Musclesandchicks's picture
Musclesandchicks
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+ 1 Blood work!

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I just got bloods done and wanted some input on what you guys think... (I took a Lil Arimadex as soon as I saw my estrogen!) Here's what I was running
Test c-400mg/week (pinned eod)
Tren a-140mg/ week (pinned eod)
50mg proviron split into 2-25mg doses/day
30mg anavar 10am/20mg pre workout
5mg cialis daily (pre on workout days)
Bpc157/tb500 nightly
Cjc1295/ipamorelin nightly
Reta -1.5-2.0mg every 5 days(just started the reta a month ago)
VITAMINS (I think i might be over doing it)
P-5-P B6
B6
High strength fish oil
Magnesium glycinate
Magnesium L-threonate
Milk thistle
D3(obviously need to cut back)
D3/K2 mix
CoQ-10
Tudca (hard to take every day because of timing)
Citrus Bergamot
Astragalus root
5-MTHF
NAC
R-Alpha lipoic Acid

Any and all input is welcome. Thanks for taking the time to read this and give any advice!

Ordered from: 
Musclesandchicks's picture

ALL INSIGHT IS WELCOME, PLEASE...First of i want to thank you VERY VERY much for your insight, although it scared the FUCK out of me... couple things I didn't mention was this was WEEK 12 FOR THE CYCLE!!!! When I lift, I lift hard till failure and beyond which i read can cause inflated numbers? I smoke nicotine daily(vape) and weed daily,I do ZERO cardio, I stayed up all night the night before because my sleep has been really shitty, then fasted 12 hrs and did my blood at 5pm ... So kinda fucked it all up. My carcadian rhythm has been really messed up for LAST 2 MONTHS. Barely sleeping longer then 4 hrs in a row. Planned on only running the cycle for like 8 weeks but shit...u know how it goes, I felt great and got greedy. I took the blood test through a company called rythem, since I got my blood work back i have stopped all PED's and peptides. I'm just going to be doing 180mg test c/week, hitting the fish oil hard, citrus Bergamot and CoQ-10. 30 min/day zone 2 cardio and lifting a Push/Pull/Legs/Rest and getting another blood test June 1( unless you think i should get the blood test earlier... my thinking was to give it a couple weeks to correct itself with lifestyle change and cycle drop, but i can order the test for whatever day i want!!)Please please tell me what you think of my new plan and should I maybe just keep the reta at 1.5mg weekly, not for the weight loss but for the lipid profile help. ALL INSIGHT IS WELCOMED, PLEASE HELP ME

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bigchips27's picture

Don't sweat the estrogen unless you're having common negative effects. More is better until its not.
My bloodwork was similar. Get that cholesterol under control. Mine was slightly worse. Ordered rosuvastatin 10mg daily and focused on a better diet and increased cardio. After 2 months cholesterol is great. Better than I thought. Backed off the rosuvastatin and #s held steady . At 50 I needed to dail shit down anyway. I knew not to mess eith my estrogen because i wasn't having any negative issues. But I crashed it and it was a bad idea. Didn't feel like myself, sex drive took a shit for over a month. Definitely work on that hdl/ldl

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liableuu's picture

I was concerned when my blood came in today. I’ve been using ChatGPT to learn the ins and outs here’s what it has on yours..

Bloodwork Breakdown (Not Mine)

Lipids / Cardiovascular Health

Total Cholesterol / HDL Ratio — 9.72
- Ideal: under 5
- Excellent: under 3.5
- 9.72 is extremely poor

This ratio suggests a very high cardiovascular risk profile. HDL is too low relative to LDL.

————————————————————

HDL Cholesterol — 29.3
(Good cholesterol)

  • Optimal: 40–60+
  • Under 40 = low
  • Under 30 = very poor

Severely suppressed HDL. Common with:
- Anavar
- Winstrol
- Dianabol
- Poor cardio
- Smoking/vaping
- Genetics

Orals are notorious for crushing HDL.

