posted Tue, 12/15/2015 - 07:36
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-1 Powerlifting cycles?
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So I've decided to head more towards powerlifting right now,as id like to go to a meet,and see if i can compete in a Open show.(non tested).I know a few bodybuilders that were powerlifters first.My favorite company is ANIMAL and they have a athlete that is sponsored by them,Andrey malanichiev.Strong guy,highly motivational to watch!.So my question is what type of cycle do you think men of his caliber are on?(test,anadrol,deca).What kind of cycle is more geared towards powerlifting (strength,power,and mass).and do most powerlifters juice? or are they're some natty and some enhanced?
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I would imagine they use Deca, tren, and possibly orals like Anadrol/Dianabol a couple weeks out from the meet. The more serious guys will lay off the test as it causes tendon break down, or perhaps keep it at TRT levels. HGH is good for the tendons too - you know guys like Stan Efferding were big on HGH while powerlifting. Ed Coan was banned from IPF for Deca, and he is arguably the greatest PL ever, so..
Malaniciev is russian, I would not be surprised if he has the discipline to not use test at all and just run deca and maybe tren starting 16weeks out.
Powerlifters do not have sub 15% body fat. Powerlifters heavily rely on carbs for their diet.
Powerlifters train for max lifts in other words the max reps you will do are 5 per set at 90-100% 1RM.
Powerlifters wear all those wonderful wraps for a reason that you will find out after your 2nd week of real training.
Powerlifting takes a massive toll on your tendons and knees, one of the major reasons I gave it up.
Powerlifting is not so you can "ego" show off how much you can bench or deadlift but how much you can control it.
A good bench suit is going to cost you hundreds of dollars as well as the proper shoes, knee wraps, wrist wraps, e.t.c.
My cost for the suit, shoes, wraps was 1400.00.
You CANNOT skimp on those things because your tendons and muscles will pay the price your 1st meet if you make it that far. If you go to an unregged meet prepare to not finish in the 1st 20 at least 10 or more times because these guys will make you look.like an ant. My 1st trophy took me 12 shows and the only reason I won was the guy before me ripped his bicep tendon from bad form and no suit.
Wow,as unbiased,and honest,and somewhat discouraging as all that was..lol...im still determined to try and powerlift,and see what i can accomplish,i dont expect to be like my idols (Andrey Malanichev,Dan greene) but id like to just compete,and see what i can do in the sport.and just train..thank you for the info! so are you saying to rely more on carbs as a powerlifter? if you look at the big guys,in all honesty i want size to back up my lifts..if that makes sense..so i guess i have to eat a lot...i weigh 200lbs at 5'7..I've been doing nothing but bodybuilding..but I've wanted to switch as ive fell in love with squats and deadlifts..suck at bench :/...and i just like picking up heavy ass weight lol! and i understand..looking at the price costs..hmm in all honesty irish,and rest of crew,what do you guys think...standard in gym when training,i just wear my sweats,tshirt,converse,knee wraps,and a belt,and chalk...am i missing anything?..ive been doing my research...but i think there is a local powerlifting gym here in my state/city..might go there.
I need to interfere! Sorry Irishmack, but I absolutely have to disagree with nearly all you've said. This is simply the reason why people still think powerlifters are fat fucks who squeeze themselfes into lifting gear....not true at all!
So, what you want to achieve is to find your sweetspot with BF% and strength performance. Some will have a lower setpoint then others. What I mean is, the lower your BF% the more likely it is that your performance will suffer. Still you want to carry as much LBM as possible. There's absolutely no reason to go beyond 15% BF unless you're in the open weightclass, which won't make much sense with your height. With 5'7 you'll most likely be the most competitive in the 90kg/198lbs weightclass. It seems, that the common sweetspot is at 12-15% where people perform the best and still have a fairly low bf%. Still, there are more than enough people with lower bf%.
With that said, you'll probably have the best height/weight ratio and BF/performance. From there on, make adjustments to your needs. Ie. someone like Josh Hancott is usually "too tall" for the 165lbs. weightclass, still he breaks all the records. So in which weightclass you'll be the most competitive in, comes in the end down to you.
Coming to gear. Unless you want to compete in equipped powerlifting, there's absolutely no need to get some. Further you're really relyand on training partners, because it's so hard to get in and out of it. I'd recommend of starting RAW. This means, weightlifting belt. More is seriously not needed. With time and experience, it will make sense investing in stuff like decent shoes, wrist wraps, kneesleeves and if you're going to compete RAW w/ wraps, knee wraps. BUT LET ME REPEAT IT ONE MORE TIME....IT'S NOT NECESSARY!!
So, in the end I want you to check out some people just to set your mind right again. I'll include people from different weightclasses, all competing raw and in the IPF (drug tested devision)
-Jesse Norris (holds records in two weightclasses with his record in the 198lbs weightclass...mofo!!...and totally ripped.)
