posted Tue, 01/14/2014 - 19:01
4292
Infertile from juice?
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Could some please explain to me in laymen's terms how steroids can make a man not be able to reproduce? Im confused, some say yea some say no? I use AAS and I plan to have children down the road..5 yrs at least but i dont want to fuck myself permanently. If you are sure on what u know please reply, and try and keep it SIMPLE haha
thanks
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beyondimportsI had a kid mid blast after years of trt. Everyone is different
Regardless of gear, never lose faith that anything can happen. I've witnessed multiple friends and family members that were flat out told by doctors that they would not be able to make a baby. Fertility treatment up the ass. Nothing worked.
They all stopped trying, started living and each one of these people are now parents. The world works in mysterious ways.
This is a huge concern of mine. I hope I can have another. I'm putting my faith into it will happen if it's meant to happen.
el super beastoGood luck bro.I'm also trying for 1 more kid also.
Since I am jumping in late I will refrain from most of the comments down below. The one thing of value that I would like to add is that in my opinion I think every healthy male should have their sperm frozen. Especially if you are an athlete, dabble in AAS or anything or any kind of activity that can cost you your fertility.
It is not all that cost prohibitive and it's a simple procedure that guarantees you the right to conception during your lifetime. Think of this, you can be as healthy as a horse one day and then with one accident or one disease you can lose your opportunity to have children. Just food for thought.
TONYPERKISBTW have you done this yourself? Thanks for the feedback bro
I say no comment on the public forum.
TONYPERKISYea man I was actually researching that earlier today. U say its not all that cost prohibitive? The one i was researching was like 2500.00 for 5 years...does that sound about right?
It's about $1000 to get started with all of the tests and about $2500 for 10 years of storage. To me that's not very cost prohibitive when comparing to the amount of money one spends on some of the exotic AAS cycles.
TONYPERKISTrue that. Bet ive spent double that in the last 2 years on gear haha
A 3 year blast and cruise left me sterile. When I finally came to my senses and tried to work with the best specialists I could find on doing some kind of PCT, it was too late for me. There will never again be enough swimmers. I don't think there is a rule of thumb on how long you can go without doing a proper PCT before u expose yourself to the possibility of infertility, so I just tell everyone not to be so obsessed with possibly losing a pound or two around PCT that you don't do it. Do it. Play it safe.
TONYPERKISIve been talking with a guy who runs test year round, he told me that if I wanted to have children down the road and still run test year round that all i would have to do is stop the gear and do a heavey HCG run then my sperm count would be sky high??? does this sound possible???
First of all you need a combination of FSH, LH, and Testosterone to produce baby batter. So right off the bat you're missing FSH in that equation. If you've induce secondary hypogonadism then nothing is really going to help you. It's just not worth the risk if you're looking to procreate.
No. Tell me where to send you a picture of my very big fist with my hairy ass knuckles and show it to him and tell him I would love to meet with him to discuss further. LMFAO LOL
read this, it may help
http://www.eroids.com/forum/steroids-qa/pct-anti-estrogens/my-fertility-......
have you tried HMG and clomid
On my own, no. We went to the best fertility docs in the region and paid out of insurance to see some of them. I know at one point I was on HMG with HCG injections and rhFSH as well for two years with no success. I stopped short of GNrH with the pump and catheter. I think Clomid was like the first line of defense - I'd have to go through the whole file (stuff like that you don't throw away). I love my two boys anyways. It sure could have been worse.
that's unfortunate. Well I'm glad I read this. I'm young and have been contemplating staying on forever, but still in my early 20's and would like to have kids some day. I'm gonna continue to pct, even if it means going through the roller coaster emotions and side effects
TONYPERKISI feel ya brother!! Nothings worst then coming off cycle!! Regardless what people say your gonna lose most of your gains if you come off. Ive been off for 6 weeks and have lost 20+ pounds, i have stayed in the gym and continued to eat but i have lost my weight, although my muscle definition has stayed along with strength. I think im gonna get my sperm forzen and stay on non stop afterwards haha
Bro. Bro. Bro. Let's put the fertility issue on the back burner for a second. If you've lost 20+ lbs. feel free to PM me on that one. That's excessive. I would really like to understand the cycle u came off . . .
