Area-1255's picture
Area-1255
  • 0
8343

+ 8 Androgens, Estrogens and Psychosis : Taking a Different Turn and a Stab at the Truth! (Androgens, Estrogens Dopamine 2018)

ad

As we've written in our article Androgens and Depression : Are they Nature's Intended Prozac - we know from science and Experience, that androgens have an anti-depressant effect - but its also possible, that in some cases Androgens may protect against Psychosis/psychotic behavior [1].

A study in 2013 noted that following androgen-deprivation "therapy" - many subjects developed Psychosis, including refractory Psychosis.

Of course, the picture is fairly complicated, we KNOW that Schizophrenia occurs more in Men, than Woman. From that and well-written articles like this one - it would seem Testosterone would be an anti-target.

Unfortunately - nothing is that simple; the same article also reviewed that while Testosterone in some cases facilitated development of Schizophrenia, it also protected against severe Cognitive deficits and ...when added to antipsychotic treatment, proved to reduce negative symptoms in a major way.

Additionally, there have been other studies showing Testosterone treatment improved Positive symptoms of Schizophrenia, as well. These of course, have been very few in comparison to the studies on its relevance to negative symptoms.

ESTROGEN AND PSYCHOSIS/SCHIZOPHRENIA

Estrogen is a whole 'nuther ball game when it comes to Schizophrenia. Not only have drugs like Raloxifene, which affects Estrogen receptors been proven to improve Cognitive and Mood symptoms in both Men & Women with Schizophrenia [2] but a large Review also indicated that Aromatase/Estrogen themselves have the largest role among all sex hormones in both the development of Schizophrenia and the course of it [3].

However - that role is exceptionally sophisticated given the multitude of differing study results...generally it seems that Estrogen plays a "protective" role - however, the excitotoxicity that can be achieved by Estrogen-dominance, may also precipitate Psychosis and / or worsen Schizophrenia symptoms [4]. Apparently, this is in part related to Estrogen's ability to weaken the immune system from viruses that may lead to degeneration of the Brain Regions involved in Schizophrenia [5].

Other studies have also noted that elevated Estrogen levels in Women associated with menstruation/ovulation are associated with Schizophrenic/Psychotic symptoms (positive association) - and thus, in some cases, SERMs can be used to block excessive estrogen-activity rather than utilizing other treatments.

Even if Low levels of Estrogen are generally a risk-factor for both the development of or the exacerbation of Schizophrenia [6] it is still prudent to note that excessive levels may cause a more severe form of it as well.

Since Estrogens can increase the general EXCITATION level of the nervous system...this can promote particularly dramatic presentations of Schizophrenia; where lability, Aggression, delirium are predominant symptoms.

SPECIFICS AND PHARMACOLOGY OF SEX HORMONES

Testosterone does not and is not capable of affecting the Brain neurotransmitters itself. It is only when it "converts" into its 5-Alpha-reduced metabolites; DHT and 3-alpha-diol that it can cross into the nervous system and exhibit effects on various aspects of neurochemistry [7].

The predominant effects of strong Androgens include.
Enhancement of GABA-release [8].
Increasing NMDA-glutamate receptors [9].
Decreasing serotonin levels/receptors [10].
Improving acetylcholine release [11].
Regulating norepinephrine/adrenaline [12].
None of these effects are exactly consistent with the prerequisites for development or exacerbation of Psychotic disorders in any form...but its possible that a functional imbalance between Androgens and Estrogens may lead to a "fluctuating" rather than excessive dopamine, state.

Those fluctuations may be particularly dramatic - especially in individuals with other risk factors.

Dihydrotestosterone and other Androgens also seem to promote neurogenesis (growth of new brain cells/synapses) - particularly in coordination with Exercise [13].

ESTROGEN'S ROLE

Estrogen has been found to have acute and chronic anti-dopaminergic effects [14] under certain conditions - however, it also can stimulate the Dopamine system in Humans [15] and inhibit the Dopamine transporter and its expression [16]. These effects along with the well-regarded research on Estrogens critical role in the male and female libido would seem to indicate that Estrogen can promote Dopamine activity [17].