- Layne norton, Randy Zhou, Josh Hancott, Brett Gibbs, Volodymyr Rysiyev, Brad Loomis
Other division;
- Amit sapir, Chris Duffins, Andrej Mostovenko
In the end I want to quickly say, that there's a common believe that powerlifters needs lots of carbs. It only really depends on how you train. If you train high volume or you're in a hypertrophy block, then yes, there's a higher demand of carbs but the more you go down with intensity, the less you really need carbs. Would it be optimal to eat low carb? Definitely not, but there's a screwed image of what a powerlifter really needs.
This is what Mike Israetel is recommending. Of course, dependant on how you function and if you're gaining or losing weight make adjustments to your needs. I think, this is a really good guideline which also is similar to recommendations of other nutritionists;
Think this should be enough for now.
Good points but remember I was a powerlifter that competed, I went to a ton of events and met some great people in the sport. The leaner I was the lower weight class of course but my lifts suffered tremendously. I never said all powerlifters are fat, 20% and below is where they are and those numbers are far from overweight. Carbs are a major diet because it is about raw power and strength, not endurance. You are not doing 1RM's more then 1 time in less then 30 seconds. I watched guys eat 20 chicken nuggets an hour before a show with a couple scoops of peanut butter. The training routine you posted is not for a competitive powerlifter because that is based on endurance and off training to stay in shape.. Anything over 6 reps per bodypart will build size, anything below at 85 to 90% 1RM will build strength. If you also say wraps are not necessary you never competed and you never did a 30 day real powerlifter routine. They do no wraps on comp day is there own choice but I never saw Ed Coan ever not wrap up before a show. Go to a real Powerlifter gym, go to a few shows and see what they do, what they eat, what they wear. Stop watching youtube videos that are edited to glamorize it. Im not taking away from it because it is a true measure of how far you can push your body and reaching its limits but there is more risk involved then bodybuilding because you are constantly trying to punish your tendons and muscles with adding weight every week to 2 weeks of at least 10-20 pounds.
I really thought about if I even write an answer because it seems to me like you're someone who's so convinced about your way of thinking that no matter what I would say and how much proof I'd show you, you'd still stay at your opinion, which is fair enough, that's why I keep it shortand leave you with your way of thinking.
. I never posted any routine. What I posted was a real recommendation for carb intake and an example what light,medium, hard workouts look like
Ed coan competed in wraps because he was in a fed with wraps....there are different Feds with different rules...but I guess you did now that, right? Ray Williams, you heard of him?
I never did a powerlifting routine? Well, I only ever trained powerlifting...nah, just pulled 3times bw, but what do I know about strength.
And well, yes, I was only recently in lauchhammer and salo...guess this wasn't a real competition then.
You need to train above 85-90% of 1rm to become strong....well seems like sheiko did it all wrong the whole time. Maybe you should tell him
chicken nuggets and peanut butter isn't really high carb...just as a sidenote
Seems like we have totally different opinions on that topic. So let's agree to disagree and stop here. I don't want to get into a fight which doesn't lead somewhere. Sorry mack, definitely no offense and please don't take it the wrong way
No offense taken, we agree to disagree but maybe we are both not looking at the entire picture and just a slideshow. We are right and wrong. I wasnt trying to win an argument but to show 2 sides.
chicken nuggets and peanut butter is not carbs, its fat, why would someone eat that before a comp?
Agree with you. Really didn't want to make a big deal out of it. I'd love to argue with you about it but this would bomb the whole thread. Let's safe it for another time ;)
Haha, okay. I thought you meant it in the context of talking about carbs ;)
Wow okay! Good read! I had to re read it all,I'm very new to powerlifting and the strength game!.Im still trying to figure out how to set up a powerlifting routine,until I can get into this powerlifting gym in my city...I understand now what you are saying..But I thought powerlifters eat alot of food,and don't really carb cycle? Or is that a misconception?...And yes! I want to go RAW because think it will be a great achievement for myself to lift RAW...and yes I've seen Norris..another ANIMAL athlete
sorry I love Animal...Anyways I will look at the other guys as well,I watch alot of Russian powerlifting because I just love my culture,and Russians are strong powerlifters!..I just didn't know that you can do it naturally!....See I'm learning everyday! I'm just here to learn and get as much help as possible!...Thank you!
To be honest bro nobody's going to give you sample cycle that pl use .Everyone has different cycle they use best thing to do find a pl train with them become a student go from there good luck on your journey
The question ahould be "what type of training and food intake does he do"? Cycles dont make the powerlifter. Youre looking at it ass backwards.
