posted Tue, 12/20/2011 - 20:49
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1-8 NPP
1-18 1-test cyp 800mg/wk
1-18 test e 500mg/wk
12-20 var 100mg ed
Probably toss in some suspension here and there in the start. Probably 2x a week.
HCG from week 1 through, aroma 12.5mg ed. Still need to get some caber.
Torem and clomid PCT. Nolva and letro on hand, may need if I decide to up my test to 750mg...
HCG messes with my nips pretty bad. I've tried 500iu 2x a week, 250iu 2x week, 125 E3d and the later seems to not cause much of an issue. Would that still be a dose worth taking or no? HCGs cheap so its not like it matters.. currently running nolva and blasting HCG at 250 EOD we'll see how it turnns out.
I hate HCG besides the fact it turns me into Peter North.
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sgtstedankoOkay, I googled it. I must say that it looks interesting. Not something I'm going to run right out & try, but certainly interesting none the less. It was developed in the mid to late 50's, and never ever produced. Not once; that I could find anyway. IMO, there has to be reasoning behind that fact! Why wouldn't anyone mass produce such a CHEAP compound to make? Looks to be a cheaper primo, with much stronger suppression than primo? I read Some even compare it to tren? Which is a fav around these parts. 1 bro even wrote "If you like Winstrol but it gives you joint pain this struff could be a good replacement". I love winny, but my knees; not so much. So def kmi... I looked and looked for actual studies on this compound & couldn't find a damn thing published bubba. The two articles that I did find were pulled about a year ago; and I couldn't read more than the intro : ( Sorry... I usually like to read actual factual data before trying anything new. Not rely on "Bro science" : ( Why not save up & run masteron instead brother? Either way brother, your mind was made up before you hopped on this fine site. & you are gonna do whatever the fuck you want. You were just looking for someone to slap your butt, and say go do it! Didn't get that did you? Do what you feel you need to do. Against most advice, mind you. Just please make sure that you're safe, and that you report back to us your findings. HAPPY JUICING; I guess. Merry Christmas & Have a happy New Year!!! WAIT : )
Thanks to sgt and tread for their educated opinions. As for everyone else.
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Dihydroboldenone
So the cycle looks like tnis as of now.
1-5 dbol 40mg ed (dbol can be used on a recomp before anyone has any input along the lines of "dats not for recomping it bloats"
1-18 DHB 800mg (so no one gets confused)
1-18 test e 500mg
12-20 var 100 (will lower if pumps are to harsh on shins during cardio...usually an issue)
AnonMy opinion is that you can do the same things with fewer compounds, shorter duration, and less stress on the system. You are pretty young although you don't give your age and if you want to continue using AAS your best bet is to keep everything simple and short. Your first cycles are the ones where you make the most gains AND need the least amount of gear to do it. As you age, and use gear, you will find that the same dosages and compounds just don't "do it" any longer. You realize too late that you blew your wad and will be struggling to keep your test levels high enough to feel "normal." Not my opinion.. that is fact. So, keep in mind Simple in this game is the key to long term success. Also, keep in mind that when you post things for public consumption and comment you cannot get upset that people don't agree and are willing to say so. Good luck with what every you choose to do. Just my .02.
sgtstedankoI agree, 100% Thanks
I know its fact. Based on the effect of long term effects on SHBG and the up regulation of androgen receptors.
I only got pissed off because I have people insulting my knowledge about these things when they, themselves have no idea what their talking about. I have read several posts by you tread and sgt and know you all know your shit. Those that don't need to sit down and hold thei opinions when they don't know what theyre talking about. 80% of these posts sound like white knights looking for some Karma, whatever that actually counts for.
AnonI'm not looking for a pissing match. My .02 is this, you look at everything, take what you can use discard the rest. Getting into verbal arguments is pointless and quite frankly unproductive. You have to realize that this is a public forum and open for anyone to comment. If you don't like a comment don't respond very simple. Good luck with your cycles. I hope what ever you choose it works out well for you.
AnonI only have one question... What is the objective of the above cycle?
Recomp. Strength and fatloss. 1test is good for seeing stead gains while still on a deficiet similar to primo.
