+ 1 Shredded?
Been seeing a lot of posts lately about people trying to “get shredded”, so I wanted to give my spin on things…
Saw one post where a guy was fasting until 2pm and not really consuming many calories. First and foremost, NEVER do this if you value the muscles you’re busting you ass to develop. Muscles are a metabolically active tissue in that they are capable of converting nutrients into and burning energy. Bottom line: if you don’t give the muscle the energy it needs, it’s gonna get it on its own by breaking down its own tissue.
IMO, the best way to get shredded in the fastest safest way is through careful carb manipulation – operative word being “careful.” Most people think that they just need to cut them out either completely or only eat them before lunch. Although this will work, it will not come without sacrifice to your energy levels.
The concept behind the Atkins diet was using low glycemic foods for insulin regulation. Since insulin’s primary function is to usher excess glucose into the body’s cells, it has the potential to promote the accumulation of body fat. By regulating this hormone, you’re able to disallow the fat cells from taking up any glucose for storage. Here’s a reference on the glycemic index:
http://www.glycemicindex.com/about.php
This doesn’t change the fact that the body’s desired source of energy is glucose. Since glucose will be in short supply by restricting carb intake, the body now has to synthesize glucose from other sources – proteins and fats. This process is called gluconeogenesis – gluco = glucose, neo = new, genesis = making. Because proteins and fatty acids are much more complex molecules, the conversion of these to glucose is a much more elaborate process. As a result, these “energy making processes” yields a thermogenic effect. This is why it is so effective at gearing the body to burn an increased amount of body fat.
The goal here should always be to ensure that optimum fatty acid oxidation occurs without the deamination of muscle proteins. Because proteins are much easier to convert to glucose, they become the primary fuel source when blood glucose levels are low. The best way to ensure that muscle proteins are not used for this is to ingest ample proteins every 2-3 hours. The muscle cells will only catabolize themselves as a last resort. If blood proteins are present in sufficient amounts, this occurrence can be avoided.
On a side note… the one unique characteristic that amino acids have over glucose is that they possess a nitrogen group, or amino group, in the molecular structure. In order for the gluconeogenesis process to begin, the amino groups must first be detached from the molecules. This is called de-amin-ation, which literally translates to the process of removing nitrogen. As a result, the by-product is chemically identical to the bathroom cleaner ammonia. This ammonia is toxic and must be routed to the liver to be degraded into the less toxic form of urea. Urea can then be excreted in the urine by the kidneys. This means that you need to increase the water intake when on this sort of diet to ensure proper removal of waste by-products.
My personal spin on this… I like to begin my day off with a meal that is predominately complex carbs. Because complex carbs contribute to a gradual increase in blood glucose, they do not contribute to a spike in insulin. I try to restrict my simple sugars in every meal and focus on complex carbs as much as possible. By doing so, I am able to maintain healthy energy levels and still have control over the hormone insulin – that bitch don’t move unless I tell her to move! Furthermore, I include a protein source in EVERY meal.
Until about 2 pm, the not much attention is paid to the quantities of these complex carbs, as the goal here is insulin regulation. By 2 o’clock, I have begun to taper my carb intake. Starting at 2, I restrict my carbs to the glucose capacity of the blood stream (20-25g), and I continue to make sure these carbs are complex. Remember: the harder your body has to work to meet its energy demands, the greater the thermogenic effect. A little work has to go into breaking down complex sugar molecules, so a small increase in the metabolic rate is the result. By the end of the day, the last meal will consist of ZERO carbohydrates. This helps ensure two things: 1) no additional carbs are ingested when the metabolism has begun to slow, and 2) any demand for glucose at this time can be meet thru the thermogenically induced gluconeogenesis processes.
In addition to all of this, however, I will ingest a substantial amount of simple sugars along with some fast digesting proteins post workout, whether I exercise in the AM or PM hours.
So, there ya have it: the scientifically geeked-out Dossier version of carb manipulation! ENJOY!!
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http://www.leangains.com/2011/03/intermittent-fasting-for-weight-loss.html This web site has alot of info on Intermittent Fasting. The deal is your not getting your carbs or nutrients throughout the day you just ingest them within a certain window during the day. The body isn't going to break down your muscle just because it hasn't had anything for hours that takes days. The guy who made this web site basically started the IF fad and is not that small of a dude.
Anonyeah bro, i understand the concept of IF. as far as protein deamination goes, we cannot avoid the fact that if glucose is needed by the cell and not present, proteins will be deaminated for gluconeogenesis. it really boils down to meal timing here more than anything.
not speaking in theory or opinions here. speaking in facts that have proven scientifically, as well as by myself through trial & error and body composition testing. we cannot avoid the facts brother
I should have been more clear about what I was talking about I wasn't intending to post disagreeing with what you were saying. I totally agree. More so I was talking about the comment below which said intermittent fasting is fucking retarded someone made up with no thought trying to reinvent the wheel. I definatley am not coming in to your post to try and argue I just believe fasting has its time and place.
I've been reading some of your other posts man, your very knowledgeable. Thanks for bring some valuable insight to this community. Secondly I totally agree with your opinion about IF. I'm a trainer myself and have competing once almost twice lol. I've experimented with a lot of 'diets' from modified keto , ckd, etc and honestly carb manipulation is the most effective. I suspect that many people shy away from it because its not the fastest way to drop weight. As any body builder knows the most important aspect of cutting is not fatloss but lean muscle preservation. I'm actually really glad that someone debunked the intermittent fasting fad that appears to be taking hold of the body building community. I actually did try it and lo and behold it was extremely miserable among other things...anyways man I hope people stop and read through your posts, who knows they may learn something.
