Toadking's picture
Toadking
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+ 5 A-tech Primo and Test Bloods

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I’m currently running A-Tech Test and Primo at 600 mg of testosterone and 300 mg of Primo per week. Also running 60mg of NPP (for bouncy joints) all split M,W,F. I’ll be increasing to 800 mg of testosterone and 400 mg of Primo for next several weeks.

So far, everything has been going great. I’ve been feeling really good, getting some great workouts in, and I’m starting to look more defined even though my weight has only gone up a couple of pounds. I’ve been keeping an eye on my progress and bloodwork and will be sharing my labs for anyone interested.

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Storm Ayden's picture

Now I can actually read your numbers, and this is a clean panel overall but it also clears up the question you and getswole were puzzling over, so let me hit that first.
The "lower than expected test" mystery solved, and it's good news:
getswole thought your numbers seemed low, and you weren't sure why. Looking at the actual values: your total test is 2941 (on a sensitive LC/MS assay) with free test 785. That's not low at all that's genuinely high, well above range, exactly what you'd expect (arguably more) from 600mg test. So whatever made it look low compared to your ZPHC run was probably the comparison being off, not your A-Tech being underdosed. A few things worth knowing:
Your SHBG is 10 (low) and that's the key to reading this. With SHBG that low, more of your test is free/unbound, which is why your free test (785, massively over the 35-155 range) is so high relative to a "normal" ratio. So if your ZPHC bloodwork had a higher SHBG, the total numbers might have looked different even at a similar real testosterone level. The low SHBG also means you're getting strong free-hormone exposure, which fits the "feeling great, getting defined" you described.
Bottom line on the gear: 2941 total / 785 free is not underdosed A-Tech that's a strong, high reading. The worry that A-Tech was weak doesn't hold up against these numbers. So you can put that concern to rest; the gear's clearly dosing.
Your estrogen and this is actually well-controlled, impressively so:
Your E2 is 43 on the ultrasensitive LC/MS assay (range to 29), so technically just over, but here's the context that makes this genuinely good: you're running 600mg test (aromatizing) with NO mention of an AI, and your E2 is only at 43. That's the primo doing its job at 300mg, the primo's mild anti-estrogenic/non-aromatizing presence is helping keep your E2 from climbing the way 600mg test alone would push it. For a guy on 600 test with E2 at only 43 and no AI, that's well-managed, and it's a good argument for the primo. You're barely over range on the gold-standard sensitive assay that's a nice place to be, not a problem. Don't reach for an AI here; 43 is fine, and crashing it would do more harm than good.
Your prolactin on the NPP reassuring, and it answers your honeymoon question from the bloodwork side:
Prolactin is 4.2 (low-normal, range 2-18). You're running NPP at 60mg, and your prolactin is sitting low and comfortable that's genuinely reassuring. It means at 60mg, the NPP's progestogenic activity isn't elevating your prolactin at all, which is exactly why you're getting the joint benefit without progestogenic sides. This ties to your honeymoon-phase question: the low prolactin confirms 60mg is a well-tolerated dose that's not stressing the prolactin/progesterone pathway, so there's no bloodwork reason to climb. Stay at 60mg it's working (bouncy joints sorted) and your prolactin proves it's not causing trouble. The only reason to go up would be chasing more anabolic effect, which brings the prolactin risk up, so I'd hold at 60 since it's doing what you want.
The things to actually keep an eye on:
Your hematocrit is 50.0 (range to 51.1) upper end of normal, not over yet, but climbing territory on 600 test. At 50 you're fine, but this is the one to watch, especially since you're planning to increase to 800 test (more on that below) that'll push hematocrit up further. Keep hydrated, keep an eye on it, and be ready to donate if it climbs past the range. Hemoglobin 16.1 is fine.
Your sodium is 134 (just below the 135-146 range) mildly low. This is worth a small flag: mild low sodium on cycle can come from the water retention/dilution effect of the hormones, or from heavy hydration. It's only slightly under and probably not symptomatic, but keep an eye on your electrolyte balance, especially if you sweat a lot training. Not alarming at 134, just noting it.
Your AST is 42 (just over the 40 range) with ALT 41 (in range) and GGT 37 (in range, liver-specific) so your liver's basically fine. AST slightly over with ALT and GGT normal is most likely the muscle/training contribution (AST is in muscle too, and hard training raises it), not a liver problem the normal GGT is the reassuring part, since GGT is liver-specific and it's clean. So your liver looks good; the AST is likely just training.
The IGF-1 note:
Your IGF-1 is 135 (range 53-331), so within range but on the lower-middle side. Not a problem, but if you wanted it higher that's nutrition-driven (adequate calories/protein) worth knowing it's mid-range if you're tracking it. Nothing to act on, just context.
The thing I'd genuinely reconsider the 800/400 increase:
Here's where the actual bloodwork makes the case better than I could before. You said you're bumping to 800 test / 400 primo. But look at what your 600/300 is already doing: total test 2941 (very high), free test 785 (massively over range), E2 well-controlled at 43, prolactin low, liver fine, and you said you feel great and are getting defined. You're already running a strongly effective, well-managed cycle. Increasing to 800/400 would push your already-high test even higher, drive your hematocrit (already at 50) up further toward the donation-required zone, add more cardiovascular and lipid load, and increase aromatization (so your nicely-controlled E2 at 43 would climb and might then actually need an AI). For what? Your 600/300 is delivering the results and your markers are clean. The 800 bump mostly buys you more risk higher hematocrit, more CV load, a disturbed E2 balance on top of a setup that's already working great by your own account and your bloodwork. I'd genuinely reconsider it. If 600/300 is giving you what you want with clean markers, that's the sweet spot; climbing to 800 trades your clean, controlled numbers for marginal gains and real added risk. Something to think hard about before the increase.
Bottom line:
Genuinely clean, well-managed panel. The "low test" worry is unfounded 2941 total / 785 free is high, your A-Tech is clearly dosing, and your low SHBG (10) explains the high free fraction. Your E2 at 43 on the sensitive assay is well-controlled by the primo with no AI needed don't touch it. Prolactin at 4.2 confirms 60mg NPP is well-tolerated with no progestogenic stress, so stay there. Watch your hematocrit (50, climbing territory) and your mildly low sodium (134). Liver's fine (AST slightly up is likely training, GGT clean). And seriously reconsider the 800/400 increase your 600/300 is delivering great results with clean, controlled markers, and bumping to 800 mainly adds hematocrit and cardiovascular risk and would unsettle your nicely-controlled E2, for marginal benefit on a setup that's already working. You're monitoring well and your numbers are good the smart move is to recognize you've got a dialed, effective, clean cycle and not climb without a real reason.