Either bulk or cut. What is all this non sense? I'm no pro when it comes to AAS but you have a mess here.
Bulk:
Deca Durabolin 1-12
Test Cyp/E 1-12
Look at that above cycle wow simple and probably 10 times as effective as your cycle. Reconsider things, all these guys don't tell you their advice to bash you they tell you from experience and knowledge to help. Throw the 1test cyp in the trash and save the anavar for a cutter.
Have you used 1test cyp?
And 12 weeks of deca with 12 weeks of test? That sounds legit to you? You see nothing wrong with that?
Dude reread what I wrote and clean up the mess. 1test cyp is just a stupid name for M1T which is a pro hormone either go back to doing pro hormones and fuck up your insides or just use the real shit. You want to use anavar and M1T be my guest have fun pissing blood.
Time for my work out like I said before reconsider things & goodluck.
Im done with this site. Some of you have been helpful but shit like this is just retarded.
HOW IN THE ACTUAL FUCK IS DIHYDROBOLDENONE = to METHYLDIHYDROBOLDENONE? Please explain. I will actually come back to be so enlightened.
M1T is an oral and hard on you liver based on the fact that's its fucking methyl...
Why don't you go look up the chemical difference in Dbol and EQ. What your saying would mean that they are equal. The methyl addition changes the entire nature of the compound. So please tell me how DHB is a prohormone...not like ot was created and discarded for being to androgen8c for medicinal use in the 60s. Where as M1T was created recently with less data backing it.
Enlighten me.
You are missing the point dude. Why inject 24393129 steroids when all you need is 2 of them at most. Read the last sentence like 10 times maybe you will get it sooner or later. Enjoy your "cycle" bro!
If you read through thread Im dropping the NPP. That leaves 2 injectibles. Some suspesion here or there.
sgtstedanko"Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so."
- Douglas Adams
We've PMed about this.
Im dropping the NPP and I swear on my life if ANYONE can show me 1 shred of evidence (im talking a legitimate study) where liver enzymes and cholesterol is effected any more dramatically between 50mg and 100mg ill lower the var. I say this because after about 30mg its no longer dose dependant. Get your levels check at 50mg ed and then again at 100 on 2 completely different cycles. I bet you after the 4 week mark at either dose your levels will be fucked.
To be clear 8 weeks a NORMAL length for Var. 4 weeks is rediculously short.
tread-mI actually did read a study on this and hope I can find it for you. I always look back and try to follow the money o. A study as well to make sure there is nokt a conflict of interest. Such as it was funded to a University by one drug Company in order to bring down a product because they had a competing product. For now ai will give rough numbers based on memory. On doses very similar to the samples you gave , 50 and 100, at the beginning of week 5 on the lower number no significant change in enzymes had occured. At the beginning of week 5 on 100 change thought to be significant if that dose were to continue had occured. Var is actually one of the least harsh orals on the liver if ran properly and used in its intended way was used safely for a very long period of time. So based on that study and then confirmation of another similar study via a friend I always say keep the number at 50 or lower for your long stretch and only run your blast dose at 4 weeks. So let me back you up a bit on something you referred to earlier. I have no doubt you are a smart person, I have no doubt you can learn and have learned some about the things you discuss. Having said that, its not your ability to acquire information that concerns me, its what you do with the information. I just want you to be safe which means no gear until around 25. I began at 21 so I can't hammer you too hard for poor decisions because we all make them. The difference is that you are taking a poor decision and turning it into something crazy. You have shown you are smarter than that so I'm trying to spark that intelligence and back you down which you have some. If you do move forward its still test only for me and a whole lot of hard work and that includes hard work in the kitchen. We can't get past the age issue here no matter how much you know. You could have your Masters and graduated Suma already at your age and it does not turn a bad decision into a good one just because you are smart. Very smart people can do dumb things too. You can do this brother, test and hard work. I know you're gonna run gear, theres no way around that I can see, but at least do it in a way that will benefit you for many years to come and not hurt you. Test only, keep it low and work your ass off...I promise you everything you are wanting is in that advice. The time will come when the other things can be looked at but don't be too eager to get there too fast. If you ever climb Everest your best memories will be the climb, not standing up top. The journey is the goal man. I have a Fing blast every day at this and I don't give 2 shits and a whistle about tomorrow. If you're living for tomorrow man you're doin it wrong. F all those compounds, you don't get achievment out of a syringe brother, dig deep and get this done right. We're not arguing with you, we're leading you to success. And the other thing, don't look to see what all your "buddies" or the guys at the gym are doing (wrong). Lead them man don't follow, the guy in the front gets to see the edge of the cliff first and make a decision to not go off, the others just walk around hoping someone else gives a shit about them. You focus and you and if someone else is doing it wrong and trying to take you down with them, F them and everything they know and Love!
