+ 4 Pharmaqo Test P | 25mg Every day Subq Bloodwork
Hey guys, hope everyone's doing well! Just wanted to attach my latest blood work for Pharmaqo Test P at 25mg daily, SubQ injections mostly in the belly/love handle area. These results are at the trough.
I've been on this protocol for about a month and a half now, coming off my previous protocol of 35mg every other day intramuscular. It's been a pretty interesting comparison between the two troughs:
• Total Testosterone: 418 ng/dL → 827 ng/dL
• SHBG: 20 → 18 nmol/L
• Free Testosterone: 77 → 189 pg/mL
• Bioavailable Testosterone: 175 → 415 ng/dL
Overall, I feel a lot better on this protocol, much more consistent day to day. No more big energy spikes followed by crashes. The only side effect I noticed was feeling pretty tired and having a strong urge to nap about 3 hours after injection when I was doing SubQ. I switched back to insulin needles IM and that resolved it almost completely.
I'm still playing around with possibly lowering the dose to 20mg/day. Still waiting on my estradiol ultrasensitive results before making any changes.
Just wanted to share since I haven't seen many people post lab results for Pharmaqo Test P, especially on a daily TRT protocol (not cycling). I'm also considering adding Masteron down the line and will report back on that.
Happy to answer any questions
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What is the benefit of using Prop over E or Cyp for ED injections? Looking at that plotter, Prop fluctuates to a wider degree than Cyp and E. There's more overlap between doses with E and Cyp as each previous dose is still slowly releasing when the next is taken at daily injections. I don't often look into this stuff or really at all, wouldn't a "flatter" blood-level curve/stable levels be preferable? Or does it not make much a difference cause the fluctuation is in a short timeframe?
Again, undoubtable proof that Test Prop is supposed to be pinned ED for the best results.
To be clear I was talking about subq test prop.
Im test prop is def meant to be injected daily:
https://www.researchgate.net/figure/Multiple-dose-pharmacokinetics-of-te...
Sorry but you can't make this claim without having his full bloodpanel.
The most important hormone is left out testing: estrogen and maybe rbc and hemoglobin...
I suspect his e2 dipped too low on subq. The whole napping after 3 hours idk makes no sense but if he says so.
Still waiting on the estradiol ultra-sensitive results, but in the meantime, here are the other markers you requested I have no issues providing the rest of my labs also on the thread once it completes spoiler alert my triglycerides are elevated 211 and HDL is crushed to 21 used to be 28-29 on Test Cyp everything else is in range.
35mg IM EoD → 25mg Subq ED
- Red blood cell count: down from 5.72 → 5.65
- Hemoglobin: down from 17.1 (borderline) → 16.7
- Estradiol: 28 pg/mL → Waiting
No AIs, no estrogen blockers, nothing like that. Just SubQ injections of test prop.
To elaborate on what you mentioned, I actually suspect it's peaking too high a few hours post injection. I know the general consensus is that prop cleaves the ester around the 10-hour mark, but in my experience it seems to happen much faster, somewhere in that 3–5 hour window. If I pin at 9am, I'll start feeling sleepy anywhere from 12pm to 3pm, and it's been consistent for two weeks. That said, it's mostly gone away since switching to intramuscular, not entirely sure why, but it's noticeable. Was planning on getting labs done at that time to observe but cleared up once I went IM daily as of 2 days ago.
This is actually something my buddy who also started testosterone propionate has experienced as well. My suspicion is that it could be the early onset or entry phase of a test flu scenario. I've had bad experiences with this before, starting with just feeling sleepy and fatigued, and then after increasing the dosage, going into a full-blown test flu: total body fatigue, feeling sick, the whole thing.
it's something worth flagging and something I'm keeping a close eye on.
You do realize you're pinning way more subq than your im dosage right?
35mg eod im vs 25mg ed = 122,5mg im a week vs 175mg subq a week. You're using 30% more test subq, why?
Just drop the subq dose and see how you feel.
Yes, I do realize I’m pinning more sub-Q than my first recorded IM Bloodwork that is posted here. My initial trial with testosterone propionate was 35 mg every other day IM just to see how I responded based on the information I had at the time when I first started. After that, I moved to 175 mg/week sub-Q (25 mg daily) because I wanted to compare daily sub-Q vs IM under a consistent weekly dose.
I’ve actually already dropped the sub-Q the latest results are from my last day of Sub-q which is why I ran the bloodwork I mentioned . I’ve now transitioned to 25 mg daily IM, and the plan is to run labs again in about 6 weeks to see where things land to compare the difference.
