+ 1 Test P/E and Var finisher
Stats:
24
6"2
211lb
8-9% bf
CURRENTLY in week 5 of second cycle:
1-4 Test P @ 100mg EOD
1-12 Test E @ 500mg week
12-17 Test P @ 100mg EOD
12-17 Anavar @ 50mg ED
AI was Arimidex 0.25mg EOD but have swapped to Aromasin 12.5mg EOD after speaking with Zewi.
PCT 3 days after last shot
Clomid 100/100/50/50 Nolvadex 40/40/20/20
First cycle was:
Week 1-12 Test E @ 500mg week
Didn't run an AI on this cycle and really regret it!
PCT as above
Now my question! Looking for some diet advice on the transition when I introduce the Var and Prop back in week 12. Really looking to harden up for summer and am eager to see what the gurus have to input. (May even leave the var out if I think I can accomplish my goals without it, less compounds the better).
CURRENTLY eating 400g protein (only count complete sources), 400-500g carbs and fats 45-50g (2 whole eggs, red meat and fish oil rest is trace) daily. I plan to stick with this "bulk" until week 12 then lean out after week 12 and take advantage of the prop and var combo.
Usually with cutting I start with ~300g protein, 300g carbs and fats from red meat. then just adjust my carbs so I lose about 1-1.5lb a week. But I've only cut naturally so never known how to approach a cut while on cycle.
Any advice is appreciated.
Thanks!
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Well..well...well...let's see here. 24 yrs old, 6'2" and currently @ 211 lbs with 8-9% BF. How long have you been smashing 400-500g carbs/day is the question? I wanna get an idea of your metabolism here...is it hard for you to put on weight? And just to mention, that if you do have a hard time, then stopping the 'bulk' on week 12 might be okay, but if not then I would suggest starting earlier.
Off cycle usually go ~300g protein, 400g carbs and just count fats from meats eggs fish oil. I know my maintenance is around 3200 cals. As soon as I started cycle 5 weeks ago I bumped protein to 400g and left carbs at 400. Now I've only just started bumping carbs to 500 just to see the muscle vs fat gains. I go by the mirror, scale and adjust if I'm seeing too much fat gain.
Weight has never been hard to put on, I just usually have to be careful not to up calories too much otherwise the fat vs muscle gain starts getting out of control..
Okay...well, maintenance at 3200 cals, you are probably taking in at least 100g of fat too. Makes sense as calories from protein = 1200, carbs = 1600 and fats would make up the difference at 400, altogether equaling 3200. Which is fine, I actually suggest taking in that amount with a ratio of 400, 300, 100...pretty standard for someone your size. Bumping protein to 400 on cycle is the right idea too, carbs are the kicker here, and the mirror is about your best tool to figure that out, you're correct.
So now the dilemma at hand is what to do to start this cut? You wanna start it at week 12 to go till week 17, right? The interesting thing is that you're running var, and a benefit is that var seems to be one of the best steroids that holds it's gains even after quitting it, lasting for weeks to months really. The hard part about all this though, is when you enter PCT..."I" often tweak my diet AGAIN to hold onto my gains. I'm not sure if the best idea is to continue on a cutter or start upping the carbs again, while dropping off the fats too. Hmmmm....alrite, something to think about here. You could try this:
1.)Week 11: start dropping carbs down 100g for 2-3 days, then another 100g for 3-4 days, so that basically within a week, you have cut your carbs in half from 400g to 200g. Now if you wanna stay at 500g(like you are currently), then drop it 125g, and then another 125g. AND, try to get your carbs in before 2-3pm!! Get the idea?
2.)Week 12: Now that the carbs are cut in half, you wanna do it again...so for 2-3 days, drop 50g, and then another 50g for 3-4 days. Now you are at 100g/day, and make sure you start taking your carbs in during the AM!! Get 'em all in as soon as you can for the best results. BREAKFAST!!...and that's it.
The trick to all this is that you don't wanna cut your carbs so quick that you're body will be scrambling looking for energy resources to burn, gotta do it gradual without sacrificing too much energy and muscle loss. At 100g carbs/day for the next several ending weeks of your cycle(Weeks 13-17 and into PCT) and you should be cut up pretty good and will continue to cut up. It's up to you if you wanna go even further into keto and see if you wanna take your carbs below 100g/day. Try things out and see how you feel...your head starts aching too much and your energy levels are in the tank and you can up your carbs a lil' bit. I think a good way to add a lil' more macro energy to the mix is to bump your healthy fats intake a lil' bit with a few extra servings of nuts and/or nut butter...gives you that good, clean and quick energy, excellent for workouts and actually improves your ability to metabolize more of your fat stores themselves!! Believe it or not, it works, LOL.
