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  • Edit Puretropin Grey Tops IGF-1 Results plus some others

  • Dacky   •   Sat, Mar 2nd, '19 06:58   •   21 replies, 735 views

NOTE: Simple Mass Spectrometry is not enough to determine dosage and purity of tested substance.
Tests done with GC/MS, LC/MS/MS or HPLC methodes are considered much more reliable!

Sources: [1, 2, 3, 4, 5]
            

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Description

Please bare with me guys this is going to be a long and involved post but hopefully interesting nonetheless.

First my current protocol:

  • 10iu GH (Puretropin Grey Tops) x 4 day per week split and 3iu single dose on the other 3 day
  • Test E 900mg per week (DP Pharma from Euroking - old promo of 5 vials which I never posted blood work for)
  • Deca 600mg per week (Dimension labs from Supreme)
  • 50mg Proviron (Krotos from British)
  • 25mg Exemestane (Krotos from British then switched to Pfizer from Supreme)
  • 50mcg IGF-1 LR3 (Magnus from Supreme)
  • 25mg Anadrol tabs morning and evening except on workout days when evening dose is replaced with 37.5mg injectable anadrol pre workout (non eroids source)
  • 50mg Test Base in oil pre workout (PC from MuscleDevelop)

So I decided to check IGF-1 levels given the protocol above and that I had previously tested this GH at 3.75iu per day and returned an excellent result of 458 ng/ml. Anyone who does blood testing in the UK will know that IGF-1 testing is very expensive and quite difficult. There was effectively only one lab that could test it and the lab I used would outsource the testing to this service. They however decided to invest in their own iummunoassay based analyser and so when I went to test this time they used their new analyser at a significantly reduced cost. Sounds good so far!

However when the tests came back - look at the first picture - you will see that IGF-1 cam back pretty low at 271.1 ng/ml. On the surface this would seem very disappointing and it was. It was also pretty weird as I knew I was on quality GH as I had all the typical side effects as well pretty compelling results. Also worthwhile noting that my baseline IGF-1 is 297 ng/ml. A few other stand outs from this batch of tests:

  • DP Test E is looking really good. This converts to 8621 ng/dl
  • Estrodial was pretty high so it doesn't look like the Krotos exemestane is properly dosed
  • Prolactin is raised - not high enough for me to be worried or tio take a DA and consistent with the raised estrodial
  • SHBG is well low and so the Krotos Proviron is spot on

So given all this and in agreement with the lab we decided to test IGF-1 again a week later (Wednesday this week) as well as estrodial and for Heterophile antibodies which in my research were known to cause interference with both IGF-1 (false lows) and estrodial (false highs) with immunoassay based tests. The IGF-1 tests would be done on the new analyser as well as sent off the the lab service historically used. I also switched from the Krotos exemestane to the Pfizer exemestane. I kept Ironlion updated throughout this process and he encouraged me to proceed and to post the results regardless of the outcome.

Results are in pics 2 and 3. Here is the summary:

  • IGF-1 on the new analyser returned a similarly low for the protocol but slightly better number at 321 ng/ml
  • Estrodial had dropped all the way to where I would expect it to be given doses of test and deca and running 25mg of exemestane
  • Heterophile antibodies were negative so ruling out any interference from these on IGF-1 and esrtodial immunoassays
  • IGF-1 on the historically used analyser returned an expected high number of 597.7 ng/ml (converted) proving that the Puretropin GH is as expected an excellent product

So the question remains as to what is causing the interference with the new analyser my lab was using but not for the historically used one. The truth is I don't know the answer but I do have some suspicions. You may have seen some other recent and relatively disappointing IGF-1 results for another well known and respected lab which I can't mention here due to cross posting rules.

A common theme is that we were both running Proviron (I was also running anadrol). Proviron and other DHT's have been know to reduce IGF-1 number on blood tests. We had always believed it was therefore not necessarily the best idea to run DHT's and GH a the same time due to the IGF-1 lowering effect of DHT's. I am now questioning this assumption as In believe the logic is flawed.

A more likely and logical conclusion is the DHT's are in fact causing some sort of interference with the immunoassay based IGF-1 tests generally used. This has never been researched which is not surprising as DHT drugs are hardly ever used in clinical settings.