————————————————————

LDL Cholesterol — 235
(Bad cholesterol)

  • Optimal: under 100
  • 190+ = very high

235 is extremely elevated and strongly associated with:
- Plaque buildup
- Heart disease
- Stroke risk

Possible causes:
- Steroid use
- High saturated fat diet
- Genetics
- Poor insulin sensitivity

Most doctors consider LDL over 190 serious enough to discuss statins.

————————————————————

ApoB — 172
(Arguably the most important marker here)

  • Optimal: under 90
  • High risk: over 130
  • 172 = extremely high

ApoB measures the number of plaque-forming particles in the blood. This suggests very high atherosclerotic risk.

————————————————————

Inflammation

hs-CRP — 6.69
(Inflammation marker)

  • Under 1 = low inflammation
  • 1–3 = moderate
  • Over 3 = high risk

6.69 is very elevated.

Possible reasons:
- Systemic inflammation
- Hard training
- Illness/infection
- Steroid use
- Obesity
- Cardiovascular inflammation

Combined with these lipid numbers, it’s concerning.

————————————————————

Blood Thickness / RBCs

Hemoglobin — 15.9
- Normal
- No issue here

————————————————————

Hematocrit — 46.9
- Normal
- Not overly thick blood

Many steroid users run elevated hematocrit, but this value is fine.

————————————————————

Overall Assessment

Good:
- Hemoglobin normal
- Hematocrit normal

Bad:
- HDL severely low
- LDL extremely high
- ApoB extremely high
- hs-CRP elevated

Overall:
This is a very atherogenic lipid profile with significant cardiovascular risk. Looks very typical of oral steroid impact (Anavar/Winstrol/Dbol/etc.) more than testosterone alone.

If this were a real case, most doctors would recommend:
- Stopping oral compounds
- More cardio
- Dietary cleanup
- Retesting in 4–8 weeks
- Possibly statin therapy depending on history/risk factors

Very rough bloodwork from a cardiovascular standpoint.

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Novalentinehere's picture

Estrogen looks a touch high, brother.

Much more and we will be calling you sister

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OscarWildwood's picture

Your poor heart :(

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Wildling's picture

I started testing CRP a few years ago… you have some underlying issue going on. Someone can correct me, but mine has never gone over 2 even on substances beyond test.

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Novalentinehere's picture

I’ve seen over 2. But never over 3. Seeing 6 was a surprise. And it’s near 7.

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Jumbo_Jet247's picture

I’ll be completely honest with you, I’d be scared to run gear with these labs.

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CLAPPER's picture

Honestly. An APoB of 172 and a CRP of 7 is asking for a heart attack

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Musclesandchicks's picture

First of i want to thank you VERY VERY much for your insight, although it scared the FUCK out of me... couple things I didn't mention was this was WEEK 12 FOR THE CYCLE!!!! I smoke nicotine daily(vape)I stayed up all night the night before because my sleep has been really shitty, then fasted 12 hrs and did my blood at 5pm ... So kinda fucked it all up. My carcadian rhythm has been really messed up for LAST 2 MONTHS. Barely sleeping longer then 4 hrs in a row. Planned on only running the cycle for like 8 weeks but shit...u know how it goes, I felt great and got greedy. I took the blood test through a company called rythem, since I got my blood work back i have stopped all PED's and peptides. I'm just going to be doing 180mg test c/week, hitting the fish oil hard, citrus Bergamot and CoQ-10. 30 min/day zone 2 cardio and lifting a Push/Pull/Legs/Rest and getting another blood test June 1( unless you think i should get the blood test earlier... my thinking was to give it a couple weeks to correct itself with lifestyle change and cycle drop, but i can order the test for whatever day i want!!)Please please tell me what you think of my new plan and should I maybe just keep the reta at 1.5mg weekly, not for the weight loss but for the lipid profile help?

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CLAPPER's picture

Great plan. Your biggest factors for results will be from dropping the cycle, quitting nicotine, and getting your diet in check. Keep the Reta and recheck bloods for when you scheduled and if you do the above three well, youll see drastic improvements.

