+ 21 test prop taper
I've been getting so many pm about a test prop taper. So I figured I would make a forum. The prop taper was a game changer to me it made going into pct and recovery seem so much easier. I will never run another long ester cycle without incorporating a taper at the end. I'm always seen guys saying there going to start pct 14 or 15 days after there last shot of test e. Imo that's way to soon. I have another forum about this I'll post the link at the end so u can make up your own mind. Now back to the the taper the way I incorporated it was I waited one week after my last shot of test e. Then started my prop taper for three weeks. Week one I dosed 100 mgs eod. Week two 75 mgs eod and week three 50 mgs eod. This takes u take 30 days after your last shot of test e and ensures it is completely cleared the system. My pinning schedule was week one m,w,f,s. Week two t,t,s. Week three m,w,f,s.Then I waited another three days and started my pct for a total of 33 days. Now I see a lot of guys will just run 100 eod for three weeks but to me a true taper needs to taper your test down so your test levels are close to natural levels when u start pct. This pct was the easiest on my body and even my sex drive didn't take to big of a hit. Most pct my sex drives goes in the tank. I'm so sure of the taper been a better alternative than just letting your test levels drop off the charts. Iv wanted to help beginners with this idea. So I come to u as a community if we encourage guys with one or two cycle experience to do a taper is that wrong? By the end of your first cycle you have pinning experience and should have enough sites to pin eod for three weeks. I know prop can have more pip but after these guys have had pinning experience is this a bad idea? I've had countless people pm bout this so I think this needs to be discussed as a community.
https://www.eroids.com/forum/general/general-talk/pct-all-wrong
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Thanks for your concern brother. Im proud to say that I haven't had a bout of depression in a long time, counseling has helped me out a lot. Ive been going to a shrink for 5 years and I have been off meds for 2. I have a much better understanding of what I need to look for, hopefully it will be minimal.
Ok cool man, I wish u the best sincerely, the taper is probably a great option for someone with your background, just be careful, we look out for our own around here and NO ONE wants to see another member hurt. Post up a cycle log and let us follow along with you
Plus one bro love this attitude toward another member
Thanks brother that means a lot. I have my cycle up under my profile along with my precycle bloods, diet and workout split.
Great post rolltide I discussed the taper previously with you and for sure is going to be incorporated on the current cycle +1 for sharing
Awesome bro keep me informed how it goes for u
Good post RollTide. Tapering prop and other compounds work great for me as well. It's more of an older school method but it let's my system balance out more effectively. Going from a higher dose and then just abruptly dropping it causes me more sides. Kudos on the post +1
Thanks for some reason it's really an under utilized tool imo. Thanks for your comment
Nice job Roll. I think it is really up to the individual whether or not to do a prop taper. It is probably the best way to ease into PCT instead of waiting 3 weeks to let the long esters clear. For my first cycle I don't think I would have been able to do it. Did not like pinning at all so EOD pinning for 3wks would have been a huge turnoff. For some people it is no big issue so it can make their transition into PCT a little smoother. The other isssue is the pip with prop. It cripples me, so that would have been another factor keeping me from doing it back then. I finally found some prop that is nice and smooth and I have no problem pinning ED now. Unfortunately I am now a TRT patient so I don't need to deal with taper going into PCT. But I say if they can handle the pinning and the potential pip to go for it.
I was going to add that I am also TRT now but I did do it for all of my previous cycles including the first one. I am lucky prop doesn't seem to bother me much.
Ya pinning can be very daunting my first cycle I was scared but by the end of it. It didn't bother me no more
AnonJust wanted to chime in from a woman's standpoint..I know there's only a few of us
Tapers are crucial. I tapered my first prop cycle and didn't have any issues coming off. My second cycle I had to come off abruptly and had some insane high estro sides. Dealing with the side effects of testosterone were a cake walk compared to dealing with my estrogen shooting through the roof.. It was shitty.
Pale askes an interesting question what do u use and how do u combat estrogen issues?
If you don't mind could you expand on what you have to do as a woman to counter the estro sides as well as when you actually had to start fighting estro. I am going to start my wife on a very mild testp cycle so I am curious.
