+ 1 IGF-1, MGF vs. GHRP-6, CJC 1295
I was just recently turned onto the idea of peptides by our good friend in this area and throughout EROIDS...Tread(who I hope will throw his .02 in). I was hoping to get some feedback on some of the questions and issues a have. Anything would be appreciated as I continue to try and research this as much as possible.
It was recommended that while injecting GHRP-6 and CJC 1295 you should be running Test along with it. Does that same theory apply with IGF-1 and MGF? I wouldn't think so and have not come across any info that says otherwise.
Also, in regards to GHRP and CJC which are subcutaneous injection, is there any recommended sites that should be hit and how often should these type of injections be administered at what doses since I see there is a ramp up and down period. [I weigh 200lbs, 5'10, 16% BF]
Anyone ever ran IGF and/or MGF as a bridge between cycles?
Lastly...for now, anyone got a link that gives good detailed direction on reconstituting and and getting the proper mcgs per injection.
As I mentioned I am doing my own research as well for the next weeks and just looking for ANYTHING to help me along. Appreciate any help with anything to say.
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good inputs in here
GHRP's & GHRH's
Thanks bud....I actually ran into that article when you posted it in another thread which really spiked my interest along with talking to Tread leading me to ask the questions above to see what other feedback I could get. Thanks again.
@tread-m, I don't understand how you got such good gains from the peptides, are you sure it wasn't your diet and training and of course the test.
The releasing hormones and peptides just release your natty GH. The saturation dose in most studies on the GHRPs (GHRP-6, GHRP-2, Ipamorelin & Hexarelin) is defined as either 100mcg or 1mcg/kg.
What that means is that 100mcg will saturate the receptors fully, but if you add another 100mcg to that dose only 50% of that portion will be effective. If you add an additional 100mcg to that dose only about 25% will be effective. Perhaps a final 100mcg might add a little something to GH release but that is it.
Have a read around this forum the guy is a guru when it comes to peptides: http://www.datbtrue.co.uk
tread-mOh I'm sure given how long I've been at it but it wasnt gains at all. Real aware of how all the compounds react to me in terms of test ,deca, var etc , basics, after 25 years off and on cycles and now i n full blast and cruise for 2 years. So the effct I got from them occured during my 10 week period of using them and then I began to bulk again after they ended so it was a real obvious thing. What happened is that I started that combo and other than the feeling you get when hitting it, warm flush and warm face, there was really no signs for a while. Noticed I was leaning maybe week 4 but still didnt think much of it and then about week 7 or 8 it was very apparent and by week 10 I describe myself as looking like a bigger bruce lee. Just ripped all to hell, abs blown up and could see all the striations everywhere...ripped! Then of course on same diet begn bulking back up quick. I didnt really like it at first because I like top heavy bulky look and that took on more of a look you see with a real lean athlete. It grew on me and enjoyed it but not the look I want all the time. No question at all though it was the peps, just been doing this too long and know my body too well. I would think it hard to gain in terms of net weight on the combo. Could gain in terms of muscle ratio but it seemed to pull all the non quality weight off and didnt seem to be any chance of getting it back. To gain actual net weight I would think diet would have to be huge. Mine was already very big but I'm talking way big diet. Ik think there is more to be said for what all they promoted. Often we look at the direct effect of a compound and forget there are many secondary effects occuring from a hormone stabd point than we realize. Now throw in the individual genetics and habits and my guess is all of our experiences will be different or even extremely different. We will have some results from others before long as I have 2 different people I'm talking to that want to run peps by themselves and 1 with test only. So the difference in there experiences over the up coming weeks will either help confirm my experience or will be different. May all have very different but as you suggest, diet is everything so that may be the main variable in experience here. Wish more people would post up cycle runs and experiences.
@tread-m, fair enough mate, I can only hope that i get near the same results in body recomposition that you did while using the peptides, although IMO you'd have to run them for a long time so i'm thinking it was your diet but also hear you on the fact that you've been in the game a while and know aas and how your body runs.
I have a perfect diet eating just over maintenance calories and hope to be doing a leanish bulk using the peptides along side, so i hope they help me in that. I originally started using them for nagging injury....
tread-mHow did it do with your injury, did you do sight injections with it? Be sure and keep in touch with me on you run, hope it does what you like....look to about week 4 for difference and then if you have the experience I did it will be like you just step in front of the mirror towards the end and just get an all of a sudden surprise.
@tread-m, It's too early to tell how it's helping with my injuries (this is my 5th day with the peptides now)
I'm running GHRP-2 3x80mcg/day and cjc 1295 w/o DAC (MOD GRF 1-29) 80mcg3x/day.
So I'm doing subq shots. I will update here with how i'm doing and if i'm seing changes in anything.
I'd love to notice a good difference in 4 weeks, i'm not expecting alot from it so will be very happy for good changes in composition.
tread-mI would slowly staircase your peps up in mcg's each week to keep them from peaking in reaction. Does not have to be much you just want to reach saturation levels at about the time you have 3 weeks or so left in your run....for best results IMO.