Another review uncovered a critical role for Estrogen and Motivation in Humans and animals [18]. Suggesting again, a pro-dopaminergic role for Estrogen.

In light of these findings/reviews, it would seem that both sex hormones are well-capable of contributing to Psychotic symptoms - but the picture can get more complicated...since Schizophrenia also involves other neurotransmitters like Serotonin...to which is frequently ELEVATED in Schizophrenics [19].

ANDROGEN & ESTROGEN
ROLES IN SHORT-TERM PARANOID PSYCHOSIS

Up until this point we have evaluated primarily the role for Male and Female sex hormones in Schizophrenia and generally, Psychosis. What we haven't evaluated in detail, is their role in short-term bouts of Paranoia or stress-related Psychosis.

First - let's dive into a specific aspect of Paranoid Psychosis.
Paranoid Schizophrenics tend to have elevated Norepinephrine levels, also called Noradrenaline [20].
This is specific to them, since catatonic and typical Schizophrenics don't show this remarkable elevation...at least as often [21].
Anabolic-Steroid abusers tend to exhibit, out of all Psychotic symptoms, a disproportionate amount of Paranoia [22] - versus other symptoms such as Delusions or Hallucinations.
Paranoid personality traits often arise in long-term anabolic steroid abusers [23], probably related to the increase in Adrenaline and CNS activity caused by steroids...hence why powerful anabolic agents such as Tren and Deca raise blood pressure remarkably. Its the Adrenaline.
Estrogens on the other hand, at least in moderate amounts, tend to relieve/alleviate Paranoia [24].

****** CONCLUSIONS******

Although both Androgens and Estrogens can play positive, helpful roles in the treatment of Psychosis/Schizophrenia, it seems that on the whole, Estrogen seems more beneficial.

However - these studies showing such results should be interpreted with great caution - as high/elevated Estrogen is just as much a risk factor for ALL mental disorders.

In fact, because of the complicated relationship between Estrogen and immune activity - it may be overall worse for long-term Mental Health and specifically, BRAIN AGING, to have elevated Estrogen levels, regardless of possible ameliorative effects of Estrogen on Psychotic symptoms.

It is the conclusion AND responsibility of this article, and the Authors of this blog - to inform the Public that the correct interpretation of this information is that HORMONE BALANCE is the ideal state. That is, that neither a deficient level of Testosterone, other Androgens OR Estrogens is acceptable nor ideal - and can possibly promote multiple Psychiatric disorders; including Schizophrenia.

Therefore, to Bodybuilders, fitness enthusiasts - or just people interested in hormone health. It is recommended you frequently see a Doctor if you have some concerns about levels of sex hormones.
As always, follow the steps to get and stay healthy - such as eating right, optimizing macronutrient/micronutrient intake, cutting body fat and improving motivation levels.

If you do have a Low-Testosterone level, you can follow the suggestions in this article to boost it.
If you HIGH Estrogen - consider a natural supplement like 7-methoxyflavone - if that doesn't do the trick, Arimidex can be purchased at store name redacted for a good price. :-)
If you have LOW Estrogen/E2 levels, the best bet is to use something like Clomid along with a mild-gonadal agent like E-Pharm Test Force II - whose ingredients raise BOTH Testosterone AND Estrogen.

In/Tags: androgens and psychosis, androgens and psychosis 2018, estrogens and psychosis, taking a different turn, testosterone and psychosis 2018, research sex hormones and psychosis 2018, androgens and psychosis, androgens and psychosis 2018, androgens estrogens dopamine 2018, estrogens and psychosis, research sex hormones and psychosis 2018, testosterone and psychosis 2018,

giardap's picture

The natures prozac article was fake news. The mesterolone studies/trials of the 70s and 80s resulted in AAS not being used as anti-depressants. Still want to argue that because some androgens make us feel good??? OK then... 1 word: Trenbolone. Game set match, article was baseless fake news. As a reference point for this post it only serves to make this article baseless. This should have been approached on its own.