AnonI noticed high estro about week 3 of my first cycle, 25mg eod. Emotional, flying off the handle. Withdrawn at times and exhausted. (I have noticed that I'm extremely tired the first two weeks of each cycle, but with prop it was fairly consistent.) Sex drive through the roof at points and in the pits at others. I battled with regulating my estrogen consistently and at times suppressed it too much. It was pretty fkin miserable my first cycle. It was a difficult balance for me initially and took lots of trial and error. I did not pull labs, although I should have. I kept a detailed journal with daily food, training, sleeping patterns and moods- when I adjusted my AI I was able to track how it altered my body. I was taking aromasin on an "as-needed" basis when the sides were prevalent. My aromasin dose was too high initially (12.5) so I quartered my tabs and dropped down to 6.25. Still too much. I started using nolvadex after someone suggested it to me and found it to lower my estrogen without crashing it. My second cycle was MUCH more enjoyable until I had to stop all together. As far as the sides I experienced then, i will explain them in PM if you are curious- theres just some stuff that I'm not willing to put out for public consumption.
EDIT: I do not "pct" at all beyond tapering...
Hey not to be out of line but nolvadex does not lower estrogen it is an antagonist of the estrogen receptors by which it binds itself preventing active estrogen from binding in its place. A lot of people mistake it thinking it can work as in AI it does not reduce estrogen like arimidex , aromasin or letro , it simply blocks estrogen from action, so you can have crazy high estrogen still which will still cause issues. It is meant to boost LH levels for pct in most men so they can try to produce natural test again, some also use it to combat estro binding and becoming gyno but even then if someone is gyno prone it still might not work. If you want I can pull up some links for you. It does aide in some side effects from high estro but it by no means lowers it as it is not an aromatize inhibitor. It can help bloat from high estro , combat some sides but does nothing as far as helping bring estro levels in range whether it is a man or a woman.
Your always out of line lol but good answer plus one
AnonI responded the same way to your PM. You're never out of line. The aromasin was way too strong- I was yo-yoing like crazy. I was horrible first cycle. 2nd cycle I was running double the dose and didn't have any of the issues of the first time around. I didn't pull bloods, as I said so I don't have numbers.
The yo-yoing is from estrogen sides along with the high test sides, you just have to grin and bare it , female physique and bodybuilding is tough for women much tougher then for men , as their hormones effect their mood a lot , especially with the high test, then the estrogen getting out of whack.
This can be horrible if you try an compete as many women crash their estrogen to get onstage. I'll explain why when its that time of the month and your hormones get out of whack what happens? You get bloated , well when your estrogen gets to high you will get bloated so , if someone was telling you to run nolvadex up to a show it can cost you as far as placings are concerned as you will not be lean enough and will hold water.
As far as I know nolva will not do a damn thing to dry out out. Its a serm not an ai. But you know this. If your estrogen was 200 and yo were getting gyno and added nolva and gyno stopped your estrogen is still 200. The tamoxifen just binded to the estrogen receptors so no free floating estrogen can bind and activate the receptor and cause growth.
It helps but not like people think and really isn't noticeable for the stage, just crashing your estrogen like most do to lose the last water. I have in fact heard of people using it for preps mostly women but it does not work like crashing estrogen which will get rid of all the problems the high estrogen carries like bloat and water retention, instead many think because it merely blocks the hormone from action it will work, does not get rid of the problem it just hides some of the visible issues from high estrogen. Because it is possible if a fuck ton is used it will hinder estrogen but it would take a lot and it still is highly unlikely but many chose to think they will be the exception lol.
X2.
Yes please pm me. Thank you.
Its all good but for me personally I like pinning ED and I don't actually taper it. When test P is out of your system it is out, don't matter if it is 25mg or 50.
Let ya know I'm hav ing some glitches. Don't know if it's just me or others also. I keep trying to comment or send a pm and keep getting directed to site off line?
I am not seeing any problems with the site. Did you try it on a different browser?