Health comes first brother, this isn’t a sprint. I’m just glad you actually did bloodwork, something a lot of people still don’t do on PEDs

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protoballz's picture

Yea way more accurate lol.

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Jockstrap's picture

Posted on forums is proper blood test type so e2 is a real number. Imo the tren is a waste of your time at the dose being used. Test and oral is plenty til you're maxed out...then run tren properly. Dhb imo is far superior to tren for regular folks

Jockstrap's picture

Posted on forums is proper blood test type so e2 is a real number. Imo the tren is a waste of your time at the dose being used. Test and oral is plenty til you're maxed out...then run tren properly. Dhb imo is far superior to tren for regular folks

BigDdaddy's picture

I get great results on 150mg Tren ew. I never run it high. I use it as an addition at times for extra strength, aggression and fat burning.

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UncleYoked's picture

I don't think it's a waste of time, even at low dose tren is incredibly powerful. People are experimenting with much lower doses these days and finding results with less side effects. If I were to ever touch tren again, it would be at a very low dose.

BigDdaddy's picture

Agreed and same. I never go above 150mg these days and I definitely get results.

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VowOfHatred850's picture

10mg ED works well for me. No sides and visible changes.

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olemasta's picture

I was seeing significant strength increase on 20mg/ED tren ace. Is that considered low dose? I think it to be. Only side I got was night sweats and slightly elevated liver markers but manageable.

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damage33's picture

In some types of analysis, tren is detected as E2, so in my opinion, try using an AI and repeat the tests. If the values drop only slightly or remain stable, it means it’s a false positive.

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BigDdaddy's picture

Is this bro science or you've actually seen studies? I've not had an effect on my e2 running Tren before. I've ran it probly 12 times over the years and have never experienced this.

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Min Diesel's picture

It’s specific only to the ECLIA test for e2. Other labs may use another method.

BigDdaddy's picture

I saw that in the article. Very good info. Strange how things are affected sometimes.

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UncleYoked's picture

I've never heard of this. Very interesting.

Min Diesel's picture

I just came here to say this!!! Especially if you get your blood work at labcorp but i have seen this popping up on bloods done elsewhere. The antibodies used in the ECLIA estrogen test react to the tren and cause a false high reading. Here is an in depth reddit link: https://www.reddit.com/r/steroids/comments/3s93qq/eclia_e2_testing_shows...

BigDdaddy's picture

I'll be damned. I've never had this effect. That's interesting to know for sure.

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UncleYoked's picture

thanks for that info, learned something new today.
Check that thread, it looks like common knowledge...wonder how I missed it now

Min Diesel's picture

My first couple tren cycles i almost lost my mind relying on numbers rather than how i feel with what i thought was actually high e2. I ended up crashing my estrogen one time because of this. I usually get bloodwork 4-6 weeks in and because of this i usually won’t add tren in until afterwards. Just so i can get a better idea of what’s what.

damage33's picture

I can tell you the same story about some guys during contest prep who thought their tren was fake or swapped with estrogen because their e2 values were completely off the charts.

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UncleYoked's picture

smart move

Storm Ayden's picture

Hey man, read through the whole thing. Respect for posting bloods publicly, most guys don't. Going to be straight with you because I think that's more useful than telling you what you want to hear.
The E2 isn't actually the scariest number on this panel. I get why it jumped out 159 is high and it's the one with an obvious lever to pull. But honestly, the stuff that made me sit up was further down:

hs-CRP 6.69 that's systemic inflammation in a range that on its own bumps cardiac risk meaningfully
ApoB 172 + LDL 235 + HDL 29 ApoB is the number that actually tracks plaque, and 172 is well into "this matters now" territory
Trig/HDL ratio 9.7 anything over 3-4 is a red flag, 10 is a different conversation
Fructosamine 286 that's a pre-diabetic 2-3 week glucose average, which is weird because you've been on reta for a month and it should be pulling that down, not sitting there