Friend request pending.
I pushed that cycle back for quite sometime. No need to run 5 months on. I really REALLY like the things I've read about 1test.
@Sgtdanko. The comparison to tren wasn't on its shut down...its to the results. At least that's the overall opion I keep hearing. Regardless im cutting it for now.
Next cycle is as follows.
1-10 prop 50mg ed
1-10 mast prop 50mg ed
5-10 winstrol 100mg ed (shin pumps dependant)
adding some TNE/Dbol blend periodically. TNE is fine taken periodically and wont throw levels off much probably just once a week on the TNE anyway. Towards the end...see if I can see single digit BF is more important than playing with TNE.
And im moving my NPP to a winter bulk.
1-11 NPP 100 e3d (might up to 150mg e3d)
1-12 TPP 125 E3d
3 weeks dbol kick start and 3 weeks dbol end.
Thats more conservative.
BTW im 21. I think at this point the threads pretty dead so feel free to add/PM me.
sgtstedankoGood to know... Just my opinion here brother; But this looks a whole lot better than that 1st one. If you insist on these... Why not at least drop the Winny down to 50 ED!? I'm, still gonna say that you are too young for these, and that you should absolutely WAIT! Show us how smart you are, by researching the perfect cycle for you. Not throwing just things together cause they look pretty... Try to have patience dude & learn from the experience of yesteryear : ( There really is no hurry. I know right now for you. Everything is about TODAY, but before you know it. Today will turn into tomorrow; tomorrow into weeks, months, and years. And years into decades. And you honestly are left with more regrets than anything else. If you're lucky enough to still be around. It truly is a blessing, just to wake up, and be able to run & workout & lift : ) Have you run these compounds before? This thread is dying because of your age, and prob the fact that you insulted a lot of people offering their knowledge, concerns & opinions to you... Have fun, get drunk, get laid. Repeat... How's that for a cycle
AnonI haven't said anything else pretty much because it has all been said by tread and yourself.. 21 is a great time to do things natty .. but I feel like we are kicking a dead horse ..
sgtstedankoYou, young lady are absolutely right. I just keep hoping; & never give up... You know me well enough by now, to know I like kicking dead things. They don't fight back, & besides it makes me feel like a real man
Tis the season for miracles after all : p
tread-mI actually did read a study on this and hope I can find it for you. I always look back and try to follow the money o. A study as well to make sure there is nokt a conflict of interest. Such as it was funded to a University by one drug Company in order to bring down a product because they had a competing product. For now ai will give rough numbers based on memory. On doses very similar to the samples you gave , 50 and 100, at the beginning of week 5 on the lower number no significant change in enzymes had occured. At the beginning of week 5 on 100 change thought to be significant if that dose were to continue had occured. Var is actually one of the least harsh orals on the liver if ran properly and used in its intended way was used safely for a very long period of time. So based on that study and then confirmation of another similar study via a friend I always say keep the number at 50 or lower for your long stretch and only run your blast dose at 4 weeks. So let me back you up a bit on something you referred to earlier. I have no doubt you are a smart person, I have no doubt you can learn and have learned some about the things you discuss. Having said that, its not your ability to acquire information that concerns me, its what you do with the information. I just want you to be safe which means no gear until around 25. I began at 21 so I can't hammer you too hard for poor decisions because we all make them. The difference is that you are taking a poor decision and turning it into something crazy. You have shown you are smarter than that so I'm trying to spark that intelligence and back you down which you have some. If you do move forward its still test only for me and a whole lot of hard work and that includes hard work in the kitchen. We can't get past the age issue here no matter how much you know. You could have your Masters and graduated Suma already at your age and it does not turn a bad decision into a good one just because you are smart. Very smart people can do dumb things too. You can do this brother, test and hard work. I know you're gonna run gear, theres no way around that I can see, but at least do it in a way that will benefit you for many years to come and not hurt you. Test only, keep it low and work your ass off...I promise you everything you are wanting is in that advice. The time will come when the other things can be looked at but don't be too eager to get there too fast. If you ever climb Everest your best memories will be the climb, not standing up top. The journey is the goal man. I have a Fing blast every day at this and I don't give 2 shits and a whistle about tomorrow. If you're living for tomorrow man you're doin it wrong. F all those compounds, you don't get achievment out of a syringe brother, dig deep and get this done right. We're not arguing with you, we're leading you to success. And the other thing, don't look to see what all your "buddies" or the guys at the gym are doing (wrong). Lead them man don't follow, the guy in the front gets to see the edge of the cliff first and make a decision to not go off, the others just walk around hoping someone else gives a shit about them. You focus and you and if someone else is doing it wrong and trying to take you down with them, F them and everything they know and Love!
