posted Thu, 11/17/2011 - 15:16
5420
Short Cycles
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I'm 45 and not a body builder, just a little vain and want to stay looking good. I read that short cycles like 4-6 weeks on then 4-6 off are better than a 12 wk for a couple different reasons. Anybody have experience with shorts?
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When I wanted to know about short cycle I found this, its a pretty good thread. http://tnation.t-nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performanc...
Thanks bud
Anonshort cycles with a cruise may be what you are talking about ..otherwise, your done before any of the major compounds used have taken full effect. No blast and cruise on such a short cycle =waste..
Just reread this Yes blast and cruise using short esters would be right for this and bey not would be seem to be a waist sry guess its time for bed hahaha
AnonI was referring to using long acting esters for a 4 week cycle.. no point to that at all.. I was responding to the original post... I still think a 4 week cycle on anything is a waste.
I disagree with using short esters.
tread-mElaborate...
Have yet to try it but been looking into it some. That being said. Killinit88 has posted (a little farther down )the exact first thread I had read about it awhile back. So by front loading a short ester and getting your levels up fast. I beleave a 4 to 6 week run would be beneficial. Although I dont think you will get huge right away but think about it you get in gain and get out. Level out and in no time your back on again(this is what interests me the most)In no time 4 to 6 weeks. I have no proof if it works for me but in theory it sounds good. So guess I can't strongly disagree but personally I dont think its a bad idea for someone who only wants steady gains.
tread-mSo why would you just not run the short ester for the whole short cycle?
Sry thats what I mean
tread-mI see, your original post said "I disagree with using short esters". Lol. I thought you had been stacking a little bit too much kine bud in your mix!
Hahaha yeah n time for bed just damn addicted to this site
tread-mYuuuuuup
This might help with what im trying to say:
Comparing one general approach to another, where the difference being looked at is, say, duration of cycle, everything else ought to be held equal in the comparison if possible.
So the question should not be, "Will one 8 week cycle give me more results than one 2 week cycle?" unless that is the actual choice that would have to made and the answer wasn't thought to apply to a more general question, but rather something like
"If I use the same total amount of steroids in a year at the same weekly dosages and the same total number of weeks on and weeks off, which will do better for me, long or short cycles?"
Cycles are longer than effiicent if they have substantial parts of them at a point past a point where gains usually tail well off; or yielding impaired recoveries and thus worse losses; or being so long that there is no hope of taking advantage of how some periods of training can be especially productive whereas doing everything the same and/or aiming for equal muscle-building at all times is not as effective.
So for long term results such as you are looking for, I think going past 8 weeks is non-optimal. E.g., three 8 week cycles per year do better than two 12 week cycles, with total weeks "on" and total usage being identical in the two cases.
The two-week cycles do give really fast recovery. It's not that there is no HPTA shutdown, as there is during the two weeks, but the pituitary is immediately ready to respond to LHRH instead of so to speak having to be awakened from sleep (in more precise speaking, having greatly lowered LHRH responsiveness), and the testes are also immediately ready to respond to LH.
While if HCG is used in for example an 8 week cycle then the testes also are able to respond well to LH immediately, there's nothing that in like manner avoid reduced responsiveness of the pituitary.
As for the hypothalamus, I don't know if it's more responsive to discontinuance of increased androgen after 2 weeks than 8 or if it is the same either way.
Anyway, recovery is very fast, and with frontloading the body absolutely is ready for an excellent growth burst.
So I would suggest you look at your planning and if your training has parts in it where it seems to you, "You know, being 'on' for four weeks here, or 6 or 8, would help a whole lot, and there will be no problem having as a necessary consequence a longer run of 'off' weeks after this" then one or more longer cycles such as 4-8 weeks may be better than having the assistance taken away from a very productive training period.
On the other hand, in other parts of the training year 2 on / some number off may work better for you.
Since you have fast acting compounds you definitely have the option of short cycles.
Test E or Sustanon being cheaper and more convenient, I would use that in any longer cycles except for switching to propionate for the last week or two, for sake of quicker transition to levels allowing recovery.
AnonWith my experience and knowledge, I would say the SHORTEST should be 8 weeks? maybe others have more insight and knowledge, perhaps.
I have friends that go 6 ON 8 OFF but thats yr round and they're on Blast n Cruise mode...
Personally I won't go shorter than 8 but then again I think I may be getting ready to pull the trigger and Cruise myself ; )
tread-mYou belong with us on the dark side......