I agree with you..i said earlier,that food intake and training are most important..gear is just icing on the cake...i just was curious as with powerlifting can you do it naturally.
im 24,but thats besides the point lol..i started training at 14,had a man who competed in russia teach me how to lift,and that eating and sleep was more important then supplements.had a few year break due to the service...now im state side..working a good job..looking to get my feet wet in powerlifting,i love bodybuilding.but i admire the men who can deadlift/bench/squat heavy ass weight,my favorite is deadlift...I'm 5'7,200lbs at 13%bf..i was 217lbs at over 16% but i recently had my appendix removed.now im fully rehab,and stronger then ever..my first cycle was testosterone enanthate at 375.mg a week for 12 weeks,and dianabol 60mg for my first 4 weeks.with arimadex .25mg e3d.and or when needed..following by proper pct..my starting weight was 190.i finished off at 213lbs,then a month later surgury.
Sorry, but I'll not be the one leaning out the window, given a sub25 year old gear and cycle advice.
Feel free to find all the information you need on this forum and educate yourself but I guess no one will give you concrete advice to gear usage.
That being said, not all powerlifters juice. Look at the IPF contestants. Of course, there will probably be some who used gear outside the competition time frame I know personally, that the drug testing is not always super reliable but saying all are on juice ignorant for the work they are putting in. Further Greg Nuckols did a great article about the differences in "enhanced" vs. "non-enhanced" lifters and when it comes to the elite level, the distinction between the achievements and lifters are only marginal and still there are lifters who are drug testet (several times) and still beat the enhanced lifters. You can achieve a lot without the usage of steroids and a lot of people are proofing it right now! The more attention the sport gets, the more commonly freaks like for example "jessie norris" will appear and all people will think he used steroids because they haven't seen anything like that before. The standards for strength will rise in the next couple of years due to the rise in popularity and more people getting into the sport who otherwise never would have known their potential in that field.
What I'm trying to say is, when you seriously want to start powerlifting, start with making good progress in the next couple of years and see if you still want or need to take some stuff. You can get super far without the usage of gear.
I agree with you,and yea i know,but im not gonna lie and say im 25 when im not yet for another 5 months,i only have one full cycle under my belt.I was just curious as to what a powerlifters cycle would look like,along with the nutrition of a powerlifter,compared to the rice/chicken/eggs/oats bodybuilding diet I've been following for years now to get to where im at so far with my physique...I dont disagree with you at all,because i know that nutrition,rest,and hard work are far more important.because without those 3,cycling is a waste of money and time..The guys i follow in the powerlifting scene are guys like Dan Greene and Andrey M,and alot of russian powerlifters.These guys are beasts..i assume just hard ass work..alottt of food.and good genetics huh?....I also would like to no your output on legal supplements..i know alot of it is garbage..But i always take my Animal pak.(multi v) and animal omega (fish oil)...some whey protein..bcaas.and maybe a pre workout..but nothing else really...but i was smart about my first cycle that i had recently finished up..The only concern was the doctor told me elevated red blood count...But none the less,i continue to eat alot,and sleep alot.and train hard.Thanks bro.
Fair enough and I can totally see the frustration in it. But this are simply the rules to not give any gear related advice towards sub25 year old people. Sorry for that.
There's a saying "Eat like a bodybuilder, train like a powerlifter" This holds really true. You really don't need to eat rice/chicken/eggs/oats and this stuff if you don't like it. For me, I love eating that way, simple as that. Anyway, you can still be more flexible around diet. That doesn't mean you should eat junk all the time, cause it's a widespread myth that powerlifters are fat or similar. The lower in weightclasses you get, the more jacked the people are because you want to hold as little fat as possible, while still performing the best. For some this setpoint might be lower then for others. That means, if you're satisfied with your physique, I don't see a reason for getting fat or similar. Stay that way and build your routine more towards strength. If you have a good base of muscle mass, it'll be easier to get stronger quickly.
Supplements are just what the name claims them to be, a supplementation to your diet. This is why I'm not the biggest fan of getting fancy supplements because think about it that way, the supplement industry is a huge market which needs new products to keep the crowd interested. This leads to products, which are the same as others but claim to be something special. Waste of money in my opinion.
If you want to supplement, the most fundamental supplements are the basics like;
- Fishoil (EPA/DHA)
- Minerals as Zinc, Magnesium
- Vitamins (especially D)
- Whey. Yes whey! No need for BCAA unless you train fasted. Otherwise you get plenty of BCAA with whey by a much less price.
And just an opinion from my side. Even though all your idols are at ANIMAL, doesn't mean that the products they're selling are any more effective or different to other products. I try to buy my supps in a pure form and not from any fitness industry related companies. In the long run I already saved looooots and lots of money.
Man, I've written such a long text until I had a look at your stats. Weird that everyone is 25...
Anyway, can you give us an idea of your cycle and training background?