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getswole89's picture

Damn your the man thank you for this breakdown. Makes a lot more sense now

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Toadking's picture

Hey Storm Ayden,

Thanks so much for your highly detailed analysis of not only this blood panel but also the comparison with my previous bloodwork! Thanks for clarifying the confusion about test levels and the differences between both labs. That definitely makes sense. I’m still getting used to having my free test be the most important range over total test. I had no doubt that a tech was going to check out, but this explains the actual numbers so I appreciate it.Here is where I'm at moving forward:

NPP & Test: I’m definitely keeping the NPP in the cycle at the same dosage since it’s been working well. I have not raised the NPP dose because I am worried about prolactin sides if I do. As far as raising the test dose, I’ve already bumped it up.Monitoring: Luckily, I have an i-STAT machine which allows me to track my hematocrit and other basic markers, and I am prepared to donate if needed. I also plan on lowering the dose if it starts to affect my overall sense of well-being. I'm getting full bloodwork every 4 weeks.

Primo & Routine: The primo has been working so well I’m honestly impressed. I usually do not aromatize very much anyway, and I’m really happy with my range at the moment.

I’ve been eating really clean and training with high intensity 5 to 6 days a week with daily cardio.On a side note, libido’s been so high that my wife and I are both raw at the moment!I absolutely appreciate your feedback, your experience, and your time. I will consider all of this as I move forward..

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shredski's picture

God damn those are nice numbers

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Steeltoad777's picture

Youre running 60mg of NPP? Total? So 20mg 2x a week? Do you find that sufficient for joint lube? Im gonna try running 50mg next cycle, i usually run 100mg+

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Toadking's picture

60mg a week has been working great. This is also my first time trying any sort of nandrolone. Does it usually have a honeymoon phase where lower doses were really well at first but then require increase? Can anyone chime in on that?

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Steeltoad777's picture

Ive noticed overall, overtime, we do respond less and less, and end up needing more and more. But... if thats an effective dose, it should work for years, for ya!

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Toadking's picture

Thanks for the feedback; that’s awesome. I am really enjoying the relief in my joints, especially on my shoulders. Hopefully, you are correct. I know a lot of people eventually experience issues with Nor-19 compounds. I’ll most likely put it on the back burner during the cruise

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getswole89's picture

Thanks for testing. Doesn’t it seem a lil lowered compared to your results running 500mg Zphc test?

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Toadking's picture

That’s a really good point. I'm honestly not sure what’s going on there. Both tests were taken in the morning, fasted, and during a trough. Plus, A-Tech usually has a pretty solid reputation. I’m going to try some Para Pharma Test next, and then eventually swing back to ZPHC later in the cycle. I absolutely love their gear!

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