Individually any one of these is "okay, watch it." Stacked together on the same panel, in a guy running 400 test + 140 tren + orals, that's the cardiometabolic pattern that puts people in a cath lab earlier than they should be. Not trying to scare you, just calling it what it is.
On the arimidex you already took — heads up, the bigger risk now might be crashing E2, not high E2. Crashed E2 wrecks lipids further (yours can't afford that), tanks joints, kills mood, and rebounds hard. If you're going to dose AI again, you want a follow-up E2 (ideally sensitive assay / LC-MS/MS, not standard immunoassay immunoassay reads inflated in guys aromatizing heavily, so 159 might not even be 159) before you pin more.
Things I'd want to know before giving you cycle-specific input:

How long into this blend are you? Week 4 looks different from week 14.
Were you fasted for these bloods, and how long after your last pin?
What were your bloods before you started? Especially the lipids and CRP — were these baseline-ish for you or did the cycle move them?
Anavar's been how long? Orals are probably contributing to the lipid picture more than the injectables.
BP at home? That panel + uncontrolled BP is a whole different urgency level.

Honest read on what to do next, in this order:

See a doctor who actually works with guys on cycle. Not your GP they'll lecture and waste your time. Look at Marek Health, Defy, or a TRT/men's health clinic that's PED-aware. Be straight about the cycle. This panel warrants it, today not next month. ApoB 172 + hs-CRP 6.69 is the combo where a CAC scan or carotid ultrasound at baseline genuinely changes the conversation.
Re-run E2 sensitive before any more AI. You may have just crashed yourself on an inflated number.
Get HbA1c + fasting insulin to go with the fructosamine. If something's blunting reta's glucose effect (could be tren, could be GH peptides, could be diet), you want to know.
The supp stack you're right that you're overdoing it. You've got B6 listed twice and D3 in two products. Long-term high-dose B6 (>50mg/day from all sources) can cause peripheral neuropathy, that's worth checking. TUDCA inconsistency on oral anavar isn't great. Citrus bergamot is one of the few in there with actual lipid data so keep that one. Most of the rest is fine but doing less than the price tag suggests.
The cycle itself I'm not going to tell you what to pull, that's between you and a doc who can see the full picture. But I'll say: if you got these numbers back from a doctor without telling them what you were running, they'd be talking statin, BP recheck, repeat panel in 6 weeks, and "what's driving the inflammation." That framing might be more useful than "what AI dose."

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Musclesandchicks's picture

First of i want to thank you VERY VERY much for your insight, although it scared the FUCK out of me... couple things I didn't mention was this was WEEK 12 FOR THE CYCLE!!!! I smoke nicotine daily(vape)I stayed up all night the night before because my sleep has been really shitty, then fasted 12 hrs and did my blood at 5pm ... So kinda fucked it all up. My carcadian rhythm has been really messed up for LAST 2 MONTHS. Barely sleeping longer then 4 hrs in a row. Planned on only running the cycle for like 8 weeks but shit...u know how it goes, I felt great and got greedy. I took the blood test through a company called rythem, since I got my blood work back i have stopped all PED's and peptides. I'm just going to be doing 180mg test c/week, hitting the fish oil hard, citrus Bergamot and CoQ-10. 30 min/day zone 2 cardio and lifting a Push/Pull/Legs/Rest and getting another blood test June 1( unless you think i should get the blood test earlier... my thinking was to give it a couple weeks to correct itself with lifestyle change and cycle drop, but i can order the test for whatever day i want!!)Please please tell me what you think of my new plan and should I maybe just keep the reta at 1.5mg weekly, not for the weight loss but for the lipid profile help?