Nasty81NateDoing a short four-week cycle right now. Running 170 mg Test Prop EOD and 25mg of d-Bol ED. Sitting on day 19 right now and I'm extremely pleased with my results thus far. Feel great, look great and my strength has shot through the roof. Gonna run PCT for 3 weeks after. Normally wouldn't do it this way, but had a surgery come up that but a roadblock in my original cycle plans. Google "short steroid cycles" or "4 week cycles." Theres some pretty good info on other boards in relation to this subject.
What do you think about subing the Dbol for Anavar (50mg)? I read by using Anavar you don't need PCT. Article suggested continuing Ana for a couple weeks in lower dosages, until levels came back up.
tread-mNo issue with the sub knowing they do 2 completely different things. Cruise prop at your age between the minis even if at only 50 mg eod and the pct is not needed anyway. I would taper to the cruise dose but sounds great. I am kinda getting on board with minis though but I would say if you blast and cruise, even if hitting a little shorter blasts and more frequent I would think it to be just as or more effective. Speaking of 8 or 10 week short ester blasts. If blasting and cruising you could probably get away with 3 blasts a year on 8 week runs on shorts. Do your taper the last 10 days to the cruise of 50 or 100mg's eod....couple suggestions, many ways to get it done though and I dont hate yours.
Man, excuse my ignorance, but I'm not sure what blast and cruise exactly mean. I'm gathering blast is high dosage and cruise is lower dosage? If so, how long do you cruise after cylce? Especially if I'm doing 4 on and 4 off..
tread-mYeah grrrrlll layin out there. I wont cruise on long esters though, its prop and then some prop stacked with prop and I like some prop with it and then just for shits and giggles I top it off with prop! Lol. Shorts on cycle and shorts on the cruise is the only way you could do shorts as you describe them. As to how long do you cruise...right up to your funeral, its forever at our age brother. Thats why they call us silver backs.....
I think I'm gonna go sprinkle a lil prop on my chicken breast, lol
tread-mI like it, I would run in a little prop marinade first though....lol
Anonhave you had your T levels checked yet? most of the old timers cruise around 300-500mg per week on the long esters.. Blasting, well that really depends on you and how you end up feeling. Everyone has their own sweet spot. Don't mistake Anavar as something that you can take that doesn't really alter your physiology. Even though it is the "least" androgenic and does not aromatize to estrogen, does not mean that it cannot mess you up. Taking it alone with no test is like throwing it down the garbage disposal, most if not all of the gains will be lost when you come off. running orals for at least four weeks is pretty standard since that is when you get the FULL effect. (you should know what if any sides you will have by day 3 -5). Dbol is not comparable to Anavar.. as Tread says 'thems apples and oranges" what is your purpose in running short 4 week cycles? Are you prepared to deal with side effects and have the necessary compounds on hand? If you come off cycle completely you'll need the necessary PCT.. Do LOTS of research and then DO MORE research..
Yes I did, about 4 months ago and Dr. wrote presciption for Tes C. So Blasting is frontloading? As far as why I want to short cycle...quicker levels, shorter down time, less crash, lighter esters = less bloat and quality gains. That's what my research has taught me. That's why I'm wanting to end this cylcle of Tes C and start Tes P/Anavar
tread-mNo a front load refers to loading a long ester cycle with a short ester to get it kickin. Such as if you are ru nning a cyp cycle that wont really kick in for 3 weeks (ish) then you would also use prop (short ester) in that cycle for the first 3 weeks since it will kick almost immediately. This gives you cycle benefit from day one as opposed to day 21....gets the part started basically. Prop will uptake VERY quick and increase tests levels for about 48 hrs so you would want to use it as your front load at least every 48 hours for some stability in the higher levels. As you get to week 3 you have had enough of the long esters release and some degree of test levels rising by now allowing you to drop the front load. Again thoug, if running short cycles the only effective way I see it working is by using short esters only. The period on a short cycle is too short to get good build up and release of the long ester and cruising is short as well so again, short works much better. The argument could be made that a long ester for both blast and cruise on mani's. Would at least have longs releasing at all times. There is validity to the argument but the stability in the shorts when compared to the longs on Blast and cruise is so much better that even with constant and ongoing long ester release the short just wins it for me hands down.
Nasty81NateI really can't answer that question, can one of the vets chime in on this one?
DefconWhats the reasons they are better?
you tend to keep most of your gains, your using short esters. Your bloat wont be high therefor the gains you do make, although wont be big, will stay....
http://www.silownia.net/steroids/a/12221
Appreciate it. That's where I read it orginally, lol.
quicker levels, shorter down time, less crash, lighter esters = less bloat, quality gains
Yep, that's exactly what I read. Cool!