+ 1 Whats the difference
So I saw the post earlier with the amps from Germany and that everyone should know you can get the same brand of amps from Pakistan, Spain, and Turkey.
It's the same company but why the different quality of product?
The German products I feel are better than the Pakistan ones (so did the other member that had ordered them). So my question is why a huge pharmaceutical company that owns other pharmaceutical companies produce different levels of quality in their products depending on where they come from in the world? The same product branding whether you buy it in Germany Pakistan spain turkey.
Shouldn't the quality be exactly the same coming from the same company. Or is there something that I'm missing and there is a perfectly simple reason for it.
Please help me out with this question that makes me wonder WHY?
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musseldawg69So is the German remadie s from India the German one people are referenced on here
bigmurphNo speaking of the same thing made in Pakistan but is also made in Germany I know it's tough to tell what we're talking about but we're trying to follow the rules on this one if you want pm me and we can really discuss it
musseldawg69Edit ok yeah I know which brand y'all are talkin bout I thought the Indian ones were the same brand but now I see they are not haha sorry I was confused only because them indian ones look alot like the germans and say german on em , I found some real german ones
musseldawg69I Picked up Pakistani's and will be running em soon good thread big murph lots of good input here definitely want to try the Germans not to far down the road (I already have my next 2 cycles) but personally I dont care about oil thickness, amps being difficult, etc i want the one that puts the most weight on me , strength increases, retention after cycle, and less sides, excited to try both +1 but yeah it would make more sense that germans could engineer something better
bigmurphI have enough paki for my next 2 cycles myself but this is what I have learned is that the raw product used in the production of the oil is most likely the same strength or purity no matter where it comes from but the difference is where it's made they use the different oils glass and so on to meet the requirements of that region in Pakistan they wouldn't be able to afford the way it's made in Germany so they make it so it is price efficient for Pakistan that's why the glass and carrier oils are different but the raw product from what I'm reading is the exact same thing no matter where it comes from bayer holds that part to a certain standard but when it comes to the rest of the process it just varies by region
musseldawg69Ok that makes since I noticed the German is more expensive it's weird though cause my supplier has it under India pharmacy as German zydalas is this the same thing it's clear with white label 250mg/ml
bigmurphNo those are good test though but that's not the topic of discussion think what's the biggest pharmaceutical company in the world and they make test and metholone enanthate
bigmurphIs there a site anywhere that you can check the codes on the boxes for these items I haven't been able to find one. I never needed to because I know what I have is real but just wondering if companies like this have a way to do this like some of the ugly that get counterfeited all the time
bigmurphI just received the email that says they have received my question and have sent it to the proper department so hopefully I can get some information on this from the src
Dude first off I wouldn't get a damn thing from the middle east!
bigmurphWhy is that though I'm honestly curious is it because of the region or no trust for that area or just because you assume that it's fake?
I'm not trying to be a smart ass so please don't take this the wrong way but it's actually south Asia but I know what you meant
I wouldn't trust any region where they mostly chant death to America lol
bigmurphYeah I figured that was the reason and I have thought about that a lot. I src from someone who is no where near there but your right in the fact it still comes from there.
Something for me to definitely think about
What is the base product that you are concerned about? (Without mentioning the brand or manufacture). If you've said, I missed it and am sorry.
bigmurphI'm going to pm it to you
RustyhookerSo with the known rules you then post brands? Cmon dude.....
bigmurphSorry rusty I'm trying my best not to do that but my best isn't good enough I edited it I keep messing up in this one it's hard to discuss this without saying a company name
My bad I apologize
RustyhookerIts a spot where we know the brand simply by area noted. We're on same track bro...Thanks
bigmurphOkay I did some research on the pharmaceutical companies site and it says that the different countries that produce the products are separate entity's like the one in paki so from what I read I took it as that each branch of the company is responsible for the way they do things it's not actually one company that does things the same way around the world. I have sent them an email asking for more information so we shall see what they say about the matter.
Don't be fooled because it says it's pharma or it is a brand name. The fake and counterfeit drug business is a multi billion$ business. Much of this is state or gov sponsored. And yes, it gets into the supply chain and sold through pharmacies. Pakistan is known for this along with many other countries and all over Europe. This isn't the U.S you're talking about and you're not shopping walgreens.