sgtstedankoX2... tears in his eyes, I guess;nanananananah. Be the first, be the best, lead the way!!! Keep.It.Simple.Stupid. : )
sgtstedankoI know we have brother. You know where I stand. I made it very clear that I personally think that at your age, you should WAIT for something similar to this!!! Researching about compounds, and actually introducing to your system are two totally different things dude. That being said. I've not heard of 1testC, I've been under a rock for a long time : ) I thought that it was TEST C. I'm not doing your research for you. You are capable of doing such things yourself. I know that I probably will anyway when I get home tonight, but... You will not be swayed by anyone thinking differently than you. You my young friend have your mind made up already. Not a good thing. But, when I was your age I knew it all to. I feel this is too long of a cycle, you are too young to do this unessacerry amounts. Blah, blah, blah. Is what you heard right : ) I agree w/the var; if you've done it before, & know how it affects you personally. But the Tests, for your age is IMO outrageous brother... You have an abundance knowledge & power available to you here on THIS fine site. USE IT. WAIT! Be the turtle... Please
I agree the mg and ml id need LOOKS excessive as far as test and the 1-test are concerned. However 1-test is alot like primo as far as effecive dosing goes. 400mg will do hardly anything, 600mg will be good 800 is optimal. Som people run a gram. Considering it hold best at 200mg (while being reletively painless) that's alot of oil to do a gram+. The shutdown off 1-test wont be as severe as a deca cycle and those are usually ran 14-15 weeks.
Honestly if you wanna look into make sure you look up dihydroboldenone. Searching 1test is a bitch cuz all you get are test cycle responses... also the effect on liver weight are only in regards to the methyl form.
ELABORATE: Why are you going to run both e and c? they are so close in comparison, why not just pick 1? and then you say you might through in some test suspension and only inj 2x a week, what the hell thats like inj prop 1 time a week. It's useless, and plus your messing with your endocrine system because your blood levels will be unstable. Your young and don't know all that much about what your doing. You are one of those people that think if they take 5 different compounds that they will work together like a magic trick and make you look like arnold in one cycle. I also want to know why you are running such a long cycle. 20weeks when considering the fact that test e and c will be in your system for 2 weeks after your last pin, and then an additional 4 weeks for pct that is if you even run it properly. Thats a 24wk cycle. Just to show that simplicity works, I am running a blend of mine test p, npp, and mast p been on this for about 2.5 weeks and up 10lbs already. In my opinion you just need to take the advise that we are giving you, why did you post your cycle if you cant take the criticism? we are trying to help you, but soon enough we are going to give up trying a nd you wont receive anymore help. We dont baby people around here.
Ok...go google "1-test cyp" its isn't test cyp...they're completely different compounds just some dumbfuck prohormone company decided to give the methyl form the ingenious name Methyl 1-testosterone. Its actually Dihydroboldenone...NOT TEST CYP.
Using suspension as a preworkout is a great idea and done quite often. If you think while running over a gram that a no ester compound that clears in 8 hours (at only 100mg) is gonna throw my levels off anything drastic then I guess well need to disargee. The base clears quickly and any aromatization would be within hours of the pin since levels peak within 1.5 to 2 hours with base.
