+ 2 NPP, DBOL, TEST C cycle
Long time lurker but new to posting. I was wondering if I could get some advice for my next cycle? A little history on cycles; I've ran 2 cycles previously. My first cycle was a test only cycle of 500/mg a week of test c for 16 weeks. My second cycle was a test c and anadrol cycle. My second cycle was 500/MG a week of test c and 50/MG of anadrol daily. Both went well had to manage estrogen with an ai during both cycles. Through my research npp has a bit of mixed reviews when it comes to dosing. Some say higher test works well and some say higher npp than test works well. I'm aware it's all up to how your body handles everything but since this is my first 19-nor compound id really like to get some advice. I was thinking of running the cycle as such:
50mg of dbol daily (split dosing 25mg morning and 25mg evening) for the first 4 weeks
300mg testc weekly(Monday/Thursday)
150mg npp weekly (Mon./Wed./Fri.)
50mg npp each day
Thinking of running the npp and test for 12-16 weeks.
I do have caber on hand as well as my AI.
Im 29 160pounds standing at 5'9 (if that information helps any)
Wanting to run this as a bulking cycle for steady gains to bulk up my stature. Wanting to get as close to 180+ by spring time next year if possible. Im a decent eater I typically eat 2500-2800 calories daily but would be bumping the calories up to closer to 3000-3200 daily during cycle. Thank yall in advance for the guidance if any further information is needed id be happy to add to it.
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Im 29 160pounds standing at 5'9 (if that information helps any)
Thats not gear worthy. You gotta be trolling hard again
What do you mean by gear worthy? If you've read further into the post you'd see where I've come from and where im at now. Not all of us are mutants. Some of us have to work hard to get any kind of weight behind us. I started my natural lifting journey at 115 pounds and got up to 150 naturally and with the help of a little test I've gained another 10 pounds. I wouldn't have sat here on a forum amd wrote a short story just for fun. Some struggle with weight loss and some struggle with weight gain. May not be ideal to some people but at least im on my journey instead of the opposite of most who just sit and rot.
There is a pretty easy way to determine whether you should run Dianabol or not, if you are purely after getting stronger and bigger and don't mind looking a bit puffy in the process then its Brilliant and fun to use - If you are more concerned with Bodyfat % and how much daily water retention you have in the mirror and don't really care what weight you are moving then I'd stay clear of it. Most guys go for Anavar as it will keep you looking good and depending what dose you run - it can make you stronger too when paired with creatine as it increases storage levels well within muscle cells.
The only stack/combo that Ive EVER had gyno flair ups with, is Test, Deca(npp) and dbol. I can run high high doses of all of those by themselves, but when I put those 3 together, my nips get sensitive/rashy. I get all the symptoms of someone aboit to have gyno flare ups. For what its worth. Thats my experiemce with those 3. Everyone is different.
Ill definitely keep an eye out on the sensitive nips. If symptoms do accure ill drop the dbol and save it for another cycle and just focus on the npp and test cycle.
You’re gonna love how dbol makes you feel (hopefully) but i would not start at 50 a day. Theres no way i could eat properly to grow on 50mg a day. This cycle is a recipe for gyno for certain individuals but i personally wouldn’t give a shit bc I’ve had gyno surgery. It may or may not be an estrogen bomb for you. You’re gonna hate it if you keep yo yo ing your estrogen up and down with AIs the whole time though. Only one way to find out if it works for you
I appreciate the input ill definitely drop it down to 25 mg and see how that goes hopefully I won't be yo yoing around with my estrogen and be able to keep everything under control and have a relatively clean cycle
Just take it slow. I am a larger guy & have some biological issues where my body doesn't aromatize like others & have a tendency to do things different than others...
A mentioned elsewhere, masteron is a good addition. If you can manage it, pin each compound daily at 50mg each. I am not sure if you have taken much dbol (I use it in about every phase of PED use) even 5mg PWO & 5mg before bed will yield solid results. If you don't want to chance anything, you could use prop as an ED protocol & shorten this up to a very nice 10 week run.
This would be my first cycle with dbol as well as npp. So mast would be used to just mitigate the sides from the dbol and npp from what im reading from previous mentions?
I read you purchased 25mg gel caps... I would not use them if you haven't taken it before. I have used a lot of dianabol over the past 10 plus years. Good dianabol at that dose will make you extremely loopy with a virgin palate or at least that's been my experience.
I think the masteron is still a good addition even with just NPP. It has become part of my trinity. The older I get, the more I just stick with what's comfortable (test/nandrolone/mast). Diet will dictate the rest.