AnonWords of wisdom brother. When things are too late it is a difficult pill to swallow. I haven't come to that conclusion for myself but I know it may be close. I'm going out swinging regardless. I tell my wife all the time that I can move on with a clear conscience and accept not having children from our marriage as long as we made the effort. If we didn't try And make this effort I would always look back with regret.
TONYPERKISSo does that mean you could never have a child that is of your sperm? is there nothing they can do to increase the swimmers?
Repeat sorry.
Oh God is not that cruel my son. I have two boys - 8 and 11 but I can't have any more children. No there is nothing that can be done about my sperm count. If we wanted a bigger family it could be done in vitro, for sure.
Let me be clear on one point - the blast and cruise and never coming off and never letting my testis recover was the problem -- it was a PCT issue not and AAS use issue. I don't know anybody that cycles and does a proper PCT that got sterile from steroids . . . only the "perputual cycle" idiots like me can boast about those consequences . . . .
TONYPERKISIf you have recovered from a cycle how important is the time off protocol in your opinion? Do u consider time off part of the whole PCT? Ive considered blasting and cruising like u have..but i really want to have kids down the road so im ruling that out for now unless u know away to do it and still have kids? I know i was fertile 2 yrs ago when my ex got pregnant. But ive done a fair amount of juice since then. Do u know anything about triptioline(the new pct)?
You know bro. I really think this this blast and cruise mode of steroid use is the single most dangerous thing there is. Worst that the harshest compounds, for sure. The time off protocol allows all the subtle damage to the bodies systems to heal completely. You can get monster big and cycle. Tryptoline does not appear to be an adequate substitute for Clomid in getting your Testis back on-line. It looks like a nice chemical that has some role in glandular repair but not in generating LH.
TONYPERKISSo whats the trick to getting monster big while cycling? Im 6 weeks off and have lost 20+lbs. Ive been working out harder during pct then I did on cycle in an attempt to keep my gains. However Ive lost some serious weight but ive kept my strength and muscle definition. It seems like I havent lost a pound in appearance because my muscles havent faded much at all but when i get on the scale it tells a totally different story.
The key to training off cycle is intensity with reduced volume. So you want to make sure that your overall volume is low but your intensity level is high.
Plus you might want to consider that maybe you didn't lose all that much. Maybe because alot of the weight that you gained was a result of water weight. Not saying that's what happened just food for thought.
My wife is three months pregnant and I was on test e deca and a superdrol kicker at the time of conception. that being said Im in the same boat as far as worrying about having more kids down the road so Im not cycling tell we are all done. for me its just not worth taking any risk I don't compete only reason i cycle is to look good with my shirt off so its just not a priority right now.
GearofWarPCT! Perfect PCT's will ensure you're fertile for years to come my friend. I actually conceived twice while on-cycle so the bro science of juice makes you sterile dies not stand. Carlos is very knowledgable and is a source of info that won't steer you wrong. I personally would use HCG during all of my cycles if I wasn't already screwed and on TRT. My TRT issue does not stem from juice either just like Carlos. I wrecked my own HPTA with illicit drugs. Yet another reason drugs are bad for you mmm kaaay!
TONYPERKISNice man congrats! Yea ive heard u cant get a chick preg while on cycle..i havent tried to get my girl preg but occasionally i forget to pull out..couple times a week lol but i havent knocked her up thank God haha. But anyways what kind of drugs were u referring to? I abused opiates heavily in my late teens and early twenties, my doc told me i had probably lowered my test levels from all the opiates..
AnonCarlos is the dude to listen to and from what I've read, if you are a moderate user and decide to start trying there are clinics that can help administer HMG and clomid in the right dosages and get your boys up to speed
AnonMost of the stuff I've read bro doesn't indicate that moderate AAS use causes infertility. Heavy AAS abuse over long periods of time with little to no recovery time is when infertility stuff happens IMO. Some compounds like Ment are horrible in fertility terms. It can basically be used as contraception in men. The shutdown is pretty harsh. Basically bro If you are responsible in your use and Post cycle therapy you will be just fine.