No it's weird. I've commented prolly 30 plus Times tonight and three or four times it takes me to site offline page. Then I just back to previous page and refresh then good again
I would rip out your hard drive and destroy it immediately, they are on to you.
Just kidding, I have no idea.
Put your tinfoil hat on!
Lol guess it's just me then
Thanks for posting this. When I did my first cycle over ten years ago there was no pct I knew of I was just told to buy more aas. Now ten years later I did a twelve week cycle of just test e 600 mg a week and waited two weeks and did normal pct of Clomid and novlva and afterwards I felt like complete garbage it was the worst. After waiting the required time I did another test e for twelve weeks with a prop taper that I didn't taper down I just did 100mg eod for four weeks but I still didn't wait long enough going into the prop taper I felt better after but still wasn't good enough. I will definitely try next time. A lot of info here I appreciate it I agree completely from I went through.
My first cycle I had nolvadex for an ai and pct lol. I didn't even have the internet. Let's just say I did everything wrong. I'm glad there a site like this for all of us to learn from each other. Appreciate your comments
Lol I wish eroids was around ten years ago. After I did my first cycle I didn't know what to do after I went back to the same guy and he gave me some white pills I was like well he helped put on some muscle so these pills should help I don't think they did anything from what I can remember.
My first one was from the gym guy lol. How many people have had there first few cycles a disaster listening to the gym guy
Off on another drug filled rant I see!
I couldn't agree with you more. Prop tapers are really the way to go.
You asked if it's a "bad idea" to recommend this to a novice user. I think it depends on the person. That's a lot of pinning and many guys can handle it, but some can't. I think it's part of the progression of proper aas use though. I have no problem recommending this to a guy with three long ester cycles under his belt, especially if he seems like he's doing things right and trying to learn.
As for more advanced users, I think most should use it, especially coming of bigger cycles, i.e.19-nor, 14+ weeks, etc.
Why don't more guys use it? I think many just don't know the benefits of it and are just used to running their standard stuff.
Honestly I wrote a few things on so sources page and iv been flooded about questions on prop taper so figured I'd just make it a community discussion. I think this is going to be the reoccurring answer depends on the person in question
Absolutely rolltide I agree whole heartedly , prop taper is done by a ton of people no sudden crash of bloods slowly bringing them down its only logical. What I fear is many newbs don't have their proper pinning protocol down to a science , usually only one site picked out , are still mastering estro control , still100% new to all of it , I think it could go both ways , one way for simplicity anther for peak performance. I guess it would come down to the op and his mindset and work ethic to learn all that is involved.
Yeah I guess it is the up to the kind of person we're talking to. Like iron said below he did his first and had no issue but not everyone takes the time to understand and research like iron did
I agree when i would pct i would always do a prop taper. Couldnt agree more with starting pct to soon. Way before we had that discussion i had been using that calculator and it would show like 20 days if not more for test e to clear, it was 5 weeks for eq lol. Only thing is whats the reasoning behind dropping the doses? I guess thats what you mean by "taper", but personally I do it opposite, week on I'm still gonna have a ton of long estered test in my body so i would think logically it would be better to do it opposite increasing the dose as the long ester elves to keep levels consistent. But when i would do it i would just do the same dose throughout the entire bridge. Def not wrong for guys with a cycle or two to use a taper. I think its a great idea. First cycle is probably to soon, but i did it fine. But its best to complete one test only long estered cycle before moving on to a prop taper.
My reasoning on dropping the dose is so that my test levels come down in a gradual controlled fashion. By bringing my test levels to just above trt doses so when I started pct I didn't have a big drop off my test levels was right at natural levels. Iv ran shorts before for a cycle and ran prop 100 mgs eod. And at the end I had a crash going into pct. By slowly lowering my levels it really made going Into pct the easiest Pct I've experienced
RustyhookerAgree with you all the way!
I honestly feel from my own experience its totally superior way to come off cycle and into pct. I want to set people up for the best experience they can have thanks rusty
RustyhookerLast cycle was very large, went many weeks after on shorts and pct was mellow. Live and learn, glad you're teaching folks
My last cycle pct was a breeze compared to the previous ones. I know I will never run one without it