Would you mind elaborating on the loopy feeling? I've read up on it a bit but mostly just seen possible nausea and a few other symptoms but Curious about the loopy ordeal.
Faint and light headed from blood pressure spike. It’s not a pleasant experience.
I'll definitely take that onto consideration since im out in the field a bunch with the job I have.
This is a very high dosage of Dbol. I would advise you to take a maximum of 10 mg of Dbol and only on training days.
Is this serious or a troll comment lmao
If you want to build mass from the dbol, best to take it consistently ED dosed throughout the day in accordance with half life, ED. No reason to only take it on training days unless you are using it as a pre-workout.
Before making claims about half-lives and such, you need to try it yourself and see. Dbol is in a league of its own—no pre-workout supplement even comes close. If you take 50mg a day for a month, you’ll end up needing a liver detox, and you’ll look like a piece of shit for the next month. On the other hand, at 5–10mg a day, you could stay on a cycle for six months or longer and look fantastic.
The half-life of dbol isn't a claim it's a fact. You are the one making claims and generalizations about dosing that may apply to you but certainly not to everyone else.
I wasn’t disputing the half-life! You didn’t understand a damn thing!
Dbol has its place... I agree with lowering the dose, but popping even 5mg before bed does wonders for nutrient partition.
Looks like a nice wet cycle to me. For bulking I would aim for 20-24 weeks with the test / npp. It takes a long time to build lean muscle... And I'd consider nolva or mast to avoid gyno when running the dbol.
I was using novla to prevent gyno for a while but hated the fact that it lowers igf to a potentially very high degree. I switched to mast and it seems to prevent gyno just as well as novla for me which I am thrilled about.
Edit: just saw your stats, 18% bodyfat? You should not be bulking yet brother. I'd wager if you think you're 18% it's probably closer to mid 20s. Bulking shouldn't start until approx 12% imo
Thank you for the advice ill definitely look into mast and see how that goes with the cycle I definitely don't want any irreversible gyno and end up having to have surgery for it. If managed correctly running a wet cycle shouldn't be to bad to fix afterwards? I was planning on bulking for this winter and then going on a cut phase to show more of the definition after this cycle and get ready for summer. Lowering cals, eating cleaner by limiting fat intake as much as possible.
A wet cycle is great if you are already lean (12% and below).
I know that it seems like winter = bulking time. But the season is not what determines whether we should be bulking or cutting. Only our body composition determines this.
If you do the work and cut to 12% you have a lot of room to grow. You will gain some fat in a caloric surplus, so going from 12% to 18% over let's say 24 weeks - while adding slabs of real lean muscle mass sets you up perfectly to transition into a cut once bulk is finished.
Now compare that to starting a bulk at 18% bf, you don't really have that room to add more body fat in the bulk. You'd likely get into the mid 20s and be a fat fuck which will require a much more extensive cutting cycle to follow.
A little more back story on myself and why I was leaning towards this bulk which just so happened to line up with the winter months. I've been a lanky little fuck my whole life. I was 115 pounds skin and bones for most of my life up until I started getting into the gym religiously and eating better because of it around the age of 25. And now at 29 im up to 160. The only area I say i truly have much gat on me at all is my lower stomach area but can still mostly see my six pack it's just not as defined as it was when I was a tiny fuck. I really do appreciate the information being given thank you tremendously.
Right on brother, great work adding some size. At the end of the day it's your body and your protocol.
I just think chewing some glass and getting down to that 12% range will put you in the best possible position for an epic bulk.
I am kind of in the same boat. I've cut down from high 30s in May, above 260 lbs, to 14-15% today sitting at 209 lbs. I want nothing more than to commence my growth phase, but I know I need to have the patience to shed this final 15 lbs before I can do so.
Thank you man I've been working hard on it. The first few years of trying to gain size I just ate everything in site with no care as to what happened because I was tired of being a string bean. But now that im experimenting with cycles I've definitely taken my diet into more consideration. I can definitely shed some body fat before going into it if it'll end up doing me better in the long run. Its easier for me to loose the weight than adding it unfortunately. So getting closer to that 12-15% shouldn't be too too tasking but with the holidays coming up may be longer than I want lmao. Thank you again for all the guidance man I really do appreciate the hell out of it. If there's anymore information you think I should take into consideration by all means please feel free to let me know the more information the better especially when it comes to this sort of thing in my opinion.
I wouldn’t run dbol with a 19nor personally
Can you elaborate on why you wouldn't?