As far as diffrrences in legit brands, that also holds true many times. There are different qualifications from region to region and it is almost impossible to make one drug that meets those qualifications in every little shithole corner of the world.
Think of it this way. An auto manufacturer makes cars for the UK and for the US. Same car, different emission standards for each country. Both cars are red. Don't be fooled, you won't be able to drive one of those cars in California (which has the highest standard in the U.S). VW just recently got got busted for falsifying tests regarding this same subject.
bigmurphThat's a great analogy of looking at it the way the same car is made in different parts of the world and this is basically what I just read that they all produce the products as they do to fit there standards
Everybody uses the terms anadrol, winstrol, primobolan, halotestin, equipoise, andriol, sustanon, etc, as generic terms, but these sre actually registered trademarked brand names.
When a ugl makes a version of these and calls it "deca", they are in fact just creating a generic version of these brand named drugs. It may have the active ingredient and be accurately dosed....or not.
The counterfeit market sets out to creste a product that can be passed off as a legit brand name product with correct packaging, dosing and ingredients. (same ingredients the ugl are using by the way). A passable copy cat.
Then you have counterfeits that are fake. No active ingredient or something substituted such as test so that the user will notice some kind of effect.
Both counterfeits and fakes wind up in pharmacies all over the world. There is plenty of info out there to substantiate, & if you don't believe it, walk into a pharmacy in a 3rd world country sometime. I knew a family that owned a string of pharmacies in mex. You would NOT believe the stuff that they do. But that's what happens in countries where crime and corruption permeate every level of society, law enforcement, and government.
bigmurphIt's very true I was in Mexico and in the tourist section of where I was they were selling metholone enanthate that was supposed to be the real deal from Turkey but I looked at it and could tell instantly it was counterfeit just from the box and they were getting way to much money for it and people were in there buying bulk amount of boxes and I was just shaking my head I wanted to say something to them but I wasn't about to step on some cartels toes and not make it back home.
Not beeng racist but whatever comes from, pakistan, Afghanistan, iraq etc, I just dont trust, I've tried enogh amps of both, German ones are better in feeling and everything, question for you guys, if it's pharma the amount of oil should be exactly the same right? I mean it distributed in amps by million dollar machine, then why with the pakis when you pull them you get 0.9cc, pull the Germans and get 1.2cc, also noticed that pakistani oil is thick, I'm my opinion German are even thicker, I use and 18 gauge to draw germans, took me only a 22 with pakis also German took clearly longer to pin, took me 3 and half minutes before it was all in, pakistani took about 1 minute and a half, Germans snap like butter, to open pakis you defenetly need an p opener, you realize how many times I've opened one them and I smashed the top part and some glass went in the bottom of the amp wich makes unusable, I only need 500mg of germans, need at least 3 amps of pakis of week 750mg a week, to get same results as Germans at 500, to finish presentation! !!! Not seeng the Arab wrightings just makes me feel better...
StevebI've ordered about 1000 of the Pakistani ampoules. Reading this really got me thinking. When I ordered the German ones were a lot more expensive so I went with the Pakistani. I'm going to give the German ones a try. Do you have a good source to recommend? Friend request sent.
bigmurphCompletely agree I've used both myself and I just don't get why both have same name and made by same company but are so different I guess the answer is like you said its from fcking Pakistan not Germany
The stuff from Paki that I had was pretty damn good. Haven't tried the same stuff from Germany so I can't say which was better but I would have a hard time believing I would be able to tell a difference. It is pharma for a reason -- quality control measures to ensure a consistent product dose and quality, regardless at which lab it is manufactured in.
The only way to satisfy your curiosity would be to send samples of the same product from different labs/countries to get tested analytically. Can't go off of just feel.
This is a better post of what I believe to be true...
bigmurphYeah makwa I've tried both and Italian is right the German ones are better the Pakistani ones are great I have them now but I'm curious as to why the company that makes them allows them to be different
How are they different?
bigmurphThe amps from Germany are easier to pop and are definitely made at a higher standard also the oil it self is thinner and I believe is stronger than the Pakistani ones the ones from Pakistan are also great I love them and will keep using them it's my favorite test but the carrier oil is really thick and the amps if you don't have a amp opener have a tendency to break if not opened perfectly.