So that said, i read the first 7 paragraphs and followed the references 2 3 4 5. 2 was clearly an abstract surf and when you actually read the paper it says ralox (as an adjunctive treatment!!!) helps cognition but not schizo itself, not even the severity of symptoms. No mention of whether its estro or anti estro action being the driver. 3 doesnt support what you use it for. 4 is basically a lie (prenatal study and not about worsening schizo). 5 does not describe what you say it does. In fact it says estro doses in prenatal stages may influence receptor development (hypothesis).

I cannot read any more because this is completely fraudulent.... again...

I dont know why you post this stuff all over the web. Anyone who has done 5 minutes of real research in academia can see this stuff for what it is and it only serves to make you look stupid.

kibby's picture

I've said this for ages now mate......you will NEVER open your mouth unless your 100% certain and have proof to back anything you say up.

And in all honesty I love it when you rip these bullshit posts to bits with actual physical proof and science.

Sometimes I call you worse than shit because you make my head hurt lol. But before I know it I've been reading /studying for 5 hours straight and learning it all for myself.

Thanks mate (full homo) ;)

Owes a Review × 1
giardap's picture

oh and there are loads of decent ac/sci based research posts. Look at DfromPhilly's Berb post. Thats a great 1 in process.

giardap's picture

I read one of your posts which was actually a level headed post, you should have left it up. Yeah tren therapy, its all the rage in the psych wards now for manic depression (not!).
Its this simple Rusty, it's a fake news type article. There is nothing scientific/academic about it. Follow 1 reference and see that yourself. Its merely clickbait with shill links. Problem is, if someone with depression reads it and thinks yeah I will treat it with provi (or tren lol), they might end up like the guy in the original clinical trials who went nuts or just shut down and in a cycle of needing more or TRT. eRoids: safety first, no? Proliferating fake news?

Here is the thing Rusty, I've researched in academia at the 2nd highest level (next is a phd) in the top degree of its type. So I learned a small bit about research and analysis. My dissertation had novel research findings it too which was sorta cool (in a nerd way) and I was working on publishing until kiddo came along. That doesn't mean a single thing, other than this; I know how to read this stuff, follow the crumbs and see if it is real work. It's not. (the subjects might be valid to research / discuss, but its ruined by the work). Subjects like this deserve respect. Instead of you jumping to his defence and jumping against me, you should question; is what I have pointed out correct? Follow the info, it is correct.

giardap's picture

LMAO
I love that cycle! !

Pale's picture

I knew you would be along. Glad I never made it back to read it.

giardap's picture

Eep
(Runs for cover!)

Carlos Danger's picture

I know I’ve given you shit in the past but I wanna hug you so bad naked right now.

Carlos Danger's picture

I had zero intention on providing a single ion of intellectual propagation that Androgens and/ or estrogens relation to psychosis is conclusive. Your article is basically conjecture. You craft them to tip toe the line of conclusivity and conjecture. I would be totally fine with it if you presented it as conjecture. I would have actually posted some of my own personal experience and my first hand witness perspective on the topic. Also, after investing more time than I am proud to admit reading all of the links holding out hope for something conclusive I regret that I did not find anything.

So here is why I wanted to rub my uglies on G’s Fanny. I walked away feeling like it was click bait. I hit your site over and over and over and over and sent traffic that I wish I kept on Eroids. Imagine all of the other members who clicked on your site over and over and over and over and over again a and again and again. I regret that I played a sucker to a fancy click bait article. When I originally withheld my civilized discussion it was for the aforementioned sentiment. Click bait.
Now, I can admit G can be a snobby asshole and I’ve given him shit in the past for what I have observed as slight contempt for anyone he feels is beneath him intellectually. But i would never take away what i feel is his developed knowledge and experience with medical literature. He is a wealth of read knowledge. I personally don’t think he has much real life experience with AAS but perhaps I am mistaken. But his post was absolutely fucking hilarious. Take yourself out of the scenario. You must admit he is close to being spot on. Again if you crafted your post more clearly as conjecture I’d have a different take. Except, I do hold a deep personal hate for you and your click baitish ways good Sir.