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Storm Ayden's picture

Brother, first respect for the honesty in this update. Week 12 instead of "mid-cycle," nicotine, no sleep, fasted 12 hrs, blood drawn at 5pm after an all-nighter. That context changes a few of the numbers, not all of them, and we'll go through which is which. The fact that you've already pulled the orals and peptides and dropped to a TRT-ish dose shows you took it seriously. That matters.
But I have to be straight with you about one thing before anything else:
You need to see a doctor. Not next month. Soon. I know that's not what you came to a forum to hear, and I know guys hate hearing it. But your panel isn't just "cycle bloods that look bad" it's a cardiometabolic picture that warrants real evaluation by someone who can put hands on you, listen to your heart, check your BP properly, run the tests a forum can't (CAC scan, sensitive E2, fasting insulin, maybe a carotid ultrasound), and tell you where you actually stand on risk. At your age, after 12 weeks at the doses you ran, "I'll fix it myself with lifestyle and a retest" is the kind of plan that works right up until it doesn't. A 20-year-old's body forgives this. Past 40, it doesn't forgive the same way, and the recovery curve is genuinely slower in ways that aren't obvious from the inside.
Find a TRT/men's health clinic that's PED-aware Marek Health, Defy Medical, or similar. Be honest about everything. They've seen worse. Book it this week, not after the June 1 retest. The retest gives you numbers; the doctor visit gives you a plan that the numbers fit into. Different tools.
Now what your update actually changes:
What the pre-test conditions adjust:
No sleep + fasted 12hrs + 5pm draw + all-nighter: This bumps cortisol, which inflates glucose and fructosamine slightly, worsens lipids slightly, and elevates inflammatory markers (CRP). So your fructosamine 286 is probably real but maybe 10-15% inflated. Your hs-CRP 6.69 might be 5-ish on a good day. Still bad. Still warrants action. Not "I'm actually fine."
Nicotine daily (vape): This is a real cardiovascular factor that nobody on the forum has flagged hard enough. Nicotine constricts blood vessels, raises BP, raises hs-CRP independently, accelerates atherosclerosis, and synergizes badly with the lipid picture you have. If you fix everything else perfectly and keep vaping, you're still doing damage. Quitting nicotine is probably the single highest-leverage cardiovascular intervention available to you right now, bigger than any cycle adjustment. I know it's not what you want to hear but it's the truth.
Chronic 4-hour sleep for 2 months: This explains a huge amount of the inflammatory and metabolic picture. Sleep deprivation that severe drives insulin resistance, raises CRP, raises cortisol, tanks recovery, and makes lipid management nearly impossible. Your body has been in a stress state for 2 months. Some of your numbers will improve significantly just from sleep recovery alone.
So the honest read: your panel is still bad, but maybe 15-20% of "bad" is acute lifestyle on top of cycle, and that part fixes fast.
Your new plan what's good:
Dropping all PEDs and peptides, correct call
Going to TRT dose 180mg test/week, good number, that's actual TRT-replacement range
Fish oil hard ✓ — 3-4g EPA/DHA daily is the dose that actually moves trigs and CRP, not 1g
Citrus bergamot ✓ — keep at 1000mg/day, real lipid data
CoQ10 ✓ — fine, especially if you end up on a statin
Zone 2 cardio 30 min/day ✓ — exactly right, this is the cardio that fixes metabolic stuff (high-intensity is good for fitness, zone 2 is good for the mitochondrial/lipid/insulin picture)
PPL split ✓ — fine, training isn't the issue
Your new plan — what's missing or needs adjusting:
The vape has to go. Not negotiable if you're serious. Nicotine is doing real cardiovascular damage independent of the cycle, and on your current panel it's a major risk amplifier. If quitting cold is hard, get nicotine pouches or gum to taper off the vape, then taper off the pouches over 4-6 weeks. Cycle damage you can recover from. Long-term nicotine vascular damage you can't.
Sleep has to be the priority, not the afterthought. Chronic 4-hour sleep will sabotage every other intervention you're making. The fish oil, the cardio, the dropped orals none of it works fully if you're still sleeping 4 hours. If your work schedule is the problem, that's a hard conversation but a real one. Magnesium glycinate 400mg before bed, no screens 1 hour before, cold room, no caffeine after noon, no nicotine within 2 hours of bed (vape disrupts sleep). If sleep doesn't improve in 2-3 weeks, that's a sleep study conversation with a doctor you might have apnea given your weight on cycle, and undiagnosed apnea would explain a lot of your panel.