The way around this is to always do IGF-1 Tests with a lab that does LC/MS testing and that way remove the possibility for immunoassay based interferences. This type of testing is now commercially available in the US where most of you guys are based - https://www.questdiagnostics.com/testcenter/TestDetail.action?ntc=16293 and I understand that LabsMD uses quest. Labcorp only uses immunoassay based test so keep that in mind. In the UK it is more complicated as LC/MS does not seem to be commercially available although from my research it is used in some of the major NHS research and teaching hospitals. Details on the methodology used by the historic lab service where my IGF-1 tests have always been outsourced to are not publically available and I have a question out there with my lab as to what methodology is being used. Given the size of this service (one of the largest in Europe and the largest in the UK) it may be that they are testing with LC/MS. If I get an answer to this I will update here.

I'll end my stating that Puretropin GH remains an excellent product in my view

UPDATE: The first test was run of the Maglumi/ECLIA Immunoassay and the second tests were run of this and the Diasoran XL/CLIA Immunoassay which I had been using up until now for all my IGF-1 tests

Comments

  • Carlos Danger's picture
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  • Carlos Danger
  • 6 months ago

Love this post. One of the best I’ve seen in years. Dacky you’re top shelf brother. Cheers! =)

  • growthman's picture
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  • growthman
  • 6 months ago

+1 for a badass cycle!

  • giardap's picture
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  • giardap
  • 6 months ago

Good man Dacky, rock solid testing here. Really impressive.

  • Makwa's picture
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  • Makwa
  • 6 months ago

Very interesting. Hopefully some others can help confirm this. I'll continue to run my GH with DHT based compounds whether this a testing issue or not. Primo and var with GH is way better than without so I don't get to hung up on this whole GH/DHT issue anyway.

  • Big ian's picture
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  • Big ian
  • 6 months ago

Awesome post Dacky my man, thanks very much for your time, effort and all the money you have spent on behalf of all the eroiders +2

  • Rustyhooker's picture
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  • Rustyhooker
  • 6 months ago

Wonder if analyst was new and unaware how to properly test. Too many ups n downs to be fully accurrate

  • Dacky's picture
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Don’t think that’s it. These issues with (false) low IGF-1 readings especially when running DHT’s have been happening consistently for way too long on the same immunoassay based tests for it to be coincidental human error. The answer is LC/MS!

  • Rustyhooker's picture
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  • Rustyhooker
  • 6 months ago
  • @Dacky
  • Dacky's picture
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Yes I know I have read it extensively. This is exactly my point and why LC/MS should be used.

  • Rustyhooker's picture
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  • Rustyhooker
  • 6 months ago
  • @Dacky

Was in rush bro...posted so its easy for others to see

  • stairmaster's picture
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  • stairmaster
  • 6 months ago

Much respect for your effort! Thanks bro ++

  • Bearded_muscle's picture
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  • Bearded_muscle
  • 6 months ago

Much respect from the Beard my brother.

This is why I come to eroids. No illiterate posts claiming your “homie put on 40 pounds in 3 weeks this tren stuff is fyre” REAL tried and true research pushing the limits of what we can do with our bodies and holding ourselves and our sources accountable.

I learn things everyday and look forward to applying this in my testing down the line. New batches coming out from my current fav src’s premixed line and I will be sure to use LC/MS testing on it.

  • ironlion's picture
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  • ironlion
  • 6 months ago

Hi Dacky, Thank you for your sincerity and rigor

  • fusebox's picture
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  • fusebox
  • 6 months ago

What's the lot# and exp of the test e by chance dacky?

  • Dacky's picture
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Lot: DPTE-01
Exp: 10/2019

  • herpjunkie111's picture
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  • herpjunkie111
  • 6 months ago

+1 brother, thanks for going the extra mile.

  • 333's picture
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  • 333
  • 6 months ago

+1 wish I could favorite this

  • Dacky's picture
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  • Dacky
  • 6 months ago
  • @333

Yes true - I didn’t even notice you can’t favourite pic posts. What a shame!

  • Soulja's picture
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  • Soulja
  • 6 months ago

Very interesting results and thorough explanation. I'll try to get in some bloodwork using the LC/MS method in the near future to hopefully shed some more light on this issue. I hope you are right. It's actually a pretty big deal if you are and we have been going off misconstrued results due to testing methodology this whole time +1

That's a huge difference in the test results, looking forward to finding out the historically used method over there.

  • Dacky's picture
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Yes brother. The whole time you were going through your own testing so was I but I didn’t want to say anything until I had completed my second round of testing and had done some more research. I can’t wait to see your LC/MS test results.

And yes I am sure I will get some answers out of the labs here and will let everyone know.

  • heavymetalmonsterD's picture
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  • heavymetalmonsterD
  • 6 months ago

+1brother..thanks for the well thought out post..and I'm glad your numbers came back good good man