Now keep in mind this is just from the research on AAS I've done. I personally can't say it's caused me to be infertile. My issues are from damage done to my HPTA from injuries but I still have swimmers in there but they're kind of just chillin. There's plenty of em just they're lazy. All u need is one swimmer bro.
TONYPERKISSo what Ive gathered from your comment and my own yrs of research is doing the standard cycle, with a standard pct, should allow me to remain fertile? I guess the next question I ask(highly doubt theres an EXACT answer), but at what point does running gear become abuse? People who dont run gear consider using anything abuse, whereas bodybuilders and athletes see it as responsible. And PCT, the standard 404020201001005050 nova/clomid, then time off should make it responsible? Basically what I'm asking is lets say I run cycles, do my PCT then get back on, without the standard time off period im gonna be infertile? At how long of doing this will it take to make me infertile? 1 yrs, 5 yrs, 10yrs???
Thank you very much for the feedback bro!!! Cheers!!!
AnonWell ur right nothing I say is exact. Nor is anything an MD will say is exact. Each persons DNA dictates so many different variables in this conversation I highly doubt anything is exact when it comes to this topic. And you're also correct in stating that what is considered abuse is 100% subjective to the individual. IMO what I would consider abuse is if you haven't been diagnosed as hypogonadism or as sterile and you're running cycles without proving through bloods that you are beginning each cycle fully healed or that your levels are showing a healthy HPTA. In other words if you are not diagnosed hypogonadism and your running consecutive cycles without allowing time to recover that can be considered abusive to your HPTA. If you are diagnosed as hypogonadism or sterile then that eliminates many parts of this argument. As far as dosages on cycle and protocol of pct that IMO is unique to the individual and what may be considered abusive to one persons body may not be to the next person.
Everything within reason I suppose. Though I feel your summation of this topic is correct and that there are no exact answers. All we can do for ourselves is to think rationally and use our best judgement for ourselves and live with ye consequences. Really in the end there are so much more things associated with infertility than simply saying its AAS that caused it. Foods, recreational drugs, prescribed medications, environment, genetics all play a huge role in a healthy reproductive system. Hope that helps a little bit. Sorry I can't give you more
TONYPERKISThanks again for the feedback! How can I find out if I am fully healed? Obviously running a blood test but I must admit I never got my bloods done before my first cycle so how would I know what is healed in my case? I plan to get bloods soon, what levels should I look for to be a bases for being healed?
AnonHealthy levels would be a great start. Check test levels estrogen prolactin LH FSH and then get a sperm analysis. If all come back healthy then brother your healthy:)
TONYPERKISIve had my test levels checked a few times in the last year while on cycle..never off but considering i ran gear pretty much non stop(with 3 PCTs but no time off protocol) in 2013 im a little anxious to see my levels. The testing that i got only tested testosterone levels..like the free test. Will a analysis of the LH and FSH plus estrogen be completely necesaary to tell if I have recovered? Or will a test reading be enough? I ask bc its extremely expensive to get all those in a panel...hell the test analysis isnt cheap. But hey if i wana play a game like this its gonna be expensive!
eryximachusI was pretty reckless like that too for a year, with tren/mast/prop cycles no less.
Run a strong pct with HCG to start and run clomid and nolvadex for like 2 months or longer. Then stay off gear for a good 6 months or more. Get monthly panels done (the female panel discussed here is like $50).
I ended up right back at the low end of normal, just like I was before any cycles.
Anonhttp://www.privatemdlabs.com/lab_tests.php?view=all&show=1032&category=1...
Before you buy the test google privatemdlabs coupon. There's almost always coupons for 15% off. Hormone panel for females captures all you need. Also look at a sperm analysis test on privatemdlabs as well.
TONYPERKISGracias Carlos!
RustyhookerPerfect person for this answer! Smart dude right there!