Add 400mg magnesium glycinate + potassium-rich foods. BP probably wasn't great on cycle even if you didn't measure it. Get a home BP cuff ($30), measure daily for 2 weeks, bring those numbers to the doctor.
Retatrutide question keep it or drop it? This is actually a good question and the answer is nuanced. The lipid/metabolic benefits of GLP-1/GIP/glucagon triple agonists like reta are real improves insulin sensitivity, drops trigs, mildly drops LDL, reduces visceral fat which drops hs-CRP. For someone with your panel, those effects are exactly what you want. BUT: running reta solo, off-cycle, at a lower dose (1mg/week instead of 1.5-2.0mg every 5 days) for the metabolic benefits is a defensible call. The aggressive dosing you were running is more about weight loss than metabolic optimization. The right answer is: ask the doctor. This is exactly the kind of decision that benefits from medical oversight reta has real side effects (gallbladder issues, pancreatitis risk, GI stuff) and the right dose for "lipid help" vs. "weight loss" is different. Don't just keep running it on your own judgment.
On the June 1 retest timing:
Your instinct is right that you want to give the changes time to work. But here's the issue: some markers move fast (CRP, glucose, BP) and some move slow (HDL, ApoB, hematocrit).
My recommendation: don't push the retest later, push it earlier and add markers. Get a 4-week panel around June 18 or 20th focused on the things that move fast: hs-CRP, fasting glucose + HbA1c + fasting insulin (for HOMA-IR), basic lipids, liver enzymes, hematocrit, E2 (sensitive if available), total + free test. This gives you and your doctor a checkpoint to see if you're on the right track before doing the bigger retest July 1-15 with the full panel. Bloods are cheap, information is valuable, and right now you have no idea if the changes are working until then which is too long to wait if something's going wrong.
What to actually monitor at home in the meantime:
BP daily (cuff, same time, sitting, after 5 min rest)
Resting heart rate (watch is fine)
Sleep hours and quality (be honest with yourself)
Weight (don't obsess, but track)
Mood/energy (subjective but real data)
Any chest discomfort, shortness of breath on stairs, calf pain, vision changes → emergency room, not forum
The fact that you are in your 40s :
"Getting old sucks" yeah, but more specifically: recovery from cardiometabolic insult slows with age, the safety margin on cycle gets thinner, and the cumulative damage matters more because you have less repair runway. None of this means you can't keep using gear. It means the lane shifts lower doses, no orals, longer time between cycles or pure TRT, tighter monitoring, more attention to the boring stuff (sleep, BP, nicotine, alcohol). A 25-year-old runs 500/140/30 var and bounces back. A 45+ guy runs the same and his blood vessels remember it for years.
One last thing: the fact that you're worried, you stopped immediately, you've laid out a real plan, you're asking good questions that's a good sign. The guys who get into real trouble are the ones who get bloods like this and double down or hide them. You're doing the opposite. That bodes well. Now stack a doctor visit on top of it and you've actually got a complete plan.
You're going to be okay. But get the appointment booked this week.

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OscarWildwood's picture

Great advice and write up brother. +1

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BigDdaddy's picture

Phenomenal advice brother and amazing shit taking such time to help one of your brothers out. This right here is exactly what it's all about! Being there for each other keeping one another safe. Good man!

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crystal_test's picture

If I could upvote you 2-3 times, I would. The OP is 40. Im 50 and dont do Tren, but I would be in full on panic with these numbers. I wonder what his liver looks like?

In my opinion, drop off cycle asap and go to LOW trt for at least 30 days and re-pull everything for a baseline and include ALT/AST. Meanwhile hammer some supplements to see if it can get close to descent.

Tanman's picture

This is the response you needed. Saw that E2 and thought ok, that's pretty high but pretty easy to fix, then it just kept getting worse as I went down.

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