't make sense. For me the e2 is all about the spikes. I love short esters, but I have to be sure I am consistent and have the right ai on hand when I run test prop or pp or ace. I learned the hard way early on! I definitely respect an intelligent debate and I saw.your forum. It's good information, however, for me it doesn't work. Even when I explored trt through my doc he was dosing me at 200 every 2 weeks. It was a disaster. Thanks for the response and the forum. Alot of good information. Fr sent.
Fr sent good well thought response my friend i cant argue with that i can from time to time come across knucklehead totally not my intention i like expanding on what we already know on here and contributing bloods and like you said nothing beats experience and with sust its self my exp is a bit limited i will admit.
I beem researching test deconate and some different protocols with sust for a future low test high primo cycle im going to try and keep the amount of oil im pinning to a minimum likely using some linger esters.
We will have it all down to a science one of these days XD
I actually just hit your forum. I may be mistaken but I think the old Omnadren had an extra caproate ester along with the isocaproate. It's funny, when u look at the science it makes perfect sense. I wonder why it's not a more popular option when it comes to trt? But as we know, science is ever changing, like bodybuilding. One week an exercise is the best way to build mass, the next it's gonna cause you to be crippled! Haha, have a good evening my man!
Rustyhooker^^^^eod no breaks minimum. Or stick to enth
https://www.eroids.com/forum/general/over-40-trt/sustanon-your-doing-it-...
more info to be added later
As each ester of sust drops off the next is designed to pick up ... sust is designed to be pin a higher dosage but less frequently than cyp or enth it is a commonly misunderstood , misprescribed in the U S. and the idea that you have to pin ed or eod for steady bloods is a myth. Not its design at all its design is to be pinned 11 to 15 days
@Jayzgainz thanks for the response bro. Thats what i was thinking of doing, stick with my normal doses and start with the longs and taper down on the shorts. And then come off the shorts after 4 weeks. Awesome bro nice to know it was a nice smooth transition.. Thanks again bro!
Pack landed, 3 days T/A. Thanks RP4U. I'll post some pics later when I figure out how to make my pic size not eclipse the site ability to upload it (not super tech savvy.....)
What's up guys I have a question, what is a good way to make the switch from short to long esters. Would it be to taper down weekly on the short and start introducing the long until about the 4th week and then discontinue the short after week 4? Thanks
I did a test prop kickstart to a test e cycle. Began regular dosing of test e right away also began test prop eod 100mg did this for 2 weeks. 3rd week went to 75 mg and 4th to 50mg then dropped it. I had a good transition with this I did not notice any major change in how i felt. Hope this helps
RAW's Sustanon is by far the best product I've ever tried from an online source. Stuff has to be overdosed. Preloading sust for three weeks then adding in NPP for a bulk cycle. Thanks Raw for the great gear and customer service.
First order on here 9/8 donated 9/9 landed very well packed nice tight and right on 9/13 with 3 talks extanged and only because I ask for Cialis and was unavailable. 3rd talk was GOTCHA. No need for anymore. Didn't bother. Stoked to try this shit. Wish I woulda ordered 30 not 11 presents but what can ya do. Can't say much about quality but looks great and Npp smells strong as fuck regrets on not ordering atleast 10 of those fuckers alone
The npp smells good huh. Nice. Send me some so i can smell it please.
Well ya bro I booty bump all my gear then take a big fat smell. All the birches love it