Comparing the results of a prop cycle to a cycle with esters that take weeks to reach saturation levels is silly.
I was playing with the idea of the NPP in the front end that was set in stone and im dropping it. The idea of pinning that freqquently with the 1 test being 4 ml a week is a bit much. I wasn't looking forward to the site injections anyway. Probably just kick start with dbol and as far as bloat goes ill just DWI.
TOMBE CLEAR SO I DON'T HAVE TO EXPLAIN IT FOR THE 3RD TIME IN THIS THREAD 1-TEST CYP IS NOT AN ESTERED FORM OF TESTOSTERONE
The reason I am being a taad defensive about this is because I believe the general consensus here is based on the above misconception...and agree if I was running 2 esters for 1300mg of test that'd be odd.
did not see it was 1-test cyp(which I will say have not done any research on), so I will retract that comment. But I still stand on the rest of my comments. But your young and smarter than the rest of us so do what you want. If you end up on trt it isnt my problem, but it is yours so have fun. I'm done here so enjoy your life...
tread-mBrother, you're way to young for all that shit and the complexity is somethin I might look to having ran gear off and on longer than you have been alive. We're family hear brother and lookin out for you as such. Its sounds harsh but we actually give a shit. If you absolutely insist at your age run the test only 500 cycles for 12 and proper pct. You might stand a chance of not ending up with a 100 free test natty at 30 that way. The debate is over based on your age so now you simply do what it is you do. We have seen a lot in our collecive years, this advice is solid and you will respect it or you won't. If not, you might make a great spokesperson here some day doing as I am trying to slow you waaaay down. Slow roll gets you there, not this shit bro.
The cycles I've run till now have been between 500-600mg of test with an oral. Nothing else stacked. Adding 2 new injectibles was a bit overboard and ill drop the NPP. I don't wanna do long ester Deca yet because I think we can all agree that a shut down from a 19nor is not compareable to non nandrolone derivtive. (Tren actaully breaks down into dihydronandrolone so I fit it in the nandrolone derivative catagory even though its unique unto its self.)
I kinda was planning on blast cruising eventually (read: in my mid 30s) as for now I run proper PCT with torem and clomid, HCG on cycle. Plus their already coming out with great new stuff that has pretty spectacular effect on HTPA. One of which is an opiate derivative...forget the name.
Also GnRH has promising effects jumpstarting HTPA production even in men that were considered for TRT. Its also known as triptorelin...I wouldn't use it without an endo monitoring you though nd would do my own independant research because if used incorrectly it can turn you off...not supress you...OFF.
I do understand SOME of the points brought up here and appreciate the input. I am going to continue to cycle (albeit holding off on as dramatic stacks as the one I initially proposed) as far as everyone that chimed in telling ME to research further when THEY clearly have no knowledge about the compounds I was discussing maybe they need to use the search function before forming an opinion and makeing an assumption on MY knowledge or lack there of.
tread-mOk you asked for someone to elaborate on "why this is such a bad cycle". For starters I knew from the get you were a kid. You have some knowledge and you're reading etc but he amount of reading you do does not take away the fact thatYOU ARE A KID! You will end up on trt by the time you are 30, sounds like a long time but its not. Second you won't give your age and "refuse to derail" the thread by answering questions. Third you don't want advice at all you either want to argue or just want another person who is uninformed to confirm your bad idea's. Last you said "I got a great price so I might as well throw it in". Are you serious? You allow how good of a price you get on something to decide whether or not you will end up DEAD like AEROK did here just a few weeks ago. How bout I just give you some heroine free of charge, can't beat the price right? So given the deal on it and your method of thinking you run it too huh? Go back where you came from and while you're there do some research on the proper age to BEGIN running gear for you health. I am here to help others and receive help as well as be a part of a resposible community and I simply wo't help you destroy yourself....hows that for ELABORATE?
100% agree with tread. this cycle is awful and it shows you know nothing about esters let alone how to take them. Just do some more research, and EAT bro!
It doesn't show anything about my knowledge of esters...