Lastly, I didn’t literally want to hug him from behind naked. It’s just how Male heterosexuals who are comfortable with their sexuality tell each other that they like them. Only homosexuals fist bump or high five anymore. Like duh....

kibby's picture

So here is why I wanted to rub my uglies on G’s Fanny

Haven't laughed that hard for a long time

Owes a Review × 1
giardap's picture

LMAO

fucker!!

Come to Ireland, I'll buy you a beer, we'll get a gym session in, you can teach me how to steroid and I will disagree and read a book, you'll see I'm just argumentative, not snobby (no homo)

lol

Carlos Danger's picture

That’s a deal compadre!!

Gh0st's picture

Are you allowed to promote suppliers/brands in posts?

Also, where are your references that you’re siting?

Owes a Review × 1
Gh0st's picture

I did actually click the link to your blog and looked at just a handful of your latter references. Specifically 21-24. You’re really making mountains out of mole hills here man. I hope anyone reading this actually checks those references and understands research. What you actually need to prove cause and effect or even correlation... The references you site are pretty much worthless...

Owes a Review × 1
giardap's picture

Try find 1 single reference that actually supports anything it has been used to reference!!! (Hint: you wont!)

Gh0st's picture

Very true rusty. And you’re right. I definitely need to contribute some knowledge to everyone here. I’ve been around long enough now and this site has definitely contributed enough to my own growth. Time to give back. I’ll look for some things we’re missing and start a topic.

Owes a Review × 1
Sam I Am's picture

I agree but Ofcourse we all have different opinions. Would trt have helped The son of Sam? Probably not. Do I feel better when I wake up with a good one? Absolutely. Was it worth it? Ask me in twenty years.

Owes a Review × 1
Gh0st's picture

Can’t argue with that Sam. Only issue I bring up with this is at least in medicine there are varying opinions on some topics but research is the foundation we have to back up those opinions (theories).

To the OP- I did get some more time to review most of the other citations and several of them are absolutely legit studies that are well incorporated into your post. Some are still not. I see why you’re trying to do and I can still appreciate that.

Owes a Review × 1
fusebox's picture

Remove the source and brand names. How has no one said anything about this. Anybody actually read it?

Sam I Am's picture

Your right.

Owes a Review × 1
fusebox's picture

For once. I lost 50 some karma for negging this guy one time over something stupid. Wasn't doing it again lol. And by negging I mean like -50 or something. It was a bad day for me.

Sam I Am's picture

Shit happens. I didn’t even notice it. Good catch.

Owes a Review × 1
fusebox's picture

We've all had those days bro.

Gh0st's picture

Jinx! ;)

Owes a Review × 1
Sam I Am's picture

Still one up . Same paragraph.

Owes a Review × 1
fusebox's picture

Thank you.

Sam I Am's picture

I’m going to be the skeptic here. Let’s be honest we all have that friend that roid rages. I’ve noticed over the years these are the same guys that can’t drink without becoming Mr Hyde. I think it all comes down to personality traits. I think to try to apply this to a general group of people is a far stretch at best. People are just to different and unpredictable . No disrespect intended..+2

Owes a Review × 1
herpjunkie111's picture

Great article, very interesting information!

Pale's picture

I need to circle back and read this.

Bearded_muscle's picture

I skimmed but the findings look in line with what I’ve seen. Properly administered trt or hormone regulation can make a world of difference for mental stability and neuroprotection. This is the first time I’ve seen schizophrenia brought up though, and that is particularly interesting.

herpjunkie111's picture

I've been into competitive shooting sports for a while, and for a long time I loaded my own ammunition but ended up quitting for the reasons you mention above, many of the metals used in the reloading process are very toxic, so I decided to give that aspect up, not just for me, but to get all that stuff out of the house for the other inhabitant' s sake.