Anonthanks, brother. i appreciate that. fr sent
Give them a vote if you find it helpful.PermalinkI agree fasting is fucking retarded. Intermittent fasting is just some stupid theory that doesnt work probably made up by someone trying to reinvent the wheel
AnonI hear ya. I'm not knocking it, cuz I don't even know what it is. I gave up on fitness magazines for info years ago. IMO, I don't care how you spin it - fasting is fasting and only = starvation. If I'm working my ass off, I'm gonna make damn sure I'm not spinning my wheels or going backwards, especially if I'm dropping a stack on some gear to go with it.
Well basically it is a way to get the body into better shape. It effects the metabolism and causes fat loss.
The theory behind intermittent fasting is that muscles are more "prime" to build muscle once in that state.
all int. fasting is good for is losing a little weight if you do not mind losing muscle. People just need to learn to eat right and quit making up stupid shit like intermit. fasting
also fasting is dangerous because your blood sugar levels get low, which is a risk for people who can get hypoglycemic
AnonVery true. Technically, if I were considering recommending any sort of low carb diet to a client, I would have to get a doctors consent. Some people may shake their heads at this and think its rediculous, but regardless of how the risks are perceived, you may never know the true level of health with the next man. For instance, if a person had a family history of renal problems, the excessive urea may remain unbalanced due to inadequate kidney function, or the kidneys may begin to fail.
No1i get shredded by just watching my calories and protein and when bulking i also just make sure im getting enough cals and protein i never worry about carbs n fats n shit, maybe some of you guys need this complicated stuff to get results but i sure dont
You should really post stats n pux! Every forum your cycles sound like they're awesome!
Anoni think it varies from person to person and from goal to goal, IMO. i, personally, don't do the carb manipulation route very often. only if i'm stuck at a plateau or if i'm trying to drop quick. i mainly wrote this for those that do go that route. extreme restriction of carbs can do a number on energy levels, as well as the liver and kidneys. i want people to, hopefully, know that it can be done an easier way.
The post workout spike ;). Ive been doing am and pm workouts. The morning it weights plus 70 mins cardio and night is simply 70mins cardio. So i added maybe a 1/4 cup yams at 6pm meal to avoid muscle catabolism. The morning of course is big bowl of oats so i can kill the weight stack. What you described above is very effective but can be difficult at times. Nice report!
So let me get this straight you're doing 140 minutes of cardio? That seems a little excessive man. I really don't even know how you find the time, let alone how you are able to tolerate. Unless you are some sort of endurance athlete. As a body builder though no way you should ever have to do more than 45 minutes a twice daily and even that is only in your final two weeks of prep. As a general rule 30 percent of total weight loss should be attributed to cardio the other 70 is from calorie restriction. I guess whatever works but thats enough cardio to be a part time job lol.
AnonYou should really familiarize yourself with people's stats and goals, and some facts about some physiology, before you ask retarded questions.. This nigga's on his grind and doing the damn thang!
Well first off it wasn't a question, it was a statement. Secondly I was merely making an observation. Lastly I'm fairly educated, I've only been a trainer for a short period but I've been in this game for quite some time. I know a few pros and lots of amateurs and I'm sure they would all agree 140 minutes of cardio for a bodybuilder is excessive. I wan'st knocking him if he wants to do insane amounts of cardio to help meet his goals faster than more power too him. Personally I would never recommend that much cardio to any of my clients, and I'm just shocked that he has that much time to spend in the gym. I really don't want to start a pissing contest, its obvious you guys are buds and took something I said personally which I'm sorry if it came off that way.
AnonDidn't take it personally at all. He is on a cutting cycle for one. Two he's splitting his cardio sessions. I'd agree 140 min is excessive for a single bout. He and I have visited a bit. He is very much aware of how to engage the oxidative pathways and avoid protein deamination. Trust me on this: that much cardio is not necessarily counter productive. It all boils down to intensity, duration, and several nutritional factors. Fast is one of the few I have spoken to that advocates carbs and understands the roles it plays for these goals.
Not every body builder is going for size and not everyone here is a body builder. Didn't mean to be offensive; was just making a statement as well. That is a lot of time in the gym. I go twice daily also but I rarely have time for an hour of cardio, unless cardio is the only workout for that session.
Anonalways nice to have you chime in brotha. i just switched my routine up this morning. very similar to yours. weights and light cardio in the am, and then moderate cardio in the pm (as well as abs if it's that day). if i don't eat carbs and time my meals right with my routines, i am super sluggish ALL day
But once ya get to your happy spot in bf%....its easier to maintain. The dropping/cutting is a chore. Lol
Anonfor sure
Wht ur referring to some ppl stoping eating at 2pm its intermittent fasting works for alot of ppl. Helped a buddy of mine get to 7% without muscle loss
Anonand how did you guage whether or not he lost any muscle tissue? we can't avoid the fact that if ZERO nutrients are ingested when the demand is high that the only other option the body has is its own tissues. it takes time to mobilize fatty acids for energy purpose, and it takes a great deal of effort on the body's part to break it down to glucose. this creates a problem for immediate energy demands if fats are intended to be the primary fuel source. because proteins are converted much easier, they become the primary for the meantime. so with that being known, how do you propose a zero reduction in LBM if zero nutrients are ingested?
Btw u still can get carbs on IF
Anonmisunderstood your comment. my fault
All good bro. Man it boils down to what works for u were all different
With a dexa scan two weeks prior to cut then 2 weeks into maintenance:)