The fact that I believe that the oil is stronger like you said earlier might just be in my head but I used the ones from Germany once and they were really good
Guess I'll have to get some Germany and see whats up.
musseldawg69X2 find out for myself im going to run these pakis first though I never had problems opening amps yet and dont expect to fr sent love to hear ur opinion when u do
quality control, in countries like turkey and pakistan I dont see the fda breathing down their necks making sure the facilities are up to par, pakistans getting blown up all the time i think most of the focus is on that and making sure they keep the country and economy afloat not that the large amount of pharmaceuticals where 99% are going to the black market are 100% up to all fda and USP standards. Whereas a 1st world country like Germany should have much tighter quality control standards. I remember seeing bloods on 750mgs of sust amps from Pakistan and based off the bloods they were greatly underdosed. Could they have been fakes? Sure something like 70% of the pharm grade stuff on the black market is fake so its not out of the question so you guess is as good as mine.
But we also need to keep in mind these are not all that complicated chemicals. If they are licensed to use the brand name they are probably at least attempting to maintain standards. I also would suspect even them countries have some entity in charge of making sure their pharma products are safe and up to snuff. But honestly I really wouldn't know.
bigmurphFrom what I read the actual raw material is set at a certain standard by the company then the other products used like carrier oil and type of glass used are up to the region to keep costs of product where that the people in that region can afford to buy the products
What about the wealthy families in those countries who get the best medical care available? I would think any medication they are receiving would be very up to par. You're correct about alot of the pharma stuff being fake on the black market but if it really was purchased at a legit pharmacy I would think it's 100% real. I don't know though and unfortunately any of us living in the USA probably will never have the full truth. This is a really interesting topic, I hope more people chime in here.
bigmurphI actually use to order my medicine from India that I have to take for my BP and anxiety because it was cheaper to order them through the mail and I believe that the ones I would get from India were better. Also I actually got for my ruptured bicep a medicine that is made in India shipped to the USA and sold through a major pharmacy a lot of medicine in the USA that are sold generically are shipped from India in raw powder and then just pressed in America
If it is a brand from a legit pharmaceutical company then I would beleive the product would be exactly the same regardless of which lab in which country it was produced. The big multi national companies will set up shop (labs) depending on numerous different factors such as cost of labour/equipment, availability I draws, legacy of where they find they have facilities due to M&A activity etc. The big boys are regulated and their production facilities are subject to inspection so I don't see them getting away with producing a different quality product depending on country where the lab is located. Clearly they want to produce the cheapest possible product at the end of the day as this is what determines their margins and revenue but given the nature of their business they can't really afford to have quality compromised. If they do the whole brand would loose its license.
I wonder how much of this is cultural bias? What I means is one expects a product from Pakistan to be worse than the one made in Germany therefore it is.
bigmurphI agree that they are held to the same standards by the who at all thier facilities but I believe that the german made is better than the Pakistan ones and another member said it and thats what was intriguing to me are the German oils really better or is it just the thought process of Germany makes better products than Pakistan and its all in my head
Would indeed be interesting to take these three products for an independent test to see the content, purity, oils, solvents etc. My money would be on them all being virtually identical or at least not that much different that a user would notice.
bigmurphIm willing to sacrifice an amp or 2 to a lab if another member would put up there's from another country
I would'nt imagine the quality would be any different. It could be circumstance. The regimen during a certain run as opposed to another...
bigmurphI agree that batch by batch from ugl may vary but this company should be on point every time being they are inspected by fda and w.h.o. right?
I was getting at the regimen from cycle to cycle(run) might be off...not the gear.
bigmurphI see now maybe your right on that it was at a time that I was really at my best when I had the German ones so you definitely could be right
X2 big guy...Isn't it amazing how every source has the best gear when that person is bulking and not starving themselves
Exactly...alot of times what is off in a cycle is the diet and lifting. There is a thought that AAS get you huge just by taking them.
It's all about money.
My guess is that while they are the same medicine, they are produced in a "pill factory" lab somewhere close to where they are being marketed/sold. The paki stuff was probably worse quality because they have less stringent pharmaceutical production standards/practices, and bottom line its cheaper for the pharma companies to make sub-par product where the regulations are lax.
bigmurphWouldn't the company we are talking about be held to a certain level by the w.h.o. and have to produce the same product