The reason for the ~30% increase from my original protocol is that my initial trough labs on 35 mg EOD were on the lower side. Because of that, increasing the weekly amount seemed like a reasonable adjustment before comparing injection routes. Used Steroid Planner, Plotter and read on others labs to make the conclusion of a 30% increase which at least Subq is showing its working as expected so I have no plans to bump it up from here and going to see what IM lands me.
I’m not claiming it’s the perfect approach I know I changed 2 variables at once, but I didn’t think a 30% increase based on low troughs was unreasonable either. May this be the reason why I was drowsy? Sure It can be and probably was. I should mention everything else is perfectly fine that was literally the only "side effect" if you want to call it that.
Yeah, 100%. The information regarding testosterone propionate for TRT is very sparse. A lot of people don't share their bloodwork on the forums, and I didn't really see much on this site either. Unfortunately, I had to be my own guinea pig.
I started off with the least intrusive protocol and eventually came to the conclusion that every other day just isn't it. I watched a few Cortex Lab videos where he outlined a basic starting protocol, which is where I began. From there, I used AI and did more research and given how low my SHBG is concluded that daily injections are the way to go.
As for SubQ: it's decent, but I've noticed it doesn't work as well as intramuscular for me. With IM, my muscles look fuller, I'm less bloated, and I don't feel as many estrogen-related side effects. We'll see once I get my ultra-sensitive results back, but test prop is just 100% meant for daily use.
I'm also looking into potentially trying testosterone phenylpropionate, I actually have two vials of that already. And I'm considering purchasing testosterone isocaproate on its own to see if I can get away with every other day dosing with that ester, mainly to minimize scar tissue buildup long-term.
Like I said earlier your subq dosage is 30% higher ofcourse you're going to be more bloated...
Also subq slows test prop absorption down, so longer absorption time + higher dosage is guaranteed going to make you more bloated.
What you should have done is compare the same dosages subq vs im.
Clearer example: Imagine me doing 500mg test im, then doing 650mg test subq (30% more like you) and complain about feeling bloated and no energy. Not that hard to figure out what the problem is then right?
In case you were curious my Ultra sensitive estradiol was 44 pg/mL at trough with the subq 25mg... I am still currently doing IM 25mg with a slin needle 30g into the shoulders ill do labs here in the next week or so and compare the difference.
In the context of press1, I am talking about the last 3–4 days since switching from 25 mg daily sub-Q to 25 mg daily IM, not the earlier transition itself from 35mg to 25mg Subq. In those few days I have already lost about 2–3 pounds on the scale and look noticeably less bloated, so I do agree that sub-Q slows absorption. And as I mentioned in another comment, yes, I am aware the dosage was about 30% higher.
The reason I initially started with sub-Q was simply that I did not want to constantly poke myself and build up scar tissue again. This is TRT, not a cycle, and my goal is longevity with this protocol. I know IM works better and is generally more consistent, which is why I originally started with 35 mg EOD IM. I had no issue pinning IM every other day. However, once I realized that daily dosing tends to be more stable, I did not want to ramp up to daily IM injections right away. As someone already three years into TRT, the idea of daily IM injections sounded pretty annoying at the time.
That is why I tried 25 mg daily sub-Q with the 30% increase, based on where my initial trough levels were on 35 mg EOD IM. Fortunately, the levels seem to be in the range I was aiming for based on the limited information available online about using testosterone propionate for TRT. I am still waiting on the estradiol results, though.
Now that I have switched to 25 mg daily IM and will run labs again in about six weeks, I will be able to directly compare the sub-Q vs IM approach and see what the real differences are.
I am still working on dialing everything in, but my goal is to find a balance between compliance and carefully logging my experiences so I can share the results.
The reason why Test Prop doesn't work EOD is because the Half Life is even shorter than most of the information online about it has you believe - Pharmaqo Prop cleaves the ester off at 10 hours post injection (many of the Labs nowadays do it at 14hrs!!! It use to be 8 hrs for all) So lets say you have injected 100 mg - By the time you are at 20 hours post injection it has already lost half the hormone in circulation meaning just 50mg is left now, so by the end of the day virtually nothing is left! Then lets say you inject again at the 24 hour mark - that then takes ANOTHER 10 hours before it releases in your system again, by the time that happens the declining Prop level from the previous day has pretty much gone!! So you barely get any build up whatsoever. This is why I like to run 1 or 2 injections of Test E per week alongside it to keep Testosterone troughs up higher in between injections.
Are there psychos out there not pinning prop ED?
Ohh yeah - I've seen plenty of idiots on here recommend EOD pinning whilst using it. Even seen people recommend Phenylpropionate (NPP) to be injected every 3rd day!!! LMAO
That all used to be standard advice on here 16 years ago. Constantly evolving for the better
Was me for a bit but ED is 100% the move