@tread-m. Are you sure people aren't using cjc 1295 without DAC 3 times daily, which is actually mod grf 1-29, cjc was the company that first produce the peptides now everyone just uses the name cjc.
The DAC attachment gives it a half life of around a week i believe and withou DAC (MOD GRF 1-29) is as little as half an hour, hence jabbing it 3xdaily, which is what i am doing now along with ghrp-2.
tread-mWell and thats why I say its mostly assumed. Info I received on the product I got for example gave the cjc a week half from southernresearchco and dac not mentioned. Its worth looking into though. I. Can tell you my results with the combo we spoke of running test and pretty good diet were amazing in a 10 week cycle. I actually work on bulk and even was in that scenario and it had tren like effects without the sides and just taking longer. Now while I stay relatively lean it still reproportioned my uper body and just had an amazing look. I do think the half is correct on the cjc product with them and read in a couple places where if cjc is without dac it is mentioned given the implication. Definately look into it deeper though rather than go off of what I think.
tread-mTough to really say on the comparison type given much of this will do something different in each person. The reason for the lack of good direction is that the research companies stay tight lipped about human instruction in fear of losing their research status (my opinion). These compounds are moved legally in most cases all over the market as "research products for animal testing only" and this means if they begin human direction or human evaluation they will be subject to FDA criteria and approval. Although they would still run underground many of the big companies selling them would leave the market place and the n of course, they are motivated mainly by profit. So what has happened is that the early users built protocols of their own and then eacbh of those were tweaked as they spread from gym to gym and you get people such as myself who look at things from a conservative stand point vs those who take everything next level and soon you have what we now have, huge gaps in opinion as it pertains to dosing. Experiences in the individual peps is going to be different with each person and different depending on what other compounds were being used in conjunction and then the biggest factor in my opinion, diet. While I had a fairly good diet and ran test with the original 2 asked about here, someone else may have a very different diet and train in a different way while not running test and their experience could be so different than mine that we end up with yet another discrepancy in peptide use. There is still a lot of guess work with peps as they get bigger and bigger. If you look at a lot of the threads on the net going back to 2007 you will notice how different protocols are and then look at now. There is some stability showing up with dosing about 5 years later but even so, I know people today running cjc1295 daily and it has a half life of about a week. To clarify, some will run it at a fraction of the dose thinking there is stability in a daily dose of 1/7th the weekly need but others still running full doses daily. Some run ghrp6 3 times daily with the short half and others just once daily. I just cant give you good protocols because there are really just guesses slowly being based on experience. I can give you my specific doses I used but I will tell you its a conservative figure based on my learning the doses of people that dont run conservatively. I just tweak my dose compared to a more liberal user and slowly come up from there to eventually find my own personal sweet spot. End of the day I think diet still rules the day and depending on whether you are eating to bulk or cut or bulk and cut etc will make the experience your own. I am currently helping about 4 people start up a peptide cycle and as I get my personal protocols pulled up over the weekend and run the math I will probably post them here. They are my own good guess though on something that has a short history and no real organized human science. As to the test question, I ran gear stacked off and on for 23 ish years before becoming old enough to blast and cruise 2 years ago. What I have found for myself running test non-stop for 2 years is that everything works better with test and I have very little doubt that I would have had the same results with peps if I were not running it. I do have 2 people here about to run a cycle of peps by themselves so I am really interested to watch those results and see where they go. Hopefully I can get both of them to post their results here as it goes on. As to sights for injection, it is another thing that is all over the map. Even the subc hits for most have been used IM with good results reported and those even include sight injects to areas of injury where people claim to have incredible healing with their use and while I agree it makes perfect sense I dont have first hand knowledge of that. Things like research and animal testing scare people so I will say in my own personal opinion, I believe peps to be quites safe. They are in most cases very simple polypeptides and their magic is in the formulation as to how they are stacked. When stacked a very specific way they can promote different things to happen in the body. Such as igf-1's effect on liver output all the way up to big brother with 191 that promote actaul cell production. Having said that if they can promote things to occur in the body you have to assume if used wrong they could promote negative occurances too. I say stay conservative in your thinking and dosing and at least you have a better chance of being safe with it until more results come in. We will know things in 10 years that contradict what we know today so caution is my attitude.
Hey Tread...was thinking about running peptides [MGF, LR3IGF-1] while on PCT. Wanna know if it's something you could help me out with?? Won't be till after Jan. 01 '12 when this cycle ends.
Researching and preparing now. Can send you whatever info you like if it is something you have time for?
Lemme know. Would really appreciate any push in the right direction helping me to set up hence some of my recent posts inquiring about peptides and such. Thanks
Hey Tread I'm on my third week of IGF-lr3. A few others forums out there have suggested that IGF should have a 1:1 ratio on to off cycle of 30 days. Their reason because the receptors are overloaded (kind of like clen) therefore you are just wasting it after a certain amount of time. I was wondering if you have tried both cycling 30 days on and off or staying on for much longer. I'm curious to know what worked best for you if you had? In addition, did you go ed or eod?