@ThaWeatherMan Dbol e2 spikes that can trigger the prolactin sides of the 19nor. Everyone’s different and this cycle could be great for you. I will say your test dose is low/moderate so that is a plus regarding potential e2/prolactin potential. I’d just have caber and ai on hand. Would recommend eq or mast (primo too if u can definitely get legit primo) for their serm like properties
Thank you for the honest response man truly appreciated. I should be able to acquire mast to help with the sides. If I do go that route what would be a good dosage to run to help mitigate the sides for the e2/prolactin. I do have caber on hand and my ai ready to go when I do start the cycle.
Because the only titties you wanna be playing with are on your lady. Methylated estradiol + progestogenic activity from nandrolone (and thus upregulating estrogenic signaling) = a very difficult situation in controlling gyno even in those not necessarily prone to gyno. That plus the higher water retention and associated BP issues because of that stronger estradiol environment.
And you said you’re fat at the moment? 17%? It would be much better if you were starting at 7-8% and even then would still be difficult. At 17% your aromatization will be substantial.
@SeeOhShow exactly
Im somewhere in between the 15-17% range when it comes to fat on me for sure. I definitely have some definition when it comes to my abs but have a little bit more fat on me than I should I suppose. Makes since though thank you for the breakdown that helps a lot with the decision making.
Currently running npp at 250mg a week and running test at 400. I've ran test at 350 with 300 Deca and never had prolactin or high e2 issues with it.
Dbol at 50mg pretty much instantly gave me high e2 even while taking Aromasin 12.5mg twice a week when paired up with the 350 test and 300 Deca cycle. That shit makes you feel great but will give you tits fast, so be careful. I personally wont run Dbol that high again as a small node of gyno started forming after only 2.5 weeks and I had to take ralox to get it to dissolve and go away.
Npp does seem to be pretty aggressive when it comes to water retention and gyno. So ill more than likely just run it at 25mg daily instead to see where that gets me. Is your current cycle of npp similar to your previous cycle when it comes to sides?
I've never gotten sides from deca or npp personally. I take p5p in the morning to help with prolactin, but its never been an issue. Dbol is really the only anabolic ive gotten sides from, but I was being a touch reckless at 50mg for my first go.
I've heard to add p5p into the supplement stack while on cycle. I'll have to get some before I run this cycle. P5P does some good while youre on npp?
Yeah it can help to limit prolactin levels from rising too much essentially helps you avoid deca dick
Thank you for the recommendation ill definitely look into it for sure.
Test+deca+dbol is vintage. It works for me, but it will turn a lot of guys into water bags with terrible blood pressure and gyno. Where’s your body fat sitting? If it is high, you will likely run into E2 issues. Keep it low, like 10-12%, and you can probably get away with this. Personally, I would throw in a DHT derivative, but since you don’t have any experience with one based on your reporting, don’t experiment with two new compounds simultaneously.
You may also want to slow down on the dbol. You may be surprised by what 10-20mg preworkout can do for you.
Body fat is a bit higher than id like it to be it's sitting at about 17% right now. Unfortunately I only have capsules when it comes to the dbol and was trying to keep a consistent dosage because splitting the capsules would be a pain. With the half life would just taking 1 25mg capsule daily before training still be okay or would I run into some sides due to higher peaks and drops?
Likely fewer sides than just going full send and doing 50mg daily. That’s a hefty dbol dose. I really liked the way dbol made me feel - almost euphoric in the afternoons, like a pumped maniac in the gym early in the morning, no sleep interruptions etc.
Are the dbol gel caps? If they are pressed pills, split with a knife or razor and just take half pre-workout and the other half 6-8 hours later. What I would not do is jump into 25mg 2x daily without first seeing how you respond to 25mg once daily if splitting the dose is unmanageable.
Yessir they are gell capsules unfortunately. I unfortunately pulled the plug on the capsules before I found a solid source for the pressed pills. I really do appreciate the advice on the 50mg. Only reason I decided on the 50 was due to the gel capsules and wanted to try and avoid any unwanted sides due to the short half life.
That there is the Eroids cycle of Champions my brother!!
How high you run your Testosterone is all down to personal preference - those of us that are Hardcore Bad M'Fuckers like to run Test at higher amounts than our NPP normally in the range of 500 to 600mg/wk, those who are still Bi-curious Virgins stick at the lower end. Which venturer are you?
Definitely not afraid to run test at higher dosages by any means. If I did bump the dosage up to 600mg test weekly should I stick to the same 2:1 ratio and bump the npp to 300mg weekly? Secondly at that dosage what would be the tell tale signs of higher prolactin? Obviously id need to get my bloods to be certain but in anyone's experience can you tell when things are a bit off?