Because I asked if phenyl prop can be run like prop? I don't see why that's a big deal. I've never used phenyl prop. The ester weight added is minimal and prop as well as ace should be run in everyday injection to maintain blood levels... eod is acceptible but ed is optimal.
Could someone please elaborate on how the cycle is awful? Starting out with a strong anabolic and maintaing with a strong androgen and finish with a weaker anabolic ( the var).
600-800mg is the normal dose for 1 test cyp so it can't be that that dose is too high, 500mg of test is conservative and still give me adequite results so please...
ELABORATE.
tread-mI dont like anything about this cycle brother. A little tip even thougb its just the tip of the iceburg, var at 100 for 8 weeks will change liver enzymes at the beginning of week 5 so I'm 50 for 4 and 100 for 4 or 50 longer and 100 for 4. Still don't like the cycle thougb so I won't go deeper. You say you don't want the thread derailed but to offer cycle experience is standard protocol if you want personal advice. It is irresponsible of us to offer advice witbhout full disclosure of age ,stats and experience. Your age is relevant regardless of how long you have been planning your cycle.
I didn't even look at the dose or length of the var. Yeah I cant agree with that at all bro, that's overkill any way you look at it in my opinion
8 weeks at 100mg isn't that high. High end of normal normal yeah. Ill probably lower just cuz the pumps will be unbearable lol.
Just got off 10 weeks of winstrol @ 50mg. I haven't had blood done recently but no doubt its taken it toll. I run NAC and ALA year round but really up the doses for oral cycles.
its pretty high, unnecessary unless your competing or something.why put your body through that...10 weeks of winstrol???? no use being big bro if your dead in 20 years. Have some bloodwork done.
Stats bro?..huh, never heard of 1-test cyp. I would run some prop in the beginning with that npp, while your waiting for your long estered test to kick in.
6'1 245lbs unsure on BF atm.
Im alot younger and newer to this than ill admit but this has been planned for sometime now. Curious on the NPP though...what's the best dosing schedule? I know the phenyl adds a bit of length to the ester but not sure if its enough to make ED pinning less benficial.
sgtstedankoOK brother, you've peaked my curiosity. If I don't ask, I'm sure somebody else will. You'll get a lot more help, from experienced members of this board, if you so want it. If you give info... How many prev cycles, AGE{most importantly} yada, yada, yada, blah, blah, blah? I have nothing to offer you here. Your cycle looks like 2 of mine : )
Friend request sent. We'll PM about it. I know the stigmas that lie in those answers and I wont let this thread be derailed.
sgtstedankoOK... Honestly, you'll probably get that from me brother. I'm always one of the guys on here saying wait, etc...
X2
How much NPP will you be running?
100mg eod or 50mg ed...
In my other reply I bring up my curiousity about the phenyl props actual ester length.
I know tren ace is best dosed ed but if phenyl really pushes the ester back ill go EOD. Some ppl have even said E3D but that just sounds wrong.
100mg eod is fine bro. 1300mg??? That a lot of test though. I'm assuming u have some cycles under your belt and have had your test that high before?
1test cyp isn't actually testosterone. Its DHB (dihydroboldenone). It got the name 1test when they sold the methyl for as M1T or metyl 1 testosterone. EQ actually converts at a very small level to DHB. DHB is more androgenic than DHT. Im still uncertain what to expect for my hair line. DHT hasn't had an effect on it but some people I've talked to have run mast at 800mg and never had an issue but ran DHB at 800 and shed like mad. Also said its the best their muscle ever looked though... not a fair trade IMO! I love my hair haha
sgtstedanko:o Wow, you just made my night... Thanks : ) Damn Flex; I'm assuming you've been in this game for a long, long time brother... I'll be keeping an eye on this one.
Its not as advanced as it seems. The 1tests minimum dose is 400. Its like poor mans primo. The NPP should be a nice kick start without messing with my lipids to much which has been an issue with 17aa. Plus it'll be a summer cycle so dbol, drol bloat kinda rules them out. I thought about injectible dbol but found it can be even more harsh on liver than the orals. Also unclear why injectible dbol supposedly has less bloat. Don't know why the method of delivery would effect aromatization.