Keep taking in your 400g protein throughout until you start PCT and drop your protein intake off gradually...being that you are coming off gear, your body won't be able to metabolize all that protein anymore. Go down to your 300g/day natty routine...but keep your fats a lil' higher, as was mentioned. Whenever you think you've had enough, or have reached your goal...then bump your carb intake back up to 1g per pound of bodyweight(200+g/day), and that'll be good for maintaining and holding where your at. Have fun brother!!!!
tread-mSolid work her brother, nice lookin out!
cdaddy7Master t, SuperDBAG is mesmerizing with those diet plans, isn't he
WOW! Can't thank you enough! I didn't realise you were going to hand it to me on a platter haha. This is great, very similar to how I was going to approach it but was unsure.
One question:
Usually when cutting naturally I don't fall below 2400-2800 cals and 200g carbs(that is the lowest I've been!), this is so I only lose 1-1.5lb week max and retain my muscle and workout intensity. Now obviously because my carbs will be at 100g a day, should I be worried if say I lose more than 2+lb a week? Obviously lower calories/carbs are possible when AAS are introduced into the mix?
Also not sure if you made an error on my fat intake? 100g fats = 900 calories, which would put me at around 3700 cals off cycle. I usually only get 50g(450cals) MAX off cycle (1200+1600+450=3250), just because I found my body stays leaner with high carb low fat.
Hahaha....LMAO!!...well, of course it's gonna be served on a platter...wouldn't have it any other way!!!....AND yeah, sorry about that last night. I did make an error on your fat calories, it would be 900 cals, bringing your total to around 3700. I was falling asleep writing that shit last night, I was pretty tired. My fault...I just realized this, this morning and had to correct that.
As far as you being concerned about going below 200 carbs, well that's up to you. Maybe try it and if you don't like it then bump it to 150 instead of 100? You'll be able to judge like you said depending on how you feel, workout intensity, etc.....and also if you think you're losing too much quality mass and not fat.
tread-mWell brother you asked me to come look at this and frankly I love the advice above. I would actually likely bring my carbs lower quicker, as in 50 breakfast done and drive protein up to carb compensate but with your metabolism and his advice I'd say you have a prettty nice fit there above, I do like his energy crash solution with carbs as well. My big question might be, if trying to drive weight up over time here and you don't have any comps or shoots mags etc, why do the hard cut at all. Maybe some mild cutting in the end is it and ride those gains clean as possible to next cycle and climb. Just a thought given your metabolism is likely keeping you in shape with good diet and a hard cut seems less needed than just "in shape" if that makes sense.
Thanks brother. Yeah you do bring up some great questions to ponder over.. Only reason was because my cycle ends right into summer, and I always lean out for beach weather anyways. Just thought i'd try something new. You are right though with regards to the hard cut. I wasn't planning on doing something like a keto diet just because I don't want to risk potentially sacrificing some muscle for less bf. To be honest I am very surprised at how lean I am staying on 500g carbs a day. So I may find that when I drop my carbs, I may lean out too quick. All trial and error for me though. Thanks for stopping in!
cdaddy7Magnificent SuperDBAG, thats exactly y u the man +1 bro love
cdaddy7Lookie here, I told aussiedan aboutyou about u being the guru diet master in my post below...Glad u showed up to help bro
Yeah, I looked him up and sent him a FR straight away lol
cdaddy7He's the man Aussiedan, don't let him down play it...Let him fix you up and dial your diet in bro
C'mon man...stop it, lol. You guys know just as much as me, if not more. I ALWAYS see you guys give good advice on dieting, that post you wrote was pretty good man.
cdaddy7Thanks SuperDBAG but I heard it a lot you were the man with the diet plan and I will be getting wuth you to work on mine some soon for my next cycle
Could have ran the var 8-14 with prop taper on Weeks 13-14. Why extend it like this?
Yeah that was my original idea but zewi suggested the cycle I outlined. I don't mind either cycle. I think both will get me close to where I want to be.
Zewis good. It'll help the final cut.
cdaddy7Go for it bro, I think It's a good lil cycle plan and if Zewi wrote it then It's money
cdaddy7He's still got time bc he's in week 5 so maybe he will listen up
I am open to any and all suggestions. Please fire away
cdaddy7I like what they said now put my diet in the mix and ur g2g
cdaddy7Nice brainstorm brothers!!!!
zewiso he gets a 2 for 1 cycle.
Ahh....
cdaddy7With your BF% so low I think the var would def benefit you...You may have to tweak a little because some say 60mg - 80mg is the sweet spot, but everyone is different. Go with the low dose and work your way up is the best...I got a good diet plan AusDan, that will make that cycle a monster growth one. Check out my link it in weight loss but my diets are for cutting and bulking:
http://www.eroids.com/forum/training-nutrition-diet/weight-loss/nurition...
Also, another good vet to try is SuperDBAG, he has lots of mastermind in diet/nutrition
I've had a quick read through, but will study it carefully tomorrow morning. I see for cutting you do a keto diet. How does that effect your workout performance? I've always kept my fats low and carbs high from following everything by Chris Aceto. Only thing that worries me about the keto, is transitioning from 400-500g carbs a day to ~50g.
cdaddy7It's tough bro at first but after a little bit there's not that much difference...the hardest part is u lose energy levels for a bit and then it returns...and your mouth excessively drools when you pass by places like taco bell but you must be strong like bear and endure it....the results are worth the sacrifice